Flying Pan layout / schematic debugging

[Mark Hammer]

After printing out the layout and redrafted schem and looking it over last night, a few things popped out at me.

First there appear to be a few incomplete traces in the PCB layout.  Those who simply transfer it to copper, etch and populate are likely to be disappointed if no steps are taken to correct it.  Not a criticism of Mike.  Hell, there is *enough* to contend with there on that board that two small errors is pretty damn good for a first outing.

Second, while a nice compact board, I'm concerned about the trace width and pad size.  Very likely a non-starter for someone like me using glossy photo paper for etch resist.  But based on experience as well, my hunch is that many of those people less experienced with PnP might end up with a number of traces not transferring well.  Obviously, if your intent is simply to beta-test it and then use photo-resist for producing boards for yourself, this is a non-issue.  In my own case, though, I may be a bit slower in testing this than I first thought - I'm guessing that I'll have a lot of false starts before I end up with a board in decent enough shape for populating.

Third, (and thankfully this is not about your layout but about the circuit itself) I'm curious about the difference between the two LFOs on board.  Is this purely a difference between what sort of current is needed to drive a pair of LEDs vs a pair of FETs, or is there a difference in waveform as well?

[puretube]

free information block:

[mikeb]

After printing out the layout and redrafted schem and looking it over last night, a few things popped out at me.

First there appear to be a few incomplete traces in the PCB layout.

Thanks for the heads up! I'm working on fixing those now, and will resend the package to those who have got the first version.

Second, while a nice compact board, I'm concerned about the trace width and pad size.

I've made numerous PCBs with the same pad size (70mil/35mil hole) and track width (20 mil), only some needing a little fixing up (and that was because I couldn't find my good 'hot' iron) ..... I agree with you, but if I used bigger pads and traces it would take up much more room, or need to be double sided.

Thanks

Mike

[Mark Hammer]

Again, the spacing thing is not a criticism.  Rather, it is a requirement for providing a board-size convenience.  I mention it simply because I'm a cheap bastard I tend to work entirely with glossy photo paper these days (for transferring PCB layouts to copper), and traces of that gauge will most assuredly come out in desparate need of a pen touch-up using paper.  That's MY weakness, not yours, mate.

[Paul Marossy]

If you do a cross reference search at NTE, they list one device for a truckload of different devices that it is supposed to replace. In other words, one NPN transistor offered by NTE is a "replacement" for probably 100 different kinds of NPN transistors, and so on.

As it was said, they are more of an approximation than direct replacements. Most of the time, they seem to work alright though.

[mikeb]

Again, the spacing thing is not a criticism.  Rather, it is a requirement for providing a board-size convenience.  I mention it simply because I'm a cheap bastard I tend to work entirely with glossy photo paper these days (for transferring PCB layouts to copper), and traces of that gauge will most assuredly come out in desparate need of a pen touch-up using paper.  That's MY weakness, not yours, mate.

I would be super-critical of myself, I think , apologies for reacting negatively .... I'm reworking the layout to increase the track size where possible. Granted, it will be a difficult build, however once it's up and happening I was going to see if there would be enough interest to get PCBs professionally made (free ones to the people who assist with problem finding out of the initial group), cost might be in the US$15 - US$20 region (depending on numbers). I'm trying to produce something that will work ok for DIY (PNP blue etc) methods, and also would be a reasonable manufactured board. It looks like I'll need to put my money where my mouth is and do up a board using PNP myself too ....

The package will go out sometime tomorrow ... or that should be 'today' as it's after 2am here!

Mike

[Marcus Dahl]

(briefly reconsiders letting slip a chance of becoming millionaire by selling Flying Pan clones. shakes head as realises is in same fantasy league as being a decent jazz pianist or growing his hair very long again)



Mike

That maybe true. I don't know, but I do know of a number of people interested in those. Unkleslam at www.tonefactor.com would be interested, I'm sure.

[mikeb]

Brad is cool ... but I doubt I'd be interested in selling via distributors too much. With the state of the Aussie dollar, it's hard enough making any money selling to the rest of the world. Anyway, my main thing is to get it available for DIYers!

Mark, your mailbox is full....

Mike

[mikeb]

Ok, I've emailed the v1_2 package link out to people ... this fixes everything, including the 6% scaling error with Adobe 6.

For others, you can see a bottom layer only version of this here (you'll need Adobe 6)...
http://prophecysound.com/temphost/fppcbholesv1_2.pdf
... single sided, save for a handful of links and three flying wire connections. Not too shabby!

Mike

[Bill Bergman]

Hey Mike,
looks like a fun one to build. The holes on the pads look a little too big although. I drill holes just barely big enough for the componet leads to fit thru. Those holes would leave a lot of slop between the lead and pad for the solder.

[mikeb]

The holes are all 35mil, but they get a little warped when I do the Protel -> Adobe pdf transfer ... keep in mind that this layout has been done for DIYers, and will be tweaked before it goes to production (if it ever does); people can choose to use whatever drill bit size they like. Also, I provided a non-hole version as part of the package.

Cheers

Mike

[Bill Bergman]

Thanks Mike. Might have to try this one.

[Marcos - Munky]

Wow, I was thinking about to give a try to it, but is very complicated for me .

[mikeb]

Well, I'm really hoping a few people (or even one!) will build this up and give me feedback. I just simply don't have time to do much with it myself in the near future - when it's done it should be straightforward enough, just  a little time consuming.

Mike

[Marcus Dahl]

Brad is cool ... but I doubt I'd be interested in selling via distributors too much. With the state of the Aussie dollar, it's hard enough making any money selling to the rest of the world. Anyway, my main thing is to get it available for DIYers!

That's cool Mike. I was just thinking of those who are scared to pickup a soldering iron.  :oops:

I don't think it matters what dollar it is. It's still difficult to get by doing what we do... :wink:

[john_h]

Reviving an ancient thread here. I stumbled across this in my efforts to find a good diy flying pan. Ibanez since reissued it, but even those go for amounts of money I could never justify and it seems the BYOC soaring skillet kit is out of production. Im really interested in this project (aka I have wanted a flying pan for ages and could never afford one), so if anyone has mikeb's pcb layout/schematic package kicking around still, I would love to take a crack at it!

[Mark Hammer]

Be careful what you wish for.  The panning is NOT subtle, and IS headache inducing.  Moving the phasing around is "interesting"....for about 15 seconds, but needs to be far more subtle to be musically useful, or even tolerable.  Unfortunately, the circuit only provides for panning rate, and not panning depth.  A nice gentle wobble/jiggle to the panning would be far more useful, as would panning the phasing effect, rather than just having the same phasing show up on this side, then that.  What it needs is an updating, not a reissue of the original.

[jimilee]

Looking forward to this. BYOC has the only other clone I've seen / built. I'm all about some phasers.