Another TDA1022 Chorus Attempt

[sarakisof]

Hello everyone, I'm about to build a simple chorus flanger circuit based on TDA1022 as i have some laying around. First thought was the CE2 but MN3007s turned too hard and silly expensive to get nowadays.

Found this thread https://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=74867.msg637491#msg637491
but wouldn't like to build smthng Mistress related. Trying keep things simple.

Could i build RA Penfold's chorus as is and work fine?
I'm asking because a guy in the thread above had mentioned this

OK, hmmm, it's really first time I see flanger which does not mix dry (real-time) signal with delayed/modulated signal, it must sound bit different, interesting! On the other hand it means you can't get chorus-like sound out of it and even light flanger sound (with very small or none feedback) as well

https://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=74867.msg609069#msg609069

I know it won't be a CE2 but do you think I won't be able to get chorus-like sound out of it?







I also found another old "flanger chorus" schematic from Poland. Should this work as is? MCY74069 ICs equivalents?

[Fender3D]

You can use TDA1022 instead of any BBD in chorus or flangers, providing you adapt schematic with proper Gate voltage (pin 13), correct VDD voltage, and correct output termination, so you got plenty of schematics to choose.

Better have bias trimmer to set correct bias.

BTW having shorter delay than usual chorus, it should sound more "liquid" than "double track"

[sarakisof]

If i was to build the CE2 I'd go with veroboard layout from Guitar FX
http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.com/2014/06/boss-ce-2.html?m=1
Is there any ready to go like above layout for TDA1022 available?
I'd appreciate if anyone could help by providing the appropriate adaptation changes in CE2 schematic.


I've found cheap tda1022 PCBs available for sale online but for CE1 only.

[ElectricDruid]

Could i build RA Penfold's chorus as is and work fine?
I know it won't be a CE2 but do you think I won't be able to get chorus-like sound out of it?

RA Penfold deliberately *doesn't* call that a chorus. It's a vibrato effect. That's what it he called it, that's what it is, and that's what it'll sound like. It's not a chorus and it's definitely not a flanger, and it won't sound like either of them.

[Kevin Mitchell]

Unfortunately when it comes to a simple & decent sounding BBD chorus the CE2 or Small Clone hits the nail on the head. Anything else will fall short due to lack of signal preservation since the BBD will dirty up the signal without the extra work.

Also, it's obvious you haven't looked into the current pricing of the TDA1022 which are x8 the costs in comparison to the XVIVE MN3007.
I suggest you hold onto them for the day that a 512 stage BBD is needed for your project.

[Mark Hammer]

I avoid veroboard layouts like the plague, partly because they are hard to follow, don't often situate all components in a subcircuit near each other, and the cuts to the board required tend to make it unusable for anything else if you decide you don't like circuit and want to recycle the parts and board.  Pad-per-hole allows for better spacing, and is better suited to post-build mods, but pads tend to lift off when desoldering parts.

I don't wish to underestimate your building chops, but unless you are highly practised in the art of vero builds, and have enough free time to put this circuit together from start-to-finish in one long episode, I would steer clear of attempting such a vero build - it just has too many ways to go wrong, and the post-build trouble-shooting would be annoying.

The simple design in this E &MM circuit looks reasonable.  Inclusion of a compander means it won't be especially noisy.  http://www.muzines.co.uk/articles/circuit-maker/1762  Although I'm pretty sure I've seen TDA1022-based projects WITH a pcb layout, which would be less problematic...assuming you can etch your own boards.  I'll keep looking for one.

[sarakisof]

RA Penfold deliberately *doesn't* call that a chorus. It's a vibrato effect.

Yes i know, a moded vibrato and calls it "mini chorus" and "mini flanger" actually.

Also, it's obvious you haven't looked into the current pricing of the TDA1022 which are x8 the costs in comparison to the XVIVE MN3007.

You can find them for 4-8 bucks here. I have about 5 laying around, can get them from my local shop for 3.5 bucks.

I avoid veroboard layouts like the plague, partly because they are hard to follow, don't often situate all components in a subcircuit near each other, and the cuts to the board required tend to make it unusable for anything else if you decide you don't like circuit and want to recycle the parts and board.  Pad-per-hole allows for better spacing, and is better suited to post-build mods, but pads tend to lift off when desoldering parts. I don't wish to underestimate your building chops, but unless you are highly practised in the art of vero builds, and have enough free time to put this circuit together from start-to-finish in one long episode, I would steer clear of attempting such a vero build - it just has too many ways to go wrong, and the post-build trouble-shooting would be annoying.

True. I use to gerber my owns and get them manufactured in pcbway, jclpcb and the likes but since VAT and custom restrictions from out of EU to EU countries appeared nowadays i have quit getting things from outside EU anymore. Plus, for just a PCB it wouldn't be so wise to do so and delivery times are about 2 months.

A vero or pcb layout based on TDA1022 would be ideal, if anybody finds something feel free to share.

[Kevin Mitchell]

BBDs tend to not like vero layouts so much. Keeping the clock frequency out & away from the signal path is going to be a challenge.

I have some spare PCBs and ICs for a very complicated chorus (well, a stereo leslie simulator) that uses 4 of those BBDs.
Docs still in development, moved onto the next shiny thing. But take a gander, see if it entices you. PM me if interested.
Same goes for all my forum friends.

[sarakisof]

Thank you Kevin, appreciate. But as i said i'd like to build something simple. To be honest i won't use it for guitar. It want to build it for my Hohner Pianet M e-piano. It's the same with T with additional its own cabinet amp with speakers and vibrato + chorus/flanger effect based on TDA1022. I succesfully mod it into double function instrument, using a switch to use it completely passive like a T (T Mode) but be able to use the amp (M Mode) when want to. The long thread is here:
https://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=129939.msg1260138#msg1260138

https://postimg.cc/ZCyzK7V8

So now i'd like to have an extra Chorus box (i may don't even use footswitch) for using it when it's in T mode just before it goes to a tube amp. That's why i was mentioming in first post that even this "chorus" Penfold's effect would do the trick (it already uses a similar circuit) but it will be better to build a CE 2 for sure.

So according to this

BBDs tend to not like vero layouts so much. Keeping the clock frequency out & away from the signal path is going to be a challenge.

i guess i should go with either a ready to go TDA1022 PCB if it exists (i ve only found DFX but for CE1) or a normal MN3007 PCB and just find a MN3007. Searching all these days for one, turns out it's pretty hard to source locally and i'd like to avoid shipp costs for just one IC from abroad (10 bucks for the item and another 10 for shipp).

Maybe there's someone inside EU (I'm in Greece but Germany could work too) who would like to exhange a TDA1022 for a MN3007 one? 

[Kevin Mitchell]

Ahh it was worth trying to turn you to the dark side of unreasonably large builds lol 
That project isn't specifically for guitar, but for any instrument really. Mostly used with electric organs.

Let us know what you settle on!