Green Ringer isn't ringing

[CaioAllures]

Well, hello there! First time around, trying hard to build this GGG Green Ringer, but not getting to far with it. First of all I want to thanks in advance any replies, because I hope there would be some kind people willing to make this bastard happen!

And so, let's start with some info: I wanted to test it in a breadboard first, I think it was not quite like I expected because of all the wires I had to put on it, specially while rigging the 3PDT. Also, I tried the Beavis schematic, since I skipped the LED part, but now I wonder if that is not causing a open circuit... I never had heard about verboards so I first tried one layout WITHOUT CUTTING THE TRACKS, having as a result a very hot 2N3906 (which I switched for a new one in this picture I'm providing). And that's it, just trying to excuse myself from some misguidances, let's jump into the fancy language:

1.What does it do, not do, and sound like?
The 3PDT works fine, except for some grounding that make it hum when the pedal is off. When I turn it on, it produces almost no sound, although it responds to the strings of my Les Paul with very flimsy noises.

2.Name of the circuit
Green Ringer Octavia

3.Source of the circuit (URL of schematic or project)
http://www.beavisaudio.com/schematics/Green-Ringer-Schematic.htm for the general schematic, http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_gro_lo.pdf for the switch wiring and stuff

4.Any modifications to the circuit?
Yes, I took apart the LED, which now puzzles me if I have or not an open circuit.

5.Any parts substitutions? If yes, list them.
I didn't have a 160k resistor, so I put together 2 of those and made myself a 165k frankestein

6.Positive ground to negative ground conversion?
Nope

7.Turn your meter on, set it to the 10V or 20V scale. Remove the battery from the battery clip. Probe the battery terminals with the meter leads before putting it in the clip. What is the out of circuit battery voltage? => 8.3V

Transistor measurements

Q1
      C = 7.02V
      B = 1.03V
      E = 0.52V
Q2
      C = 0.62V
      B = 7.02V
      E = 8.24V                                                  (I'm allowed to make silly questions, ain't I? So, all those values can assure me I have working trannys?)
Q3
      C = 8.3V
      B = 3.2V
      E = 2.66V

Expected values: http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_gro_instruct.pdf

Pics confusing as crap: http://1drv.ms/100qWmS

Sorry if it's too confusing/long/wrong on so many levels, but I'm very excited I'm making things like that

YOWZA!

[MaxPower]

Unable to see the pictures (I have a slow connection and it was taking too long to load).

Breadboard it using the schematic. That way you can leave out the switch and LED. Connect the the tip of the input jack to the input of the circuit and the sleeve to ground. Connect the tip of the output jack to the output of the circuit and the sleeve to ground. Connect the positive terminal of the battery to Vcc and the negative terminal to ground. (Hopefully this isn't insulting but I'm not sure if you're just starting out or have some experience).

Use the expected values as a guide for troubleshooting. The base and emitter voltage readings should be about 0.7V apart. For the 5088s (or 5089s) the base voltage should be about 0.7 volts higher than their emitter voltages. For the pnp transistor (2n3906), the base should be about 0.7 volts lower than its emitter voltage.

Double check that your Frankenstein is indeed about 165k by measuring it with your multimeter. A few k difference from the 160k in the schematic wont make too much difference. 10% tolerance is typical (so that's about 144k to 176k).

[duck_arse]

happy first, Caio (is that portuguese under the frankenstein?) I looked your pics (once they'd downloaded), and I can't see anything wrong. but, you probably should re-do your laying out, and keep your parts from criss-crossing each other, bring them closer together, do your "reaching" with links. there shouldn't need to be many with a simple circuit like this.

it is most likely a switch wiring prob as MaxP suggests, if your voltages are right (they seem). there should be NO hum in bypass, flimsy noises are not acceptable!

and congrats on 100, Max.

[CaioAllures]

Breadboard it using the schematic. That way you can leave out the switch and LED. Connect the the tip of the input jack to the input of the circuit and the sleeve to ground. Connect the tip of the output jack to the output of the circuit and the sleeve to ground. Connect the positive terminal of the battery to Vcc and the negative terminal to ground. (Hopefully this isn't insulting but I'm not sure if you're just starting out or have some experience).

Use the expected values as a guide for troubleshooting. The base and emitter voltage readings should be about 0.7V apart. For the 5088s (or 5089s) the base voltage should be about 0.7 volts higher than their emitter voltages. For the pnp transistor (2n3906), the base should be about 0.7 volts lower than its emitter voltage.

Double check that your Frankenstein is indeed about 165k by measuring it with your multimeter. A few k difference from the 160k in the schematic wont make too much difference. 10% tolerance is typical (so that's about 144k to 176k).

Hey there, thanks for your reply! No, it's not at all an insult, I'm completely fresh at this whole DIY thing, and I was wondering if it was that easy, since the GGG schematic for instance has all this A, B, C and so on in the PCB. Those values you put, you calculated it yourself? Because I also wanted to dig a little deeper in this pedal, trying to understand what each part or even which component is doing something to the signal. I have some knowledge about the components and read the Beavis begginer's guide for that boost. I'm answering that kinda late but I just got home, can't wait to test it!

[CaioAllures]

happy first, Caio (is that portuguese under the frankenstein?) I looked your pics (once they'd downloaded), and I can't see anything wrong. but, you probably should re-do your laying out, and keep your parts from criss-crossing each other, bring them closer together, do your "reaching" with links. there shouldn't need to be many with a simple circuit like this.

Hey there, thanks for your reply!

Indeed, I'm from Brazil! The circuit on breadboard is clearly a mess, but you suggesting that I should make more links to extend the tracks? I was wondering if this was preferrable instead of keeping all the components close together. Seems like what I'm aiming to do now! Thank you!

[MaxPower]

The 0.7 Voltage difference between the base and emitter of silicon transistors is due to their physical properties. The base to emitter junction is basically a diode. Silicon diodes drop about 0.7V. Germanium diodes drop about 0.3V and germanium transistors will drop about 0.3V between the base and emitter.

If you meant my statement about 144k to 176k, that comes from the tolerances of resistors. If not specified in a project that a resistor should have a tolerance of 1%, 5%, etc., then it is generally understood that a resistor with a tolerance of 10% will work fine. Tolerance just means how precise the resistor is. A resistor with 10% tolerance can be off by as much as 10% from it's given value. 10% of 160k is 16k, so a resistor labeled as 160K with a 10% tolerance might have an actual (measured) value anywhere from 144k to 176k.


Hey, thanks duck! I didn't think I was close to 100.

[anotherjim]

It looks to me that Q2 is reversed -  the collector is going via 10k to +9v - it should be the emitter.

[CaioAllures]

GREAT NEWS EVERYONE!

Everything is clean and fully working, thanks to y'all!

There only some remaining questions I'd like to clarify into my mind:

1 - I had some troubles with my mono jack since it has 3 lugs, only having one barrel (the end of the third lug, allegedly the ring, is in contact with the tip barrel). Can someone explain what kind of mono jack is that and how this silent end works?

2 - I'm not sure on how I can upgrade such thing as diodes, transistors and so on. I know they have equivalents, but I didn't find enough reliable sources. Any tips?

3 - At last, the PCB itself can be the source of problems? How long can this pedal last with good care and good soldering/circuit?

Thanks to all, I hope I keep going on this for a long time!

[MaxPower]

Data sheets are what you want. They list the specifications.

http://www.datasheetcatalog.com/

[duck_arse]

it is possible you have a switched mono jack. this connects to sleeve and tip, like we need, but has another contact which is closed to the tip when NO plug is in. this opens when insert plug, so "something" gets turned off (plug in a headphone, speaker goes quiet). if this is the case, you can just ignore the extra connection lug.

diodes- swap a silicon signal for a silicon signal, swap a germanium signal for a Ge signal, or a schottky signal, swap a 1Amp rectifier with a 1Amp rectifier. same goes kinda, with transistors. swap an npn small signal for another npn. you can try swapping a high gain type (2n5089, bc549c) into a low gain circuit (2n2222, 2n3904) most times, or vice-vera. the same applies for pnp transistors. once you have a stock of half-dozen different transistor type numbers, you won't worry about what the 100 million other types might do. if something says use a darlington, use a darlington (mpsa13 eg).

do your pcb right, it will last your lifetime, probably your kid's lifetimes, who knows? a long time, minimum, things like footswitch and pots will wear, wires break.

good work on the fixxe.