Noise when I'm not grounded?

Started by exztinct01, August 29, 2016, 11:35:08 PM

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anotherjim

I think all the electronics flying around up there proves that shielding works without a ground wire, although most of it does find earth eventually -  or just burns up.

GiovannyS10

Quote from: Hatredman on August 31, 2016, 08:56:01 AM
We had the same problem in Brazil, though now a new 3 prong plug model is being enforced by law. Many musicians died in Brazil because of that, including famous ones.

Guitarists here often carry cables with alligator clips in their guitar cases to connect the amp chassis to the mike stand. If it's not possible to do it, they connect the bridge of the guitar to their bellies and the hum is gone.

Enviado do olho da rua da amargura.

Yes Henry is right, sometime we do digital grounds to stop the noise and the buzz, but it's not solve the problem if you have an energy peak. Have a ground amplifier will help you, and a grounded  ( i don't know if "grounded" is the correct word in English...) guitar too.
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amptramp

Although this started out about noise, the safety aspects seem to be more of an issue since whatever solution you find has to be safe.  There are GFCI (ground fault current interrupter) plugs and wall outlets:





which should be used on a power bar for the effects and amplifier either at the plug or socket end.  The GFCI outlet is versatile in that it can be wired so that one GFCI outlet can protect ordinary outlets wired "downstream" from it.  The device operates by sensing the difference in current going into the device using the two power leads - if the current exceeds some amount (usually 5 mA), it trips and disconnects everything.  I could see a DIY power bar made with either a GFCI plug or outlet and possibly a set of neon lights to show ground - neutral, ground - high side and neutral - high side just like a classic outlet checker that looks like this:



Somebody should go into the business of building these, possibly with varistor or TransZorb spike protection and maybe EMI (electromagnetic interference) filtering.  I realize this is getting far removed from the OP's question, but it is something that needs to be built and available to every musician who tours anywhere these plugs can be used.

stallik

Agreed. I built one some years ago. The U.K. Has 3 prong but some venues were open to question. The trip never went off for me but it gave me great peace of mind. I wonder where it is now? Maybe the attic. Now there's another health and safety issue :-[
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Albert Einstein

PRR

> all the electronics flying around up there proves that shielding works without a ground wire

The real deal is the "nearest large conducting surface".

In my yard this is obviously dirt.

On an upper floor of a wood house it might better be "power wires in the walls". However these are generally tied to dirt and we don't make the distinction.

High in a steel building with all power wires in conduit, the steel building frame is the nearest best ground reference. Again this is always tied through concrete to dirt (maybe with additional bonding), so we say "ground".

An airplane is at least 6 inches of tire-rubber off ground, and often miles of thin air away from dirt. In this gig your "gear ground" is the airplane's metal shell. Same applies to Sputnik and its descendants.

Off point- in the 1980s Bob Pease made some dandy modules for sensing voltage through an opto-isolator, breaks huge "ground faults". Some Japanese company ordered 1,000 (at $67 each!). What were they building? Ships!! Bob first thought, a ship is a huge welded steel shell sitting in salt water. Isn't that the greatest ground around? He realized that when the anchor-winch strained, or when lighning struck, there could be huge ground differences, overwhelming or even burning-out mere 28V analog links. Perhaps at a critical time.
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exztinct01

Here's my noise ;)
Although this one is demoed with a DIY amp not yet in a chassis  :icon_lol:
I know fixing it inside a case will remove noises but I just want to record it this way :icon_mrgreen:
https://youtu.be/kSZdVcVGZgU

If money is not a problem anymore, I'll be changing the whole house's electrical system to include a third connection, the earth.
~ Stephen