A two stage fuzz sim. Note the first stage gain control it adjusts both the first stage gain as a feedback resistor and the gain of the 2nd stage.
The wiper goes to the Q1 collector one side goes to the Q1 base and the other side goes to the input of the following stage and is part of setting the gain of the 2nd stage. The more astute will note the Bluesbreaker uses a similar type gain control but with opamps
R4 needs to be selected for a higher hfe transistor like a 2N5088 it sets the bias and a part of the max gain. The circuit is a balancing act of transistor and resistor values. You can remove the clipping diodes at the 2nd stage if you want
Circuit is R18 and to the right, The left of R18 is the guitar and cable sim section
The gain control is a 500K the 1 meg is a mistake on the sim screenshot
(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=49550&g2_serialNumber=1)
(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=49553&g2_serialNumber=1)
looks cool gus!! one more to add to the pile...
;)
btw.. gave that last thing to my bro who's studio burned down... he loves it.. thanks man!!
Looks elegantly wonderful. Lot of outta the box thinking there. I like the diodes, would like to try it!
R6 and R5 in the sim are one potentiometer of 500k.
If the wiper is CCW R6 is a short and the circuit is at min gain
the collector to base feedback is R4 and (C1, R19) in parallel for the first stage
this also works with the series input R7 and C2 and the source
Also the series input resistance part R5 is at max (500k) setting the 2nd stage at min gain
If the wiper is CW the circuit is at max gain
The parallel collector to base feedback R4, (R6 at 500K, C1, R19) is at it max setting
AND R5 is shorted setting the 2nd stage gain to max
The gain circuits are the same type you find in a BMP or a text book
What is different is how R5,R6 change the gain with this type circuit. As I posted before this similar to the way a Bluesbreaker gain control works
Anyone know of an effect circuit that sets gain like this with transistors?
Might sound nice with a passive bass
I selected a collector current for the transistors and then set the circuit up using stock parts and easy to find parts. Not built add a filter cap and power supply protection.
Nice. I like the bluesbreaker approach on the gain control. Always thought that was a good idea.
Love it. I had never noticed that about the Bluesbreaker gain knob. Brilliant way to adjust the gain of both at once without a dual pot.
Any way you could show the waveform output with the sine source voltage stepping from say 10 mV to 1V? I find that frequency response of seriously non-linear circuits is only part of the story.
hey gus,
if you can bear with me being behind a couple days, i'd be quite glad to build a "proof of concept" for you if you'd like.
this looks really cool!! ;)
hi gus....looks interesting.
i took the liberty of re-drawing it just to be easier on my eyes..
is this how the 'gain' pot should be wired then?...
i have room on my breadboard again at last...i'll give it a go with 5088's later on if i get time..
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7464107/gus%20fuzz.jpg)
cheers man , rob.
Yep, sounds good if a little bright with just the two stages - I think I like it a little better than the standard BMP sustain control.
deadastronaut
If we are looking at the "top" of the gain potentiometer it looks correct. If we are looking at the back. flip the outer lug connections
I would use two 1n4148s to start. I picked a1n914 for no good reason in the sim. You might want to add a series resistor to the cap, diode clipping section.
If your collector voltages are way off from the sim and you want to adjust them, I would adjust R3 and R9 values for each section first.
cheers gus, i'll try that later... 8)
nocentelli
You can install a capacitor from the 2nd transistors collector to base like in a BMP to reduce the higher frequencies. Try 330pf or 470pf etc.
Anyone try this for the first two stages of a BMP like circuit?
Built the circuit and tested it with a J bass
I used a 1meg gain control
.47uf for C1
two 1n4148 diodes for clipping with a 10k in series with the diodes and C7
removed R2 and R10 and grounded the emitters
added a diode and cap at the DC supply
Sounds good at low settings and at full gain, however it is a kind of fast transition when the diodes start clipping
I might add a lowpass filter it is a little harsh at full gain maybe a cap from the output control wiper to ground and/or a higher value Q2 C to B cap than 330pf
I tested this again yesterday with a new battery. I should have checked the first battery I used for the above post.
Sounds good to me, anyone else build it?
not yet, been waiting to get to it... so many builds...
i DID build up the fuzz only from the fender fuzz wah you'd helped me with, no dice tho... can't get it to fire.
pinkjimiphoton
this schematic?
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=93064.0
R11 in the above link should be a 10meg not a 1meg. I also left out the 1meg volume after the mix control.
I would try a 741. Q1 collector and emitter voltages are important.
Hi
Looks sweet as candy.
A couple of thoughts...
If Q1 were a low gain device, the emitter resistor could be smaller (10ohms) or taken out, and the clipping might be less symmetrical and more harmonic.
Also, the input impedance is mostly set by the 220k resistor, which is good for overall frequency response and low noise. But a lower value (say 47k) would tame the highs in the first stage, by 'loading' the pickups and allow it to 'clean up' using the volume control (one of the best attributes of a fuzz face). Someone might like to check that out in practice (note that it might mean changing the 47k resistor on the other side of Q1, but probably not much). Gus might be able to sim it it to find a good bias set up for 47k.
Just my 2c worth...
Cheers
Quote from: Gus on November 16, 2013, 09:13:21 AM
pinkjimiphoton
this schematic?
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=93064.0
R11 in the above link should be a 10meg not a 1meg. I also left out the 1meg volume after the mix control.
I would try a 741. Q1 collector and emitter voltages are important.
hi gus,
sorry i missed your call the other day, been busy as a one legged man in a butt kicking contest still.
i built this schematic, have checked it over quickly so far, can't find any issues and voltages seem ok.
i will try and get some voltages in a little bit if i can, i gotta day off for a change which is kinda nice.
i didn't have a 10m resistor, so i used two 4.7m in series, but other than that and going with 47u caps (closest i had to 33) i went by the schematic.
haven't had any time to debug at all.
I like the abbreviation for this project....capslock and one swipe against the left side of the keyboard: ASDF :icon_cool:
Quote from: Gus on October 28, 2013, 06:50:30 AM
Built the circuit and tested it with a J bass
I used a 1meg gain control
.47uf for C1
two 1n4148 diodes for clipping with a 10k in series with the diodes and C7
removed R2 and R10 and grounded the emitters
added a diode and cap at the DC supply
Bump
anyone build it?
got this one and the new buffer to boost in the pile bro.
been real busy with some fuzzes... like, 6 or 7 new ones this week... new to ME anyways. ;)
hoping to get to this soon... so much to do so little time.
i DO seem to remember building this or laying it out, but damned if i can find it!!
hey gus, here's a vero that should be good to go. rudimentary power supply filter added to make it happier with a wart.
thinking it may sound good to have a diode clipper on the output for more of a boost..
will try and get on it soon. at least it's drawn up finally. ;)
edit: helps if i remember the dang pic, eh?
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/ASomewhatDifferentFuzzvero_zps882beda0.png)
edited .... there's a fine line between clever and stupid... :icon_mrgreen:
edit:
is this better gus?
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/ASomewhatDifferentFuzz_zpsee718966.png)
QuoteSounds good to me, anyone else build it?
I built something very similar.
The major differences are:
- the first silicon is a low gain device, 2SC1213, hfe:130, no R3.
- both emiters are grounded.
- second stage 470k resistor is splitted in two 220k with a 33n cap from the junction to ground to have more gain, switcheable.
- BMP gain pot.
- no input resistor and smaller input cap, 33n, less bassy.
- 100p roll off caps
Except for the input cap, I bet that Gus and mine sound really, really close.
I highly recommend this one, very sweet sounding.
Think of it as a Small Muff Pi, or boosted Bazz Fuss ;D
mac
last vero i posted on the thread is built and running. used exactly what you posted, does sound nice.
fired up right away. it is kinda noisy, probably cuz it's not boxed.
very nice rich distortion tho i'd like it a little gainier if possible.
also tried (of course) germanium. ge x 2 sounded like poo, but a random ac176 or three i threw in there sounded great as q1 and most of the noise went away.
i'll probably make it so q1 is switchable between ge and si.
added one 1n4001 for polarity protection and a 100u filter cap.
the 100r resistor trick on the b+ would probably help with some of the little bits of hash.
also added 10r e to ground resistors instead of grounding them.
you got me in that habit gus. ;)
nice project brother, thanks!! i'll try and shoot some video before i mutate it. ;)
i'm thinking a single ge diode between the junction of the diode clippers and q2 c will help the noise and make it a little warmer.
i really like the tone. well done!
mac's right, it does sound like that... maybe small muff pi or a big bazz fuss pi ;)
i just messed with this a whole bunch. i'm gonna make it so there's a switch for both transistors, ge on one side and 5089's on the other.
if it's too brite, try a 50k output pot instead of 100. warms it up nicely.
the gain control can go down to 100k and you get a real nice sweep but lose a little distortion.. but also makes it quieter.
really nice circuit. i am really digging your gain control gus. this is very cool!!!
tried gain pots from 10k-1m. 1m gives probably the most pronounced distortion. i bet 250 or 500k would be perfect if you're up to tinkering a little.
This is what I built
(http://www.aronnelson.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=50209&g2_serialNumber=1)
I wonder if R20, D1 and D2 are similar to a pair of Leds or 4 x 1N4148 without R20...
mac
i went back in and played with this some more, decided to just stay with the 89's. not enough difference tonally really, but the 89's are a good deal louder.
and i like that. ;)
Jimi,
I bet that high gain AC187 can work fine, +200 or so.
I posted long ago a trick to put a Germ in a BMP without changing bias: just replace the 100 ohm resistor with a silicon diode.
This way the 100k will see the same voltage drop, and the diode resistance will be of some tens or hundreds of ohms.
If you need more gain bypass the diode with a big cap.
AC187 might need a smaller roll off cap or none at all.
Quoteor a big bazz fuss pi Wink
:D
mac
i like that trick... i actually did it on the toneblaster project, i think it was.
thanks for explaining it to me! :icon_mrgreen:
Have you had a chance to try it with a passive bass?
naaah, my bass is buried at the moment in the guitar chamber (26 of 'em stuffed behind my recliner and the only one i can get at without moving a bunch of stuff is my late wife's longhorn. probably sound good, i bet with lipsticktubes.
been hung up debugging another project. found a mistake on the schemo i think, trying to work it out. it's a little kay amp emu, all ge, very sweet sounding distortion that when working sounds ridiculousy like my kay 707 of my mis-spent youth. that beotch got loud at 4 ohms (supposed to be 16) with a kay fuzztone and a clone theory in front of it with a lpb 1 to overdrive it. too much fun.
Quote from: mac on December 19, 2013, 12:26:12 PM
I wonder if R20, D1 and D2 are similar to a pair of Leds or 4 x 1N4148 without R20...
mac
The 10K was selected for setting the 2nd stage gain when the diodes conduct
The .1uf was selected for the frequency the 10K and diodes can start to conduct, at lower values it will allow for more more bass level for the 2nd stage at lower frequencies before the diodes conduct
Both are tuning points for the circuit as well as the diodes used
I posted what I think is a good selection of parts I took into account
min and max gain
how the gain changes in both stages with the gain control setting
how the circuit clips
easy to find and standard value parts
no trimmers
The high and low pass frequencies
Other parts like the gain control (Jimi posted about this)are parts that can be adjusted
C1 the .47uf can be adjusted up and down in value along with the gain control
All of the cap values except the power supply filter cap will change the tone because you can change the high pass frequencies and low pass(C8) frequency
With all the points that can be adjusted it might be good to try this as posted before changing the values
in the end, other than the pot values (which i found worked best for me) the stock circuit is ace.
i mean... when the hell do i EVER use silicon transistors over germanium in something for me?
very toneful project as depicted. you CAN mess with it, but i don't think it's necessary. like, it's THAT good.
I think i'll need to build this one. Gain pot should be linear taper, right?
Now...
Quote from: brett on November 16, 2013, 10:27:24 AM
If Q1 were a low gain device, the emitter resistor could be smaller (10ohms) or taken out, and the clipping might be less symmetrical and more harmonic.
Gus, would you recommend trying a lower gain transistor for Q1 (think hfe 50-100) and smaller emitter resistance? I'm concerned about increased noise.
the gain pot, linear taper is great. used shielded cable and make sure the pot casing is connected to ground as well.
the output, you may wanna consider a reverse audio taper pot, it may give a better sweep from off to blast if you have one.
i'm betting you could go down as low as 10k on the output pot and it would work ok. i MAY have a defective pot tho, as i've run into a couple bad ones here and there.
fwiw, the 5089's i used were just pulled from the bag, i didn't really check 'em or anything, other than to make sure i got the pinout right with my checker (nice little digital multi meter with a decent transistor tester for like, 19 bux at harbor freight) but i do remember the first one was around 560hfe. to me, that's WICKED high for a fuzz to sound this good. the other could be higher or lower... i tend to be of the school i'll use random transistors, and see how it sounds before trying to tune it. and in this case, the original two were the best sounding.
i was really surprised at how much clean up i could get, and i just spent about an hour noodling on my semi hollow (the one in the video) thru it on various amp settings and really, really dug it.
it sounds kinda like a big muff a little... the way it breaks up is unique... but it's WAY smoother than a bmp, yet not as wooly as a fuzzface...but it responds like a fuzz face.
gus i think reinvented the klon right with two transistors. not the tone... but the idea of adjusting the gain stages like that. it's pretty cool.
lotta nuance... from smooth and sustainy to crystalline.... the highs aren't harsh, and the lows and mids are almost compressed.
my very favorite amp of all time was this univox i had for a while in the 70's. it had a cleanish compressed midrange, an explosive bass and a screaming distorted treble. this is kinda like that but not a bright.
i'm betting lower gain transistors in q1 will gain some upper harmonic content at the expense of some overall distortion. but there's a good amount of that on tap.
this DID sound pretty good with npn ge's, too ... switching a lower gain germanium with a sweeter quieter overdrive with a 5089 that's screaming could make a really nice footswitchable option.
;)
If you want to use a lower beta transistor you might need to adjust R4 for a lower collector voltage. A 2n2222 sims at just over 5VDC with R4 at 1meg however if you reduce R4 value it changes the gain control interaction with the circuit. It might sound OK
I set this circuit up for higher beta hfe transistors for a more just drop in the transistor and don't worry about biasing.
For more output you could try 1n400Xs or 4 1N4148s(2 and 2) or two about 1.5 drop LEDs the 10K in series with the diodes can be adjusted up and down. The cap in series with the clipping diodes can be adjusted down in value for more bass.
A circuit design can be a set of compromises. This circuit was a two higher hfe transistor, two control somewhat different way to set the gain in a fuzz circuit. I tried to get the gain stages to increase in gain at the same time in a musical way (both gain and high and low pass filters). Higher hfe beta silicon transistors can sound nice in fuzzes and distortion.
Thanks. I'll go with a pair of 2N5088.
went back in, turned out i'd swapped pins 1 and 2 on the volume pot/. :icon_redface:
huge improvement. also made the leads shorter, and grounded the volume pots to star ground (it's in a plastic enclosure) and added a "shield" connected to ground to cover the bottom of the circuit inside the plastic box. believe it or not, it works. it's quiet enough to gig with now. ;)
So I notice that R2 and R10 have been 0, 10 or 100 ohms depending on the specific build (Gus with 100 in the first place, 0 on thge build, jimi with 10 ohms on his build.)
What would be the difference that you'd expect? Is it a biasing choice or is it a choice based on the desired degenerative feedback (I think that's what those R's will do, right? Like a cathode R on a tube?)
Working on a little PCB layout for this.
-j
to me, yeah i think of it like a cathode in a tube.
I drew up a PCB layout. NOT BUILT/NOT VERIFIED YET!
I'll try and etch it over the weekend and report back. Any corrections/comments much appreciated.
The pdf linked below has 5 views: copper side 3x life size, correct orientation for toner transfer; component side 3x life size, correct orientation for reading or for glue-on; component side 1x life size, correct orientation for toner transfer, 6-up; component side 1x life size, correct orientation for reading or for glue-on, 6-up; copper 1x life size, correct orientation for toner transfer, 6-up.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4722178/asdf%20circuit%20board%20views.pdf (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4722178/asdf%20circuit%20board%20views.pdf)
EDIT: I revised the pdf.
This was a very good etching experience - I gave up on sticker paper and plunked down 13 bucks for 250 sheets of H-P Presentation Paper, which has been recommended by some of the folks here. This worked quite well, take a look.
This is what it looked like after etching, with the toner still attached. You can see my spot repairs made with a Staedtler Lumicolor pen, the choice of such luminaries as Mark Hammer and Salvador Dali:
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/asdffirstetchstilltoner.jpg)
This is what the board looked like after I stripped off the toner (you are looking at the cleaned-off copper side, backlit):
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/asdffirstetch.jpg)
This is my best etch ever by far - the detail is far better than I've ever achieved. Both the negative-space lettering and the copper lettering are very well detailed - that letting is very tiny. The whole (double ) board is 3" x 4" to give you a sense.
Score one for H-P Presentation Paper.
In a frustrating turn of events, I'm having trouble finding where I put my Dremel - as soon as I do I can start populating these boards!
Anybody know where it is?
Nice looking PCB! Glad I saw this as I was about to make one and share it on OSHPark.
Quote from: mth5044 on February 01, 2014, 03:47:44 PM
Nice looking PCB! Glad I saw this as I was about to make one and share it on OSHPark.
Thanks! You may want to wait until I find my Dremel, test & verify the board, but I - think - I did it right (famous last words.)
that looks awesome... love the vintage trippy vibe!! :icon_twisted:
Found the Dremel! So I've made some progress: almost ready to test - maybe tonight?
Gus: Hfe of 270 seem OK? I am using some 2N2222's or perhaps a different number, they came in a Rat Shack Pack and I can't read the numbers without my loupe. I'm using 500K linear for the Gain control. 10 ohms for the emitter resistors. I had to jumper the Zener diode spot because I don't have one. The closest I could get to 330 pF in my parts stash was 220 pF. Otherwise, everything is as drawn in your schematic.
Seem likely to work?
One board is just drilled, one drilled/stuffed/soldered:
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/drilledandstuffed.jpg)
And, the stuffed board wired to jacks etc.:
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/almostready.jpg)
Hoping to play a little bit tonight after everybody goes to sleep - we'll see.
ummm,.. the 390 pf is part of the guitar sim. the circuit starts at the input, the junction of r18 and c2.
all the stuff before that point to the left should not be on the board, it's to show the guitar's interaction with the circuit, and it may not work with all that stuff on there.
hfe of 270 should be fine, in this higher gain is better. socket. cut up a 6 or 8 pin ic socket if you need to.
by zener do you mean the diode clipper between b and c of q2? you can't jumper that , it will become the equivalent of shorting c and b together, tho the cap may help. the diodes there are what make this thing fuzz, if you take them out you'll most likely have a booster.
any diodes should work, even led's, which should be louder and give a nice bit of compression.
500k gain pot is fine. anything from 100k to 1meg will probably work there. i used 500k if memory serves.
so... i don't know if it will work with all the stuff in front of the circuit, but pretty sure you need the diodes, and not a jumper.
if it doesn't work, try connecting your input to the node i mentioned, and putting led's or something in for the diode clipper. i think it's an open circuit without them, and a short circuit jumpered.
may be wrong... ;)
Quote from: pinkjimiphoton on February 06, 2014, 10:49:38 PM
ummm,.. the 390 pf is part of the guitar sim. the circuit starts at the input, the junction of r18 and c2.
I hear that bro. I'm looking at the schematic Gus posted in message #29 (just after your vero layout in this thread) - there's a 330 pF from B to C of Q2 adding a little extra NFB for stability at high freqs I suppose...
The Zener I mentioned is shown in that drawing too - it's up by the battery, reverse battery protection I think?
Quote
all the stuff before that point to the left should not be on the board, it's to show the guitar's interaction with the circuit, and it may not work with all that stuff on there.
Check. I'm not using that section from the first schematic. Check Gus' second schematic out. I'm starting where you say - at the "input" marker.
Quote
hfe of 270 should be fine, in this higher gain is better. socket. cut up a 6 or 8 pin ic socket if you need to.
Check. I did socket, momma didn't raise no fool, except my brother.
Quote
by zener do you mean the diode clipper between b and c of q2? you can't jumper that , it will become the equivalent of shorting c and b together, tho the cap may help. the diodes there are what make this thing fuzz, if you take them out you'll most likely have a booster.
any diodes should work, even led's, which should be louder and give a nice bit of compression.
Check. I have the 2 antiparallel 2n4148's, those are all set.
Quote
500k gain pot is fine. anything from 100k to 1meg will probably work there. i used 500k if memory serves.
Check.
Quote
so... i don't know if it will work with all the stuff in front of the circuit, but pretty sure you need the diodes, and not a jumper.
if it doesn't work, try connecting your input to the node i mentioned, and putting led's or something in for the diode clipper. i think it's an open circuit without them, and a short circuit jumpered.
may be wrong... ;)
You might be, but I agree with you! Thank you for the confirmation on the 270 Hfe and the 500K pot, I will get some time to play tomorrow afternoon, I'll check in with my results then.
must have missed the other schematic. my memory blows these days. cof cof...
yah, if it was up by the filter cap with cathode to + and anode to ground, just leave it out.
other than that, you should be good to go.
i think you're gonna love it. ;)
Quote from: pinkjimiphoton on February 07, 2014, 12:17:05 AM
i think you're gonna love it. ;)
I'm itching to try it but sleep & work are getting in the way....
Thanks for chiming in and keep crossed fingers....
a link for the diode
http://www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/1N/1N5818.pdf (http://www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/1N/1N5818.pdf)
You could jumper the emitters to ground, 10 ohms does little
500K should work
What are the collector voltages to ground with the 2n2222s you have?
EDIT: Under revision
Quote from: Gus on February 07, 2014, 07:02:03 AM
a link for the diode
http://www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/1N/1N5818.pdf (http://www.fairchildsemi.com/ds/1N/1N5818.pdf)
Aha! A schottky, not a Zener - I have something around here that will be close enough... thanks.
Quote
What are the collector voltages to ground with the 2n2222s you have?
Will let you know in a short while, thanks for the help!
Quote from: mth5044 on February 07, 2014, 03:03:35 PM
I made a board as well if anyone is interested. The unsymmetricalness of the diodes is killing me, but what are ya gonna do. Schematic and board:
(http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg114/mth5044/EBC7AEA1-EFF7-4B4D-BE6C-E0FD65E53A29_zpsztc6p1n2.png)
(http://uploads.oshpark.com/uploads/project/top_image/GUCh5dyf/i.png)
It's $7.60 for each order (3x) of boards. It's 1.39" x 1.10". I've never done the share thing before... this should be a link to it.
http://oshpark.com/shared_projects/GUCh5dyf
Also NOT VERIFIED!!! Except by Eagle, who says 'yeah sure'.
I grounded the emitters and you are missing an important 10K
thats not what I built
I based the schematic off the OP schematic. I see you posted some amendments later. I'll fix that up,
Thanks.
.
Missing 10K is between Q2 base and C4 (in path to clipping diodes.)
Yikes, I'll get it right someday. Have you had a go at it yet?
I wish!
Tomorrow?
Actually, that resistor is not in the first scheme posted by Gus.
I've built this fuzz on preperf and put a socket for that resistor. I didn't try it yet.
Reply #29 is what I built
Quick trial.
NO guitar sound. Some shhh which varies in level with the volume control.
Voltages:
9V node: 9.2V
Q1: C: 7.0, B: .57 V, E: 2 mV
Q2: C: 6.65, B: .57, E: 2 mV.
Any guesses?
Thanks!
check the emitter resistors, you might have some cold solder joints
The voltages look right for lower beta transistors and emitter resistors. I selected higher beta transistors for lower collector voltages and higher collector currents I also grounded the emitters.
I would seem something else is not passing signal. Did you check the PCB with a meter for unwanted connection between copper areas before building?
Remove the battery
Check the gain control with a meter set to ohms. Then check the circuit with a meter set to ohms and work from in to out checking for wanted and unwanted connections also check caps for shorts and resistors for correct values. Are the jacks, wires good etc.
What transistors did you use?
2mv shows the emitters are not grounded
Looks like you used 10 ohms
9.2 -7 = 2.2 first stage 2.2VDC/10k = .22ma
.22ma x 10ohm = .0022volts
OK next steps are clear, THANK YOU!!
I appreciate the help!
Quote from: deafbutpicky on February 09, 2014, 07:31:08 AM
you might have some cold solder joints
dingdingding we have a winner! Cold solder joints it was, sir. Not the only cold problem we've been having here in Brooklyn ::)
So: the PCB is VERIFIED. While I was all busy with life & stuff, a Tayda order came in with some 2N5089's (all 20 test in a tight cluster around 500 hFE on my multimeter) and some Schottky diodes and some other stuff.
I put two 2n5089's that tested about 520-ish into the sockets and got out my magnifying glass. Indeed there were some bad solder joints here and there.
After I fixed those the only problem I had was, my amp sounded like it might blow up. :icon_biggrin:
Even without it in any kind of box at all, I'd say the noise factor was pretty minimal. I was able to get some screamy feedback, some ballsy crunch, some blue distorted lead tones, all sorts of stuff. Nice crazy-box indeed.
Thanks for hanging in there with me, guys.
Gus: want any boards? It's the least I can do. Thanks for sharing this interesting design with the community, it's a pretty sweet one.
Wow, I didn't even try this circuit yet and i'm already regretting my 100R emitter resistors. :icon_mrgreen:
Quote from: Davelectro on February 18, 2014, 10:27:26 PM
Wow, I didn't even try this circuit yet and i'm already regretting my 100R emitter resistors. :icon_mrgreen:
I stuffed/soldered/tested a second board last night, with 7R5 at that position, sounds great. I had to make one other substitution: 3M3 instead of 2M2 on the input, that shouldn't really change anything.
I still haven't drilled any boxes yet, and the open boards are usably quiet anyhow - I only pick up a tiny bit of RF interference, probably WiFi. I took pinkjimi's suggestion and added a ground wire to the back of the gain pot (500K linear on both builds) and I also braided all 4 wires to that pot together.
Here's a couple pics:
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/2014-02-20224624.jpg)
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/2014-02-20224612.jpg)
looks great bro!!
I forgot to mention: the voltages shown on Gus's simulation are spot on - within a tiny fraction of a volt in every case.
Some things to try
grounded emitters
other clipping diodes a set of 1n400(1,2,3 etc.) might be fun
Adjust the 10K resistor value in series with the diodes try a 22K
What I posted at reply 29 is a good set of starting values.
Have you tried it on bass?
No bass experiments yet for me - I don't own one. I was thinking about switchable symmetrical/asymmetrical diodes but I want to get an example boxed up before anything else gets added in.
Anyone else try this circuit?
I have a different circuit based off the ASDF simmed.
I'm almost ready to post gut shots, BTW. I've been experimenting with Envirotex and it takes a while for a couple of coats of that stuff to dry, plus I haven't exactly done it right so far....
What changes have you made, Gus?
fwiw, the one i built now is the exclusive distorter for my keyboard player's minimoog (i sold him).... sounds great on keys, too!
i started off with gus's schematic to tinker with...
then i ended up having a pre-gain, and removing quite a few parts..now i have a pretty good rock overdrive that cleans up nice..
still tinkering.. ;)
I had some fun with the finishing on these - I used paint pen with Envirotex Lite over it. Not perfect by any means but certainly more fun than spray paining, and it's been too cold for that anyway.
Pics:
http://s680.photobucket.com/user/tubegeek-original/slideshow/asdf (http://s680.photobucket.com/user/tubegeek-original/slideshow/asdf)
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/asdf/number1exterior-1.jpg)
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/asdf/number2interior2.jpg)
Mine works great, I built it using the values Gus did in his proof of concept. FWIW I also built Gus' Suzy Q, which is fantastic also.
ummm, suzy q is mine, not gus's. ;)
welcome to the forum!! :icon_mrgreen:
Thanks for the feedback.
Cozybuilder
Did you build the circuit in the screen shot from a sim I posted reply 29 in a suzy Q thread? http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101178.20 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101178.20)
Quote from: Gus on March 10, 2014, 07:38:14 PM
Thanks for the feedback.
Cozybuilder
Did you build the circuit in the screen shot from a sim I posted reply 29 in a suzy Q thread? http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101178.20 (http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=101178.20)
here's a vero for that, btw
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt137/pinkjimiphoton/adjustedsimplefuzzveropresuzyq_zpse2450742.png)
Gus- Yes, your screen shot schematic is what I used in the Suzy-Q build.
Pink Jimi- Your Suzy Q schematic works great too!
.
Quote from: Cozybuilder on March 13, 2014, 09:13:41 AM
Gus- Yes, your screen shot schematic is what I used in the Suzy-Q build.
Pink Jimi- Your Suzy Q schematic works great too!
all good cozy, but gus's pedal isn't a suzy q. completely different animal! the suzy q started life as a "how will i make a version of this here amp to fit in a little box" and evolved from there. gus made some suggestions, but at that point it was way past implementing much of gus's ideas... that all came later as i began to understand some of what he writes... usually way above my paygrade!!
that said, gus's designs are always great sounding, simple and elegant. no fluff.
the suzy q is a great pedal... i use mine all the time.... dick wagner uses his, too... but it doesn't sound like gus's pedal either.
apples and orangutans, dude!!
THIS one tho, sounds really good on everything... guitars, keys, bass... as usual, a homerun outta the park. ;)
Post 43 from the Suzy-Q thread had the schematic I used as a basis for my build. As usual, I changed things around. No disrespect intended to anyone.
no worries man. the first schematic in that thread is the suzy q, i'm not sure what gus wants to call his circuit. they're completely different from each other. glad to hear it sounds good... no surprise there!!
can ya post clips? love to hear it, sure gus would, too!!
:icon_mrgreen:
At the time of this post I see 6168 views.
Anyone else build this?
any feedback good bad?
Quote from: Gus on May 24, 2014, 10:35:27 AM
At the time of this post I see 6168 views.
Anyone else build this?
any feedback good bad?
I tried the gain control on the breadboard not too long ago. It seemed to be a little dark at lower gain settings, especially going into the BMP stack. Do you have a suggestion for a way to help with that?
Quote from: Gus on May 24, 2014, 10:35:27 AM
At the time of this post I see 6168 views.
Anyone else build this?
any feedback good bad?
My buddy Jim has had his strapped to his pedal board ever since I dropped it off!
He got the red & white peppermint stick one.
I built another ASDF "Manhattan" style (also known as "dots and dashes.") I had wanted to try that method of building a circuit for a while and I had recently been reminded of it, so I did. I found it to be a great way to make a circuit, very sturdy, very quick. Here's what the board looks like.
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/2015-02-03192650.jpg)
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/2015-02-03192702.jpg)
Once I box it up I'll add some more photos.
that looks cool!! ;)
+1
Off-cuts of vero, would that work?
Quote from: nocentelli on February 05, 2015, 03:44:44 PM
+1
Off-cuts of vero, would that work?
Don't see why not. You wouldn't use the holes, and you'd want not to let the holes fill up with solder I guess - so maybe it'd require a bit more care than using solid PCB material. You could also turn the non-copper side of the backing board upwards to prevent shorts, but then you would lose the "ground it anywhere" feature. You could still drill a hole through to the copper side anywhere you wanted to connect to ground.
What I did was score and crack thin strips of PCB and then score and crack those strips into smaller various sized pieces to make the islands. Super Glue gel worked PERFECTLY for nailing the islands in place.
Built a second one Manhattan-style, a little more compact, a little neater:
(http://i680.photobucket.com/albums/vv166/tubegeek-original/asdfmanhattan2.jpg)
looks cool and no etching needed it might even have lower noise from the ground plane
Now something I have been meaning to build is
the reply 29 ASDF(output cap and output volume control removed 2nd collector to the series input cap and series gain setting resistor of the BMP 3rd stage) ) as the first two stages of a BMP
The ASDF then 3rd and 4th BMP like stages
Quote from: Gus on May 18, 2015, 05:30:26 AM
looks cool and no etching needed it might even have lower noise from the ground plane
Goes together super fast too.
Quote
Now something I have been meaning to build is
the reply 29 ASDF(output cap and output volume control removed 2nd collector to the series input cap and series gain setting resistor of the BMP 3rd stage) ) as the first two stages of a BMP
The ASDF then 3rd and 4th BMP like stages
I say Go!
Bump just to say that I gave Richard Thompson one of these ASDF's last night, told him to have fun with it!
The two knobs are labeled "nasty" and "loud" on it, he thought that was cool.... he said that he was having trouble stumping Jeff Tweedy on obscure pedals, so he was glad to get something unique.
A bump
Anyone else built this?
If so any feedback good or bad.
I breadboarded the original and it's great. I need it. I had just built some FF things and a mk III, and it had a character all its own. When I build it I'll chime back in. Breadboards are stuffed with 13600s now
Edit- I'll re-breadboard it soon and wait to hear more on the added stages
Richard Thompson: "A bit... agressive." A man of few words.