Which first in signal - buffer or clean boost?

[Governor]

I recently built a clone of the little black buffer and have it at the start of my signal chain on my board (after wah and Octafuzz). Works great, I have about 8 pedals after it which are all true bypass, the CC delay at the end is almost always on too.

I use an EQD plumes as a solo boost into my OCD for most things but it would be good to have a basic DB boost on hand when I'm using the Plumes and OCD stacked for higher gain as well as a boost by EQD Hoof to maintain that fuzz sound for solos since the Plumes mid hump kind of takes that away.

I also have a Fat Boost clone that I built (not on my board at the moment) which is a great DB boost pedal. I'm looking a putting the same little black buffer circuit board into the fat boost pedal via a toggle switch which can will bypass the buffer if needed.

Question is : does the buffer circuit go before or after boost circuit inside the pedal?

[Vivek]

JHS little black buffer is a unity gain schematic with an Opamp. It would distort for input signals more than ~4vp. It has output impedance in the order of 100 ohms or less and input impedance around 800k

Fulltone Fat boost clone is a FET muamp circuit with about 50k output impedance and input impedance around 400k

Having the buffer before the boost will not drive the boost harder. The differences between input impedance will be slight.


Having the buffer after the boost will allow you to drive longer lengths of cable

[Governor]

Thanks is mate, this would only apply when the boost is engaged right?  I plan on having the boost turned on and off via the foot switch (true bypass).  Thanks for the info, having the buffer after the boost makes sense.

[Vivek]

I don't see too much benefit of having any of these circuits before/after the other

Or having them switchable.


But if the little black buffer was modified to have some gain, things would be different.

It would be interesting also to have the buffer run at higher voltage

[amptramp]

You may be looking for a Tillman amplifier with an input impedance of a megohm, an output impedance of 6800 ohms and a gain around -3.  It is the lowest parts count solution.



There are people who have built this into a cable with R1, R2 and Q1 on one end and the rest of the circuitry on the other.  Some people have built R1, R2 and Q1 into the guitar with the rest of the circuitry on the output end of the cable as the first unit on the pedalboard (but not a stompbox - the output circuitry is never going to be switched off while playing).

[Governor]

I haven't heard of the Tillman, it's really interesting how some incorporate into guitar and cable.  I wonder how a fuzz face type circuit would behave though with this in front of it.  I guess that the advantage of having it a stand alone box that can be bypassed if ever needed.

[Vivek]

I forgot to ask right up front

What are you expecting out of your 2 pedals in one ?

Extremely clean output ?

High Vpp output that's undistorted ?

Distorted sound ?


High output distorted sound that pushes next pedal/amp into new territory.

Ability to drive long cables ?

Ability to not load the pickup?


And when the second pedal kicks in, do you want
More distortion ?
More output ?

More output and more distortion?

More output, more distortion and some tone shaping for solo ?

[GibsonGM]

If you own any Boss pedals, they're buffered when they are not engaged...you could mess around with one and see if you prefer a buffer pre or post FX...

Or just wire up 2 buffers on BB, and try them before & after...low parts count and a good experiment to see what each does to your tone.

[Governor]

I have the little black buffer on my board now after Wah and fuzz in a small enclosure.  It works well, adds some clarity, I just want the buffer to retain my signal driving 10 true bypass pedals and 20ft cable.  I don't have any boss pedals, they are all true bypass until one is engaged.

With the boost, I just want a simple DB clean boost as I already have a TS type pedal for a mids boost.  I like how the fat boost you can adjust the gain and volume dials to best suit either humbuckers or single coil pickups.

Building the buffer circuit into the boost would save some space on my board.

That's pretty much my objective.

[GibsonGM]

I think it's going to be "to taste"...your preference.

If you goose your amp with a booster (like, punching a tube amp with it), then I'd put that just before the amp....but that's MY setup, and yours is going to be up to you.  There are no real rules for much of this stuff!     My crap is bright enough, I WANT the 20' of cord and a non TBP wah to warm it up a bit...

[antonis]

Question is : does the buffer circuit go before or after boost circuit inside the pedal?

ΙΜΗΟ, answer comes only after in depth knowledge of what purpose buffer and booster serve..

[Governor]

Yeah I might do some more testing and try with the fat boost after all of my fuzzes and OD and before modulation (keeping the buffer at the start).