Batteries

[Chris R]

I've read a few posts proclaiming that one type of Battery is better for certain circuits. I've only used Duracell's in my pedals.. what are the other types of batteries ? and why/how do some work "better" than others in say a FF ?

C

[Ge_Whiz]

Different types of battery produce subtly different voltages. While we are used to quoting 'cells' at 1.5 V, some produce as little as 1.2 V - it's just a matter of the chemistry going on inside them.

Eric Johnson reckons he can tell the difference between different battery types in effects. He probably can. But I still don't buy his music.  

You could try zinc carbon or zinc chloride cells, or even save the environment and use NiCd or NiMH rechargeables. They don't last as long, but in analogue pedals pulling less than 1mA, the battery life is often less than the supply life, i.e. years.

[Mark Hammer]

Rip apart a 9v battery and one of the things you will see is differences in the types of cells they include (all 9v batteries have 6 cells inside), and qualitative differences in the nature of the contacts between cells.  Industrial-quality Duracell alkalines have 6 full-fledged metal-cased batteries (a little smaller than a AAA) lined up end to end with spot-welded connections between them.  Cheap carbon-zinc 9v from the dollar store have 6 slugs, stacked up horizontally with a simple proximity connection.  The quality of the connection between cells plays a role in how much current can be delivered at any time, and some types of effects - fuzzes in particular - can provide different tones depending on how current-starved they are.  That's not the only parameter to be concerned about, but it gives you some idea about how what it is a given battery type does well (or not so well) will depend on aspects of its construction that are not visible from the outside.

Personally, I recharge 9v alkalines, although you can do it with carbon-zinc too, though with poorer results.  Maybe 1 in 25 pops in the process, and what pops is simply the plastic wrapping on an individual cell from heat build-up.  It sounds loud but nothing has been ruined and no one hurt.  

I do not recommend this to amateurs since there are fairly stern guidelines for doing it and for what you can expect.  These are likely the same reasons why battery manufacturers try to draw a nice thick boundary between "rechargeable" and "nonrechargeable" batteries - it's simply too complicated to explain to the general public.

- you can NOT simply leave them unattended overnight as you would NiCad or NiMH batteries; I rarely leave them in for more than an hour at a time to avoid heat buildup; given that I've had some charge up to well over 10v there are also no natural voltage limits to alkaline recharging as there are for Nicads - much like goldfish that die if you just keep feeding them, these will just keep charging until they pop.

- you can NOT expect them to recharge if they have run down much past 7vdc; this is different than Nicads which need you to hard discharge them to facilitate full recharging without a "memory effect"

- they will not likely have the same lifespan when recharged as they did originally; i.e., maybe you CAN bring them back to 9.6v from 7v, but it will take less time to decline back to 7v than it did originally.  They can also only be recharged a couple of times before they give up the ghost.

- this probably requires a better charger, and preferably one with some sort of indicator.

I demand fairly light duty from my pedal batteries.  I don't gig, and the reason I need lots of batteries is because I have a lot of pedals.  So, what I want from a battery is the capacity to work when I plug in that pedal for 15 minutes 2 months from now.  I also tend not to stick indicator LEDs in my pedals so there is less current drain anyways.  If you need more than that, this may not work for you.

[zachary vex]

hey mark, mind sending me an email?  i can't find your addy and i'd like to exchange some ideas about something.

[Ansil]

hey chris.  i find that the carbon ones are the way to go in distortion units.. i have never had sound like this until i used one of them.
i put in a regualr alkaline and i was like. umm where did my tone go pleas.

[Johan]

I go with the 9 volt Lithium batteries that are made for smokedetectors...cost tvice as much as duracell's but lasts five times as long...they have a HUGE capacity..around 1200mAh as compared to around 300mAh for regular alkaline's or 150mAh for rechargeble's....they also seem to recover well after being used, meaning they just dont seem to run out when used in a fuzz/distortion box at all, and I've had the same one in my Boss DD-3 for the last 15 gigs and it still seems fresh...with a fresh durracell I never do more than 3 gigs before changing in the DD-3...( the DD-3 pulls about 40mAh, so a regular alkaline dies within 10 hours in that one...)

Johan

[Hal]

i've also noticed small diferanced between different types of batteries on certian effects, even though i think it has to do with the voltage dilivered more than anything...

I was laughing at danelctro's battery that said "vintage power source," but it plugged it in and it actually sounded better than the alkaline that was in the effect (easy face) before...

weirddddd

[drew]

The last time I was at Target, they had a huge battery display set up near the entrance with two-packs of 9v batteries for $1.00. Can't do much better than that (unless you buy hundreds at a time, I suppose...)


drew
www.toothpastefordinner.com

[morthek]

it´s Ok to use 12v(little cilindric) batteries which are weak so they became 9v?

[Mark Hammer]

Using the small 12v batteries may be ok for some things but not for others.  For instance, some pedals (especially those that should NOT distort) can sound better with 12v than with a lesser supply.  Remember, though, that it is a question of current as well as voltage, and smaller batteries cannot deliver a lot of current for very long.

[Jered]

I agree with Johan, the lithium 's cost twice as much but last four times as long as an energizer or duracell. The only thing that I use batteries for anymore is my protoboards, everything else has a power supply.  All three of my protoboards have had lithiums on them for over a year and they still have 9+ volts. I use Ultralife lithium power cells.
 Honestly a few years back I tried different battery types in three different circuits, a fuzz face, a Dist +, and the Minibooster and I swear my brother and I could not hear a definite, repeatable difference. Other than when a battery was dying, then it became obvious.
 My guess is you need to remove the screws in the bottom plate and use rubber bands to hold the bottom plate on.  :^)
 Jered

[Nasse]

:oops: My experience about batteries is dated because I dont play in a band :wink: But ever since I started using nine volt batteries I learned there is huge difference between batteries of different make. There is an old local Finnish hit song where the words say "...Finland is the most expensive country in Europe..." or something. Everything here is pricey, and certain things are overpriced. Alkaline batteries are too expensive here, they are marketed as "power" batteries and claimed to be many times longer lasting than average batteries. I have not noticed any benefit using alkaline batteries in effects that have low current consumption. I dont use alkaline ones rarely all. Some cheapest batteries are crap, but I have one favorite brand that is moderately priced and lasts long.

Some 30 years ago Japanese National Hi-Top batteries (red ones) were absolutely the best ones, they were regular batteries but lasted twice as long as alkaline batteries in a wah-wah pedal. Maybe they changed the recipe later, the text changed to "Made in Belgium" and the quality was not the same any more. Dont know if they are still made.

I have said this before but no one maybe noticed: I quess it would be sometimes better in certain circuits like all-opamp designs use two batteries instead of single one. They might last longer than two batteries used one after one. But that is another story. Maybe if I make a pedal like Distortion+ or something I should test my idea...

[sirkut]

Being that I chain up to 20 effects pedals into 4 channels to create some chaotic noise, I never use batteries. I've found that the Godlyke power all is simply amazing. Powers up my fender blender without any hum! Plus you can daisy chain a good deal of pedals with just one. Only thing I use batteries (the dead ones that I've collected) is a poor man's battery snap.