fuzzface not cleaning up when guitar turned down

[pinkjimiphoton]

i tried the search, but didn't have much luck.

i added the in34 ge diode to my fuzzface tonite, and it really seemed to help make the circuit more consistent.
but now when i turn my guitar down, it gets' quieter but is too crackly...i can't get the smooth overdriven and clean sounds with the guitar way down now.

would that be a bias problem? the fuzz sounds killer with the fuzz pot cranked, but even turning that down doesn't seem to really matter....still stays too fuzzy.

thanks for the help!!

[digi2t]

What`s your bias voltage set at? Maybe try a trimmer in place of a resistor so you can fine tune it.

Cheers,
Dino

[pinkjimiphoton]

hi dino, i forget where the bias is set, i DID use a trimmer...as i recall, i kinda cranked it up til the fuzz at max was almost synth-envelopey (for lack of a better word).
i gotta gig this afternoon, i'll try and pop her open and re-adjust it. i had a feeling it was something like that, thanks for the idea and info.

[Derringer]

where did you place the diode ?

[pinkjimiphoton]

between the emitter and base, as suggested here:

http://www.reocities.com/SunsetStrip/Studio/2987/britface.html

hooked it up as shown. no real tone changes or anything, just can't roll the guitar back to make it clean anymore. i probably should have reset the bias trimpot before i closed it up, but hindsight is 20/20. do ya think the diode is what's doing it? the fuzz sounds so good, i can live with it if i have to.
but i like to just leave it on, and do my clean to scream thing right from the guitar.

[digi2t]

The voltage at the collector of Q2 should be at 4.5 V, or about 1/2 the main voltage. This is the standard voltage for a fuzz Q2 bias, but then again, your ears will be the ultimate judge. 4.5v has always worked for me, and I've found that I have to re-bias when I change trannies, even same types can throw off the bias somewhat.

[pinkjimiphoton]

just cracked her open, and played with the bias pot some. where it seems to sound best is nearly cranked when the fuzz knob is full up.
when i turn down the guitar, if i play with the bias, i can get it in the ballpark, but still sounds like a broken diode clipper if i lean on the guitar with the volume rolled back.
gonna try a different in34a and see if that helps. if not, i'll put a switch on it so i can have it in circuit when temp is an issue, and just turn it off when i need it clean i guess.

and i gotta leave for a gig...so i gots about a half hour...better get my iron hot.

[imaradiostar]

Are there any other effects in line before the Fuzz Face?

jamie

[pinkjimiphoton]

no, i put the face first. it was working great, again, earlier...and it did make it thru the gig this afternoon. but it seems to me cuzza the inconsistent behaviour it's got either some cold solder, or the trannys are getting too loose in the sockets...if i play with it a little, it works better.

i believe (after messing with it earlier) that it's the sockets...i didn't have the row of sockets kind, (tho i picked up 2 40 hole ones yesterday) i used a chopped up ic socket.
i thought i had a good connection in there, but i'm suspecting that's the problem. gonna try and take it apart again tomorrow and play with it some.

thanks for the responses, sure it's something stupid.

[Steben]

Do you use matched trannies?
- bias not right
- gain to much (trannies)
- leaky trannies

[twabelljr]

and it did make it thru the gig this afternoon

That's good!

[pinkjimiphoton]

no, i didn't use matched trannys, i just used the ones in the sockets that seemed to go best with each other. i'm sure the gain is too high (call me sick, but i like that!!!) and cuz they were nec's i'm sure they are crazy leaky!! i'm narrowing it down tho, as i've played with the bias...there's a range in the pot where it goes from ok to KILLER...i left it a little below the killer point, which seems to be around 4.63 volts or so on q2.

i'm really thinking at this point it's bad solder (possible, tho i've re-heated any suspect joints and checked with a magnifying glass and my glasses on for any shorts, globbys etc)
or more likely bad connections from the kind of sockets i used...my bad, i didn't realize that chopped up ic sockets are so hard to get the tranny legs into solidly.

today, if i get a chance, i'm gonna pull it apart, remove the sockets i used and use some better ones (single row strips) that i got and see if the prob goes away.
if it does, which i'm kind of expecting, i think i should be good. i'll post back later if that turns out to be the problem.

the other thing i'm thinking is i may be getting some sub-sonic oscillation from using too big a cap on the input...seems a little too "farty" just on the lowest couple notes of the guitar.

thanks for all the help and suggestions guys!!

[imaradiostar]

Sounds good. I was just curious what transistors you're using.

I've found, as a general rule, that my silicon fuzz faces clean up a lot nicer than the germanium variety. The germanium fuzzes have less overall gain but tend toward a more midrangy sound and don't get as "sparkly" with the volume rolled back. I'll even go so far as to say that humbuckers never sound as good with a Fuzz Face as single coils. Of course they're all different so your mileage may vary!

jamie

[pinkjimiphoton]

this one is definitely "browner" than the silicon versions i've built...when ya turn it down, it usually works well, you can dial in a kinda brassy clean that's not too toppy.

i'm thinking more and more it's them bloody sockets i used..if i open it and squeeze them into the sockets, it seems to make a difference.

so i'm gonna fire up the iron and either use the new sockets i got, or just hardwire them into the veroboard itself.

i like it dialed in so it sustains well, it's really nice how it "blooms"...add an echo, and you can almost make it sound like the guitar's playing backwards.

back to work, i guess...lol

[petemoore]

  Distant probe technique:
   to measure for intermittent solder can be very difficult as it is hard to get them mitten to probe perfectly, teeny bit of oil or other has been known to interfere with probe conductivity etc.
  Measureing from the transistor lead through socket, solder/resistor/solder/wire, all those should add to the resistor value if soldered in well. + the easier access may allow some wiggling while maintaining probe points.
  A clip as the black lead probe is handy.

[pinkjimiphoton]

thanks pete.
gonna play with it some more.

[pinkjimiphoton]

WHOO HOO!!!! GOT IT!!

had two probs...one was the sockets, like i suspected. not only did i find some cold solder i had missed on one stupid pin, the transistors weren't really held in very securely by them, being cut down ic sockets.

i solder sucked the board, replaced with good sockets, seated the trannys in the new ones so they are IN there, re-added the diode, and i'm in business again.

clean to scream and all points in between, it's all good!! played with the bias a little too, so that q2 is getting almost 5 volts...seems to be where it sounds best. sustains for days, cleans up well,  and can nab virtually any point in between and it's all good.

thanks to everyone for all the help...lessons learned today...

never assume i'm right.


never use crappy ic sockets for transistors, they just don't grip well enough...

awesome...gonna go rip the bar down the street a new hole in it's....err...eardrums!!
thanks again!!!