Looking for a defined palm-mute sound

[mnordbye]

I'm on a quest to find my own high-gain tone at the moment, as my band ( http://www.myspace.com/groteskthrash ) finally is becoming a serious business. I've built a good share of distortions and fuzzes, and tried a zillion others on the breadboard, but none are just perfect. Don't take me wrong, i like the tone of mostly all om them (just love the tone control in Mark Hammer's Chaos, thanks man!).

The problem is, none of them does the job when it comes to making a defined palm-mute sound. I don't know any other words to describe what i mean, but that says most of it i guess..

So, what should i do to make my distortions have more defined (sharp??) palm-muting sounds? Anyone have any suggestions for tweaks? Preferably, i'dd be very happy for any general mods, circuits or tricks which can be added to any pedal, because i have many good sounding distortions which is waiting for me to tweak 'em!

Gain is no problem though, i always have boosters for that. 

If any not general mods are available, my main candidate for a metal/high-gain pedal is The Chaos, but i have others too who can do the job if modded.

Magnus Nordbye

[MikeH]

I know the sound you speak of.  Many high gain pedals (the z vex bor comes to mind) sound great when strumming or picking notes, but when you go to get that chunky palm mute sound they go to mush.  I've had great results following something fuzzy high gain like a Rat or a dist+ with something that has a well defined crunch like a TS or a Zakk Wylde overdrive (with plenty of noise suppression, of course  ).  Still really distorted but well defined with plenty of chunk.  Although perhaps not scooped enough for that classic metal sound (a la Metallica, Megedeth, etc.) but great for the newer gen type stuff like "every time i die" and the like.

[mnordbye]

I see. Mush! That's the word i was looking for i guess. 

Anyway, my Rocktron Metal planet with the AMZ mini-booster in front sounds great, but i'm looking for something else at the moment. Trying out everything.

Some suggestions on pedals are of course also cool, but mainly my goal is still to have some mods or something which can be applied to most effects.

Magnus Nordbye

[GravityRobert]

I absolutely hate the Boss Metal Zone pedal but it might just be useful for your use. Try one

[Marcos - Munky]

The BSIAB2 have a good palm mute sound. With an eq and a booster, it's a killer. And I'm surprised why nobody suggested Dr Boogey yet .

[birt]

you might be surprised with a rangemaster (input cap to taste..) into a distorted amp.

[WLTerry]

[...]And I'm surprised why nobody suggested Dr Boogey yet .

YES!! The Dr Boogey, if it is properly tweaked to find 2nd harmonics too, it sounds like a beast! Of course a good amp is absolutely needed.

[mnordbye]

All good suggestions. I use a fairly good amp. I think it is brilliant actually, but someone would call it mediocre because of it's low price tag.. I have a Peavey Valveking 112. I use it into a Marshall 1960AV cab with vintage speakers at band-practice, but i've come to the conclusion that the cab sucks. REALLY sucks.. I'm switching to Peavey all out soon, i'm tired of the Marshall hype. 

Anyway, a question for you smart guys (no, i'm not one of you!  ) . Is it a special frequency at which most of the "good" palm muted sound comes from, or is it decided by the distortion circuit itself, as in type of circuit, tranny, IC, etc...

Thanks for all help so far!

Magnus Nordbye

[Chawk]

High Output Humbucker pickups>JFET buffer>Distortion +>Tube Amp (loud).  Add a TS in front of the DIst + for even more ballz.

[greigoroth]

I'm going to put in agree that it all begins with a hot humbucker.

The best palm muting I have had is with the California channel of a Sansamp GT2, closely followed by the California channel of a Sansamp Tri-OD. I am no Sansamp fanboy, I just really enjoy these channels. They of course have a very specific sound, and have a lot of colour, but for what they are I really like them. Combining the California channel with something that has a bit of ping is fantastic - like an AC30 or Laney VC30 (serious!).

Lately I have been really happy with the following combination, which gives me a lot of control: Hotcake running as a slight signal boost, with the presence knob at about 25% (I believe it pumps the mids a bit), into the Tri-OD, California chanel, gain on about 50% into a tube amp with the clean channel breaking up.

Definition and a good control over the lows!

On the other hand I have never got the level of sharpness that Meshuggah get with their distortion. It is not a sound I want all that often, but every now and then I get a hankering for something really just... sharp! But no love yet. The search goes on! But for the most part I love my set up, especially muting! Also, don't underate the importance of good technique with your non-picking hand. If you can use your non-picking hand to mute strings you can get a really clean sound without resorting to gating - in essence your fingers become the gate. Keep us posted on your search for the ultimate PM mate!

[tcio]

mnordbye.....I may be able to help. I too am very picky about my tone and love high gain and have had trouble finding a great heavy sound for both Rhythm AND lead. The sound I have now I get great tonal quality, lots of bite and really good palm muting action also. Perhaps it will give you some ideas at least if you do not want to get the exact same pedal setup. It sounds like we are running a very similar setup.

Check out this link and click on the Omega Smash Drive sound clip towards the bottom of the page!

[cheeb]

A compressor may slightly help to clean up some mush, although a high-gain distortion will already be largely compressed. Try sneaking some mids back in too and lowering your very low lows (around...um...50-100Hz, maybe up to 150Hz) with an eq to clean up that low-end sludge. Other than that, +1 on everybody who said hot pickups and hand technique. Just a few ideas off the top of my head.

[trendyironicname]

metal zone (-2 as a pedal, +2 for what you want)

more importantly, right hand technique

[Shepherd]

A defined sound requires a pickup with definition.  (doesn't have to be active)

Of course, relatively new strings probably helps.

Oh, don't forget killer technique.

^^beat me to it

[trendyironicname]

+1 strings ^

especially if you down tune, get as thick as you can handle.  floppy strings=sucksville. 

[hellwood]

all you need is a cranked up JCM800 Marshall and even a single coil strat would blow your mind. if thats not enough for you, try a vintage opamp  Big Muff w/ this combo and you will be beyond!

JCM800 and humbuckers? no pedals necessary!

[ethanw]

My Bogner Uberschall is king of all palm muted chunkiness. Pedalwise, get a pedal you like the sound of and run an EQ afterwards, push or cut the freq. you need-

Guiltyspark

[the_random_hero]

Stick a noise gate in there to clean up the palm mutes too, they work wonders for helping you keep a bit of definition.

[newfish]

...maybe a compressor before the O/D, Fuzz or whatever -just to give your riffs a cleaner starting point with more definition - just to help them stand out.

[darron]

i find that fuzzes will often have a dulled-out palm mute, which is where they disappoint most for me. i mean, i love fuzzes, but i can't use them for that purpose. so stay away from things like the fuzz face and big muffs etc and simple circuits like that.

the bsiab2 is really good, but i haven't built the dr boogey which seems to get fantastic reviews around here. the boxes that palm mute well are usually more complex with more gain stages than a simple fuzz. the metal zone and hm2 palm mute well, but their tone is just average/good to my ears, and not as fantastic like "wow... i could fricken strum this power chord all day till the drummer tries to wedge his sticks up my..."