Recommend any vicious distortion pedals?

[sonic2spam]

    Hi,

I just finished building Mark Hammer's "The Crank", and I was wondering if anyone out there could recommend any high-gain distiortion pedals to build? I am someone who likes to play thrash and doom metal, and I would like to build something that would have a very saturated, overdriven sound. Preferably something that also has good sustain and would have  good tone for solos.

After reading some older posts, I have found that DR BOOGEY or the ZAKK WYLDE OD would probably suit my needs. Since I'm still a beginner though, I don't think that the DR BOOGEY would be something that I could actually make just yet. That said, has anyone here built and tested the ZAKK WYLDE OD? I'd like to hear some reviews and/or soundclips if possible.

  Thanks!!!   

[foxfire]

check out 4ms pedals. http://www.4mspedals.com/duo.php?mode=sound. i just built their fuzz jade which is half of the duo. it reminded me of an old sunn model t. i changed some values and added a blend. i haven't played it through my sound city yet, but it makes my little peavey sound like it's dying. in that good doomy sort of way of course. it's definitely not just another muff pedal.

[ambulancevoice]

if you want to do doom metal, make a big muff (probably the green russian version)
thrash id say the dr boogie or a bsiab with a boost pre driving it

[96ecss]

I have a friend who has the Zakk Wylde OD. It's really not high gain at all in my opinion. If you use it to push a cranked, already overdriven tube amp, like Zakk does, you can get high gain. But I don't think you'd be happy with it by itself. If you're not confident enough to build the Dr. Boogey, try the SLO Century kit from OLC. http://www.olcircuits.com/olc_slowcentury.html Since it comes as a complete kit, it would probably be pretty easy to build.

Dave

[soulsonic]

I give a second thumbs up to the Green Big Muff for doom sounds - it's thick and evil. I think the Slow Century would probably be a good choice for thrash. I play alot of thrash style music and I get the perfect sound with the SloClone amp I built, so it's definitely gonna put your tone in the right spot. But only reservation is that I haven't seen a schematic of the Slow Century, so I can't say how it compares to a SLO circuit-wise. I would like to build one just to see how the sound compares, but I'm not into buying kits - is there a schematic available? I tried looking around but I couldn't find it.

[sonic2spam]

I give a second thumbs up to the Green Big Muff for doom sounds - it's thick and evil. I think the Slow Century would probably be a good choice for thrash. I play alot of thrash style music and I get the perfect sound with the SloClone amp I built, so it's definitely gonna put your tone in the right spot. But only reservation is that I haven't seen a schematic of the Slow Century, so I can't say how it compares to a SLO circuit-wise. I would like to build one just to see how the sound compares, but I'm not into buying kits - is there a schematic available? I tried looking around but I couldn't find it.

I hear what you're saying about the kit. I don't like to be spoonfed either. I like to do things basically from scratch, so buying a kit isn't really an option for me. I'll try looking for different schematics of the pedals that have been mentioned here, and I'll let you guys know how it goes.

[ambulancevoice]

I give a second thumbs up to the Green Big Muff for doom sounds - it's thick and evil. I think the Slow Century would probably be a good choice for thrash. I play alot of thrash style music and I get the perfect sound with the SloClone amp I built, so it's definitely gonna put your tone in the right spot. But only reservation is that I haven't seen a schematic of the Slow Century, so I can't say how it compares to a SLO circuit-wise. I would like to build one just to see how the sound compares, but I'm not into buying kits - is there a schematic available? I tried looking around but I couldn't find it.

I hear what you're saying about the kit. I don't like to be spoonfed either. I like to do things basically from scratch, so buying a kit isn't really an option for me. I'll try looking for different schematics of the pedals that have been mentioned here, and I'll let you guys know how it goes.

in that case id go with the dr boogey for thrash sounds
its like the slow century (a amplifier adapted into a distortion stompbox)
there are two versions of the dr boogey layout
the Gaussmarkov (or whatever, i cant remeber) layout and the Bucksears layout

plus, both sloc and dr.b have alot of knobs

[GREEN FUZ]

I can`t speak for the DIY version but if the Zakk Wylde is anything like the commercial one, avoid.

[soulsonic]

So there isn't a public schematic for the Slow Century? Well then, I guess I'll just have to design my own SLO style distortion box. I think I'm qualified, considering I've designed a full amp kit for a real SLO style amp.
Yeah, I'll do it. We'll see.... hopefully it won't take too long, it shouldn't be much of a problem - I have the ins and outs of the original amp schematic burned into my consciousness.

Now we have to come up with a decent name.

[GREEN FUZ]

How about Sloclone?

EDIT: Just re-read the previous posts. So the Slow Century is a pedal version of the Soldano 100?

[96ecss]

How about Sloclone?

EDIT: Just re-read the previous posts. So the Slow Century is a pedal version of the Soldano 100?

Yes the SLO Century is supposed to be a Soldano SLO100 in a pedal, just like the Dr Boogie is a Dual Rectifier in a pedal. It's a design of the guy who runs OLC who happens to be a member here so there is no schematic for it here.

I don't like kits either, so I haven't built one. I like the sound clips on the OLC site, really heavy and great for Metal. The real Soldano SLO is a great sounding amp with the gain turned down too. I'd be interested in hearing the pedal on lower gain settings.

Dave

[Mark Hammer]

The Crank, or just about any boosted signal of that amplitude, will extract more tortured sounds from almost any distortion box.  Hell, you could probably make the venerable TS-808 sound nasty if you fed it a hot enough signal.  Remember, the "secret" to serious fuzz is how much gain is applied overall before the signal hits whatever it is that does the clipping.  Sometimes that gain is situated all within one little aluminum box (for our convenience), and sometimes it is distributed between several boxes.  Ultimately, though, its just gain applied.  No need to place all your faith or focus in single-pedal solutions.

Of course, another important aspect of "tortured" or vicious sounds is the EQ-ing.  Often that consists of big bottom, unconstrained top, and no mids.  The mid-scoop filter found in the Superfuzz and so many other pedals is a pretty nicely-voiced filter for achieving that with a minimum of parts and effort.  Provided the pedal has enough output level to survive the passive loss from that, you can "sicken" just about any pedal by inserting that or a similar filter on the output.

[B Tremblay]

It's a design of the guy who runs OLC who happens to be a member here so there is no schematic for it here.

From the OLC Slow Century page: "The Slow Century is based on the mighty Soldano SLO-100 amplifier and adapted for use as a distortion pedal. This is the second circuit to be offered exclusively by OLC, meaning that you won't find it anywhere else online. This circuit was initially developed by runoffgroove.com, and refined by OLC over several months. The Slow Century supersedes the discontinued Dual Rec project... after all, Mesa/Boogie borrowed from the SLO-100 when developing its Dual Rectifier (or so the story goes). Please keep in mind that, as stated on the home page, OLC does not focus on sales pitches - but on customer service instead. The other kits have sold themselves and I think that these will, too. However, please don't hesitate to ask questions."

[96ecss]

It's a design of the guy who runs OLC who happens to be a member here so there is no schematic for it here.

From the OLC Slow Century page: "The Slow Century is based on the mighty Soldano SLO-100 amplifier and adapted for use as a distortion pedal. This is the second circuit to be offered exclusively by OLC, meaning that you won't find it anywhere else online. This circuit was initially developed by runoffgroove.com, and refined by OLC over several months. The Slow Century supersedes the discontinued Dual Rec project... after all, Mesa/Boogie borrowed from the SLO-100 when developing its Dual Rectifier (or so the story goes). Please keep in mind that, as stated on the home page, OLC does not focus on sales pitches - but on customer service instead. The other kits have sold themselves and I think that these will, too. However, please don't hesitate to ask questions."

I didn't mean any disrespect to you guys at ROG. I think your work is awesome. I had forgotten that it started with your design. Sorry about that. And as for not having a schematic for it, I don't have any problems with that. I wasn't trying to start another one of those schematics threads. Someone had asked if there was a schem and I was just pointing out that there isn't one available.

Dave

[blindsjc]

I think that blackfire is a good choice for thrash.
I use mine with lots of bass and treble, mid at zero.
Before a tonemender in Marshall tonestack style
is pure explosion. Very good.

[B Tremblay]

I didn't mean any disrespect to you guys at ROG. I think your work is awesome. I had forgotten that it started with your design. Sorry about that. And as for not having a schematic for it, I don't have any problems with that. I wasn't trying to start another one of those schematics threads. Someone had asked if there was a schem and I was just pointing out that there isn't one available.

None taken!  I was simply clarifying a bit.

[petemoore]

  Transistor or OA, starved for headroom..
  The Punisher to the power supply of some other dirtbox.
  Starved transistor thing like  Mosrite.
  or a Ge booster biased near one rail driving fuzz.
  Fairly simple one trick pony's can be cajoled into making a trick complex sounding, everything from slightly distorted compression to output drops ['attack ducking'], various frequency specific waveform disruptions and distortions, and inability to do polyphony...stuff like that, maybe even a touch of 'accidental' octave etc., many of these type sounds can be heard with a 'carefully misbiased' signal circuitry.
 

[soulsonic]

Okay, hold on there just a minute guys...... So far, I've seen at least two of you say that you need to scoop the mids for a good thrash tone. NO WAY, NEVER! Scooped mids sound terrible. I haven't scooped my mids for over 11 years and I'm never going back to that awful tone. Scooping mids is totally bush-league kids stuff. One of the only "thrash" albums I ever heard with drastically scooped mids that worked is "And Justice For All", and the only reason it works there is because the whole mix is so weird (no bass, etc..). I play live all the time and scooped mids never ever sound good in a live setting when you're playing loud. Your tone gets completely lost and muffled and solos are completely nonexistent. The only time it ever sounds halfway cool is when you're in your bedroom playing quietly by yourself. Drums (especially cymbals) totally kill the scooped-mid guitar sound. That stuff went out with the 80's

And regarding the SLO: A big part of the overdrive that circuit gets is the biasing. The third stage of the overdrive channel is biased really cold with alot of voltage on the grid; this keeps all the overdrive from the previous stage from pushing the grid too far positive. That's part of what keeps it from having a mushy sound. I see all these JFET circuits with trimpots on the drains and instructions to "adjust until it's about 4.5v on the drain" - that's fine for most things, but when you're mimicking a circuit that utilizes cold biasing to create an "overload headroom", it totally throws off what's supposed to be going on if you're manually adjusting the biasing somewhere else to an arbitrary point. Also, these treble cut "presence" controls I'm seeing aren't entirely appropriate either, because that's not how they work in the original amps. It has to be done in a negative feedback loop to get the right kind of sound - or it could maybe work as a treble cut if you have the treble boosted more than usual in the previous stages, so if it's turned all the way down, you get the "normal" amount of treble. I don't see this in the Dr Boogie, so it's probably not in the Slow Century either.

So, yes, I'm definitely going to start on my own design for a SLO-inspired pedal. People seem to like the Dr Boogie, so I guess it probably sounds fine, but it's not enough for me, there's too many things about the circuit I don't like. I'm starting on the design right now and we'll see what happens. One thing is for sure; it's not necessarily going to be a bunch of JFETs. JFETS can get some really cool sounds, but overall they don't quite get what I'm looking for with this pedal. The final thing design will likely be a mixed bag of several transistor types.

[blindsjc]

Mids down are not law, just love my blackfire this way,
but the knob is there to be used, so, use it your way.

Tool and Opeth have great sound without scoop, and
I love them too. Thanks.

[sonic2spam]

Okay, hold on there just a minute guys...... So far, I've seen at least two of you say that you need to scoop the mids for a good thrash tone. NO WAY, NEVER! Scooped mids sound terrible. I haven't scooped my mids for over 11 years and I'm never going back to that awful tone. Scooping mids is totally bush-league kids stuff. One of the only "thrash" albums I ever heard with drastically scooped mids that worked is "And Justice For All", and the only reason it works there is because the whole mix is so weird (no bass, etc..). I play live all the time and scooped mids never ever sound good in a live setting when you're playing loud. Your tone gets completely lost and muffled and solos are completely nonexistent. The only time it ever sounds halfway cool is when you're in your bedroom playing quietly by yourself. Drums (especially cymbals) totally kill the scooped-mid guitar sound. That stuff went out with the 80's

And regarding the SLO: A big part of the overdrive that circuit gets is the biasing. The third stage of the overdrive channel is biased really cold with alot of voltage on the grid; this keeps all the overdrive from the previous stage from pushing the grid too far positive. That's part of what keeps it from having a mushy sound. I see all these JFET circuits with trimpots on the drains and instructions to "adjust until it's about 4.5v on the drain" - that's fine for most things, but when you're mimicking a circuit that utilizes cold biasing to create an "overload headroom", it totally throws off what's supposed to be going on if you're manually adjusting the biasing somewhere else to an arbitrary point. Also, these treble cut "presence" controls I'm seeing aren't entirely appropriate either, because that's not how they work in the original amps. It has to be done in a negative feedback loop to get the right kind of sound - or it could maybe work as a treble cut if you have the treble boosted more than usual in the previous stages, so if it's turned all the way down, you get the "normal" amount of treble. I don't see this in the Dr Boogie, so it's probably not in the Slow Century either.

So, yes, I'm definitely going to start on my own design for a SLO-inspired pedal. People seem to like the Dr Boogie, so I guess it probably sounds fine, but it's not enough for me, there's too many things about the circuit I don't like. I'm starting on the design right now and we'll see what happens. One thing is for sure; it's not necessarily going to be a bunch of JFETs. JFETS can get some really cool sounds, but overall they don't quite get what I'm looking for with this pedal. The final thing design will likely be a mixed bag of several transistor types.

I think it's nothing short of amazing that you're going to make your own pedal based on the SLO.

I'd be very interested to see how your project goes and what kind of sounds it will produce. Please, do keep me and everyone else here posted on how things go for you. I think I'll wait until your project is finished before I make a final decision of what to build. 

Very cool man, VERY cool!!!