I HATE PERF BOARD!

[shawn]

That picture makes my eyes hurt.

[ulysses]

when you use perf, the finished product is messy. when you use pcb the process is messy and time consuming.

when you use vero you dont have to drill any holes. you dont have to fiddle around with soldering hundreds of bits of wire to the underside. you dont have to etch and re-etch when traces go bad. you dont have to iron on transfers. as long as you are profecient at vero it is by far the easiest way to knock up a circuit.

i can go from schem to layout quite quickly. ie, for something like matsumins tubsecreamer took me approx 2.5 hours. its on vero 21x10 which is significantly smaller than the original tubescreamer pcb and matsumins version has more parts.

i built my matsumins tubescreamer on vero in 1 hour.

try doing it that quickly with pcb. imagine the mess and fiddlyness of doing it with perf.

the only advantage perf and pcb have over vero is that you dont have to stand as many resistors on end. often you are forced to with vero.

another advantage of pcb over vero is that you can make pcb part placement a lot tighter than vero. but that depends on your skill i guess. if you are skilled with pcb design you can isolate the different schem block from each other easier than vero.

if i was doing a run of pedals that was cost effective enough to have someone else professionally make the pcb's then i would do that. if i was making a one off pedal i would def use vero. in fact, nearly all my builds i have designed have been on vero.

people dont like vero for many reasons. usually becasue they are not very good at designing for it. but like anything, you need to practice if it doesnt come naturally to you.

cheers
ulysses

[oldrocker]

Simple solution.  If you don't like it,  don't do it.  The beauty is you have choices.   Three nice choices to be exact.  What a wonderful hobby when you have more than one way to accomplish the same result in the end.  I can't wait to try them all.

[Paul Perry (Frostwave)]

+1 oldrocker.
If I was smarter, I'd use perf.
But, I'm not.. when it comes to remembering where everything is when I flip the board over.. so I use vero. We all do what we can.

[s.r.v.]

hey you forgot about point to point! and can some explain vero to me? if i have a vero layout do i have to just solder it to the holes shown in the layout, or do i have to make my own connections like perf board (which i love now btw)

[hubble]

when you use vero you dont have to drill any holes. you dont have to fiddle around with soldering hundreds of bits of wire to the underside. you dont have to etch and re-etch when traces go bad. you dont have to iron on transfers. as long as you are profecient at vero it is by far the easiest way to knock up a circuit.

this is exactly my thoughts on vero.

and i guess im talking more about padper hole.  i do agree that smallbear's padperhole is a lot nicer.  i think my main gripe with it is i would rather take my time to create a nice layout on vero, then just pop pieces in and solder than connect everything on the underside.  i get very confused looking at things backwards and upsidedown etc and try to follow a schem  . 

[oldrocker]

+1 oldrocker.
If I was smarter, I'd use perf.
But, I'm not.. when it comes to remembering where everything is when I flip the board over.. so I use vero. We all do what we can.

That's the best way to get to know the circuit upside down and backwards.  Literally.

[8mileshigh]

When I was young, I used to write backwards from left to right.  Now after doing perf and looking at schematics for 2 years, I find myself thinking backwards from time to time.  I have three identical thermal screening units at work and I catch myself numbering them backwards like the back of a potentiometer in my log books    My colleague thinks I'm going crazy, actually so do I.

[JHS]

I love perf board, there's nothing wrong with it. I've done all my builds on perf.

It's so easy to work with, put in the parts, like drawn in the schem, and connect them direct or with solid core wires.
I design a good perf layout in 5 minutes and if I want a professional look I use this eylets from the supermarket, like in the MENA-pedals.

Often I mod the circuits later, easy with perf board, more complicates with vero and pain in the ass if it's on a pcb.

JHS

[Joe Kramer]

Often I mod the circuits later, easy with perf board, more complicates with vero and pain in the ass if it's on a pcb.

Ditto, and this is a really good point too.  Swapping components is fairly easy with whatever method, but if you want to actually add parts or even whole new sub-circuits like tone controls, perf is ideal.  For my "designs," the state of completion only lasts until the next new brainstorm or the next phase of boredom comes along. . . .

Joe

[Fuzzy-Train]

I just got my PPH from SBE... it looks like really high quality stuff. The board is really thinck, the pads are square and look pre-tinned (I think??). Can't wait to et cracking on this stuff.

This thread is proving very helpful for a 1st tme perf-er like me. Thanks guys.

[jlullo]

alright alright, you've all convinced me... my next simple circuit i'll give a shot on perf!

[aron]

This thread shouldn't be a perfboard vs. vero vs. anything.

If you don't like one way, use another.