Aron's 3PDT Wiring vs Phillip's 3PDT Wiring?

[formerMember1]

hi,
I was wondering if there is any advantage to wiring your 3PDT switch with the input and output on the either sides, instead of having them right next to each other.  I know it is best to keep input and output wires apart, but any advantage for doing that with the switch?

If you are  :roll:  by what i mean, then here:

on the top left lug Aron wires the input on the top right lug aron wires output, the middle top lug is power for LED or whatever.

others wire top left lug with input and middle lug with output and right lug with power, such as Fuzzcentral's.

thanks :wink:

The reason i ask is because i am building 2 pedals from fuzzcentral, so wondering if i should just use his wiring for a 3PDT , or follow Aron's wiring for a 3PDT, like i always do.  thanks again

[cd]

Better to do it the way shown on Fuzzcentral.  If one throw goes bad, the pedal will still work, albeit without true bypass (i.e. you can at least finish the gig).  With the more common way, (with the common of the switch going to output and input jacks) if one throw goes bad, only on or off will work.

[formerMember1]

sounds good my friend, thanks :wink:

[aron]

I put the power in the center of the switch to allow more separation between the input and output wires. This is somewhat helpful for higher gain circuits.

[formerMember1]

oh,  I'll have to do it that way then with the fuzzface,

thanks aron

[analogmike]

I put the power in the center of the switch to allow more separation between the input and output wires. This is somewhat helpful for higher gain circuits.

THere is a reason that this is not good practice.

hint - when this problem arises, pedals AFTER this pedal will POP when switched.

Took me a long time to figure it out, maybe some of you are smarter.

[aron]

This is very interesting. I haven't noticed this.

So somehow the switch is physically different so that using the first two sets of lugs is better than using the outer two?

This would mean that if you use the outer two sets of lugs the pedal leaks DC more than the first two? Is that what you found?

Or is the 2nd pedal popping because of another reason?

[aron]

Can someone else confirm that simply using the two outer lugs is different than using the first two sets of lugs?

I could understand switching with input grounding (when bypassed) but I can't see how using the first two lugs vs. the outer two affect a second pedal.

[zachary vex]

it might have something to do with where the wires end up (which of them are close to each other) when the switch is wired a certain way.  it could have something to do with the throws having long teeter-totter arms on them, making them more capacitive than the poles.

[analogmike]

You are quick, Aron!

Yes, it's a DC leakage problem. Any pole can leak to the adjacent pole. So try to minimize this by wiring the switch carefully. Having the power in the middle doubles the probability of a leakage problem.

[formerMember1]

that seems to be true analog mike, cuz sometimes my fuzzface pops when my rangemaster is before it, i thought it was just because of the rangemaster circuit or something,  I switched it the way you said and it fixed it.

thanks man :wink:

[zachary vex]

You are quick, Aron!

Yes, it's a DC leakage problem. Any pole can leak to the adjacent pole. So try to minimize this by wiring the switch carefully. Having the power in the middle doubles the probability of a leakage problem.

leakage through the solder flux residue?

[analogmike]

You are quick, Aron!

Yes, it's a DC leakage problem. Any pole can leak to the adjacent pole. So try to minimize this by wiring the switch carefully. Having the power in the middle doubles the probability of a leakage problem.

leakage through the solder flux residue?

Never thought to wash off the flux and test... but I thought it was the actual switch leaking internally. If anyone has a pedal that causes pedals after it to pop when off, please try washing off the flux on the switch and see if that helps.

[aron]

If it pops, DC should be measurable.

[analogmike]

If it pops, DC should be measurable.

A DC voltage was measureable with a digital VOM at the output of the effect. I saved some of the BAD switches before I came up with the rewiring solution. But testing them shows no resistance or capacitance between the offending points. Very odd. I checked and no solder flux on these switches lugs that I can see.

[aron]

That is too strange. Also, if you think about it, you are reversing the position of the power and the output wires, but using the same lugs. This would mean that if it was the switch, it would still do the same thing (for the output) since all you are doing is swapping the lugs but using the same wires etc...

All that is happening is taking the output wires and moving it one lug to the "left" and moving the power to the "right" but using the same set of lugs that are supposed to be causing the problem.

[formerMember1]

i dont know, for me i like to run my guitar>RM>Fuzzface > to amp

i used to get the fuzzface popping when switched and i thought that i needed Pulldown resistors in the fuzz, but wasn't sure.  But when analog mike posted to the thread i thought i might as well try it.  So i did.  It stopped my fuzzface from popping.  

Okay, before i changed the switch, the fuzzface never popped if i went Guitar>Fuzzface>RM>amp

I'll switch the wires back to the old way if you like and let you know the verdict?  :wink:

[analogmike]

That is too strange. Also, if you think about it, you are reversing the position of the power and the output wires, but using the same lugs. This would mean that if it was the switch, it would still do the same thing (for the output) since all you are doing is swapping the lugs but using the same wires etc...

All that is happening is taking the output wires and moving it one lug to the "left" and moving the power to the "right" but using the same set of lugs that are supposed to be causing the problem.

Actually I now use a totally different wiring method than any of those two versions. Initially used the version with two angled / / jumpers (input and
ground for board input and LED) then came up with a new method which isolates the problem lugs from LED voltage when OFF.

Now that the problem is clear, you can come up with many ways to avoid it.

[gaussmarkov]

If it pops, DC should be measurable.

this is good to know.  and this thread is really interesting to me.  popping in simple looper wiring is common and, as i understand it, avoidable.

[aron]

Now that the problem is clear, you can come up with many ways to avoid it.

hmmm the problem is not clear to me yet. I'm not sure it's "leakage" between the lugs... This is all too strange at this point without measurable results.