So here's a crazy question...

[Pmelius]

I'm literally just getting into this...to the point where I just got my first soldering gun and multi-meter and i'm very, very excited to start tinkering.

My general question is, can I make pedals out of other random electronics? (audio-related or not)  Can I gain enough knowledge to alter other circuits to be used as pedals?  If so, what kind of circuits am I limited to?  Toys? Transistor radios? Walkie Talkies? Clocks?

The first item which brings curiosity is an old Silvertone solid-state amp (I got this for $5 *!!!!!* at a flea market).  Closest similarity I can find online is a Silvertone 100G.  Can I play with this thing and turn it into, maybe a pre-amp/drive pedal?  The circuit is small enough to fit into a pedal but there is a transformer involved.  There are so few components involved that it seems like something which is totally feasible, but again I'm 100% new to this.

Look forward to some interesting responses.

[aron]

Is the amp battery powered? If it plugs into the main outlet, I would say no, don't touch it until you understand a lot more. As long as we are talking low voltage - 9V battery voltages, you are pretty safe.

[antonis]

Playing has a lot of fun but it's results are only visible/audible..

You just kick a  ball and it gets in a random hole...

If you never take in mind combination of parameters like size of ball and hole, direction of hole and kick, distance of hole and force of kick e.t.c you'll always remain an "observer" and never be able to ensure any result at all..

Even if you've kicked the same ball under exactly the same circumstances over a trillion times allways leading to same result, it will be factual but not explicable... 

[smallbearelec]

I just got my first soldering gun and multi-meter

Did you actually buy a gun? Those are usually used in field-repair situations where you need to make one connection quickly. For bench work, an iron is usually preferred.

can I make pedals out of other random electronics? (audio-related or not)  Can I gain enough knowledge to alter other circuits to be used as pedals?

I think that by the time you know enough to do this, you'll be less likely to want to hack up old electronics for the purpose. For example, I sometimes see posts here saying: "I've hacked some old germanium transistors out of a radio". To me, the device would be worth more as a working antique. If you want to build a pedal that involves old components, it usually makes more sense to buy them or find modern subs.

[GibsonGM]

I have to agree...You COULD make some things out of an old radio or whatnot, but then it wouldn't have YOUR touch - you get pigeon-holed into using what is there rather than what you WANT the thing to have.   That's too limiting.  The parts we use are really pretty cheap, so it seems much more preferable to just start from a known design and bread board, tweak, and assemble!   I leave the hacking to if we're in a plane crash and I need to make an emergency transmitter from the parts at hand, LOL...

Looks like your next purchase should be a (or 5, 10) breadboard, Pm!   Welcome to the forum - it wasn't a dumb question, by the way! 

[Granny Gremlin]

You guys mention salvaging parts out of olkd electronics, the other option is to mod the device (circuit bending).  That is a great way to learn some basics.

[Pmelius]

I just got my first soldering gun and multi-meter

Did you actually buy a gun? Those are usually used in field-repair situations where you need to make one connection quickly. For bench work, an iron is usually preferred.

Sorry, no.  30W Soldering Iron. Just the $10 wal-mart kind until I get a little more dedicated.

[Pmelius]

Is the amp battery powered? If it plugs into the main outlet, I would say no, don't touch it until you understand a lot more. As long as we are talking low voltage - 9V battery voltages, you are pretty safe.

It is not.  It plugs into the main outlet.  I know that I need to discharge filter capacitors before doing any work.  Trust me, I don't intend on tinkering with anything that I know can be harmful to me without doing plenty of research first. 

For example, I bought a very old 5-tube radio which I was going to try to turn into a little amp until I did research and learned that I would be better off just getting it back to full operating condition because turning it into an amplifier could shock me.  Now I just need to replace the capacitor and a couple tubes in that piece and see where I'm at after that's said and done.  I no longer intend to turn that into anything but a refurbished version of itself.

[Pmelius]

Playing has a lot of fun but it's results are only visible/audible..

You just kick a  ball and it gets in a random hole...

If you never take in mind combination of parameters like size of ball and hole, direction of hole and kick, distance of hole and force of kick e.t.c you'll always remain an "observer" and never be able to ensure any result at all..

Even if you've kicked the same ball under exactly the same circumstances over a trillion times allways leading to same result, it will be factual but not explicable... 

I really appreciate this analogy hahaha

[Pmelius]

I have to agree...You COULD make some things out of an old radio or whatnot, but then it wouldn't have YOUR touch - you get pigeon-holed into using what is there rather than what you WANT the thing to have.   That's too limiting.  The parts we use are really pretty cheap, so it seems much more preferable to just start from a known design and bread board, tweak, and assemble!   I leave the hacking to if we're in a plane crash and I need to make an emergency transmitter from the parts at hand, LOL...

Looks like your next purchase should be a (or 5, 10) breadboard, Pm!   Welcome to the forum - it wasn't a dumb question, by the way! 

I feel like maybe my intention isn't being fully grasped.  I intend to start with general research/small projects with direction before moving onto this kind of experimentation.  My hope is that once knowledge is gained, I can take a circuit and "mold" it to be something that effects my guitar's output signal to make some weird and funky sounds.  Maybe stumble on to something new or strange!

You guys mention salvaging parts out of olkd electronics, the other option is to mod the device (circuit bending).  That is a great way to learn some basics.

This is what I would like to do! 

Like this amp I'm talking about, could I some how change the amount of power it currently needs to operate and alter the amount of power it outputs and turn this into an effect pedal?  It seems like something I should be able to do in theory, even if it isn't entirely practical...I just don't know exactly what the effect would be.

[Ben Lyman]

Ya man, I'd say leave that practice amp as is, it's probably gonna give u more years of fun and maybe be worth something some day that way.

Don't even try to fix your tube radio yet, it can still shock you no matter what.

Wall Mart soldering iron: throw it away, it is not 30 watts, I learned this the hard way and I want to pass my lesson on before you suffer the same frustration as I did.

sorry to sound like such a Debbie Downer but on the bright side, welcome to the best place on Earth to learn about pedal building!

Getcherself a breadboard and start with a Bazz Fuss or any of Small Bear's project tutorials, they are the best! A year ago I could only drop components into a prefab PCB and drop solder on them, now I can build almost any fuzz pedal from scratch by reading a schematic, who knows what's next for me 

[Granny Gremlin]

Like this amp I'm talking about, could I some how change the amount of power it currently needs to operate and alter the amount of power it outputs

Not really.  Not without seriously changing what it sounds like.... though just because the thing takes mains power doesn't mean that it uses 120V (or more) internally; there's a power supply in there converting mains power to whatever is required by the device - it could be running at something close to 9V DC inside if it is solid state. ... if it is early solid state then likely closer to 12-24V DC; maybe even bipolar supply; or as high as 36V.   You'd need to add a charge pump such as the Madbean Road Rage board (will get you +/- 18V IIRC) to get either/both of those things going on from a standard 9V supply.

Stay away from tube stuff, at least for starters.

[R.G.]

First off, I'm glad to see someone else discover that they can do things with electronics and dive in. Welcome to what can be a life altering and life long passion.

Now for the hard part. You're not going to learn a good foundation of electronics asking questions on forums. There's a fair amount of raw studying needed if you want to get past the "kick the ball and watch where it goes" stage. Not that you can't *also* just do some kicking, but you're going to have to study too.

Actually, the things we learn most solidly are things we NEED to find out so we can do something we really want to do. Wanting to build electronics turns the mental effort and practice into fun. It's best if you can do both. And don't get discouraged at finding that there are some things that take a lot of work to get right, and take several generations of backing up to get what you need. You're going to run into needing to know Ohm's law, for instance, and RLC networks as well as soldering skills before you can do any circuit bending worth the name. So don't get discouraged when you find you're only part way up the mountain. I'm only part way up the mountain, and I've been doing this my entire adult life, including professionally.

You've seen a few warnings about AC power mains voltages and high voltages in tube equipment already. And you're (quite reasonably) wondering about increasing and decreasing power, changing circuit operation, repackaging, and are making guesses (i.e. discharging caps) about how to be safe. Here's another analogy for you. Imagine the smartest, most capable scientist in the world in about 1900 to 1920. This guy is a flat-out genius, and is as schooled and practiced as he can be.  Then put him in the otherwise-unoccupied control room in a modern nuclear power reactor facility, with the reactor fully checked out and working perfectly, just purring along under its designed conditions. What happens?

If he's lucky, his first touch of a few controls makes the reactor scram and shutdown safely. If he's unlucky, he creates a large, crater that glows dimly blue for several hundred years. And all his native ability can't make up for the fact that he has no inkling that nuclear fission is possible, or what a reactor is or how it might conceivably work. Give the same guy a year of reactor theory and some education about the controls and he's perfectly capable of running it - it even becomes boring pretty quickly.

What you don't know can get you killed when you deal with high voltage and power electricity, no matter how clever you are. So leave anything with AC mains power, or just high voltage DC, strictly alone until you have enough knowledge accumulated to know what is dangerous and what isn't. It's relatively hard to get hurt with voltages under 24V, although high currents like from car batteries can get ugly, but with AC mains voltages and grounding issues, you can be dead before you realize you shouldn't have grabbed that.

Play safe - I hate to lose enthusiastic beginners. We need all we can get.

[smallbearelec]

I feel like maybe my intention isn't being fully grasped.  I intend to start with general research/small projects with direction before moving onto this kind of experimentation.  My hope is that once knowledge is gained, I can take a circuit and "mold" it to be something that effects my guitar's output signal to make some weird and funky sounds.

[/quote]

This is different from hacking up an existing piece of gear, and it actually is done routinely in the effects world. See next comment.

Like this amp I'm talking about, could I some how change the amount of power it currently needs to operate and alter the amount of power it outputs and turn this into an effect pedal?

Many people have re-worked parts of the circuits of commercial amplifiers, for example, and turned them into pedals! Examples that come to mind immediately are some of the "amp/cab-sim" projects at runoffgroove.com. There are also a variety of "tube pedal" builds. Some have deliberately been designed to work at low voltages, while others use typical tube amp power. Other people here have given you good advice about knowing what you are getting into, so do enjoy the journey, safely.

[GibsonGM]

I did grasp what you meant, Pmelius...but I think R.G. and steve said it better...there is so much to learn before you could turn a radio (or VCR, ha ha) into a NEW and unusual effect...it's probably cheaper and easier to buy some 10 cent transistors, resistor kit, capacitor kit...and make your own stuff from scratch.

After learning and understanding, you EASILY COULD make an oscillator out of an old radio - noise maker. But you could do that with 1 transistor 3 resistors and 2 caps on the breadboard faster.   

Circuit bending is cool, and don't let me tell you not to try (on battery equipment!), only saying I hope you'll do 'the basics' - build stuff that there are readily available schematics for, then modify THOSE things!  They're already set up to take you in the direction you want to go...if you understand a square wave oscillator and how a phaser works, for instance - you can then dream up a new sound and pop it right together...as mentioned - engineers have already taken classic amps and made "work-alike" pedals from the designs...and WE are fully capable of further modifying those And making new stuff by stepping past them, too....

[PRR]

AFAICT, the Silvertone 100 *is* a guitar amplifer. Put it in your bedroom and use it.

Some *other* Silvertones have gone up in value over the decades since they were cheap xmas-gift junk. This may also. It is certainly a better prospect than my Kent, same size but HOT-CHASSIS (shock hazard).

However, and at your own risk.... take it apart. I bet there is not much in there. It may be a transformer, 3x5 board, and a speaker in a chipboard box. Transplant the transformer and board to "a pedal". However wall-power transformers IN pedals are usually bad news. Bulky and they spray hum field.

It is possible the board will run on 9V DC from a pedal supply. It is just as possible it wants the other polarity or a different voltage. Clearly you are not yet far enough down the path to for-sure know that you won't let the smoke out.

And in the process you lose the "flavor" of that $1.33 speaker and chipboard cabinet.

[Pmelius]

sorry to sound like such a Debbie Downer but on the bright side, welcome to the best place on Earth to learn about pedal building!

Getcherself a breadboard and start with a Bazz Fuss or any of Small Bear's project tutorials, they are the best! A year ago I could only drop components into a prefab PCB and drop solder on them, now I can build almost any fuzz pedal from scratch by reading a schematic, who knows what's next for me 

No worries!  This is the kind of advice I need!

First off, I'm glad to see someone else discover that they can do things with electronics and dive in. Welcome to what can be a life altering and life long passion.

Now for the hard part. You're not going to learn a good foundation of electronics asking questions on forums. There's a fair amount of raw studying needed if you want to get past the "kick the ball and watch where it goes" stage. Not that you can't *also* just do some kicking, but you're going to have to study too.

Actually, the things we learn most solidly are things we NEED to find out so we can do something we really want to do. Wanting to build electronics turns the mental effort and practice into fun. It's best if you can do both. And don't get discouraged at finding that there are some things that take a lot of work to get right, and take several generations of backing up to get what you need. You're going to run into needing to know Ohm's law, for instance, and RLC networks as well as soldering skills before you can do any circuit bending worth the name. So don't get discouraged when you find you're only part way up the mountain. I'm only part way up the mountain, and I've been doing this my entire adult life, including professionally.

You've seen a few warnings about AC power mains voltages and high voltages in tube equipment already. And you're (quite reasonably) wondering about increasing and decreasing power, changing circuit operation, repackaging, and are making guesses (i.e. discharging caps) about how to be safe. Here's another analogy for you. Imagine the smartest, most capable scientist in the world in about 1900 to 1920. This guy is a flat-out genius, and is as schooled and practiced as he can be.  Then put him in the otherwise-unoccupied control room in a modern nuclear power reactor facility, with the reactor fully checked out and working perfectly, just purring along under its designed conditions. What happens?

If he's lucky, his first touch of a few controls makes the reactor scram and shutdown safely. If he's unlucky, he creates a large, crater that glows dimly blue for several hundred years. And all his native ability can't make up for the fact that he has no inkling that nuclear fission is possible, or what a reactor is or how it might conceivably work. Give the same guy a year of reactor theory and some education about the controls and he's perfectly capable of running it - it even becomes boring pretty quickly.

What you don't know can get you killed when you deal with high voltage and power electricity, no matter how clever you are. So leave anything with AC mains power, or just high voltage DC, strictly alone until you have enough knowledge accumulated to know what is dangerous and what isn't. It's relatively hard to get hurt with voltages under 24V, although high currents like from car batteries can get ugly, but with AC mains voltages and grounding issues, you can be dead before you realize you shouldn't have grabbed that.

Play safe - I hate to lose enthusiastic beginners. We need all we can get.

Really, thank you for this.  Very encouraging and helpful reply.  "You're not going to learn a good foundation of electronics asking questions on forums."  I've just been so excited and curious about this with no one else to nerd out about it with, so I had to at least throw out this feeler to see what I'm getting myself into!  Haha

[deadastronaut]

as other have said,

first purchases should really be 

:breadboard

:2 jack sockets

a good 9v tip negative supply.

a few 'common components' and your off on a world of possibilities....

avoid the mains stuff for now big time..

might be worth just building a couple of pedals first to get your feet wet
this will give you a little experience with actually building,  and enjoying your efforts..
and have a bit of fun..
its a real joy when you have your first built pedal in your hands and it works..
you came to the right place btw, this site and the people in it is the best.
have fun. stay safe..