fuzz before vibe?

[b_rogers]

ok so i have several fuzzes, multi face, tb mkii prof, siliface etc...a sweetsound ultravibe, rm octavia. i hear folks say they like the fuzz before the vibe, but when i run the fuzz first it sounds like ass..like a really bad phaser, nothing like BOG or the woodstock sound. is this a impedance mismatch? did RM sprinkle a magic buffer on his fuzzes to make this work?  dont get me wrong i can get close with the effects in this order...

vibe, fuzz, octave  or
vibe,octave,fuzz    

but the vibe just isnt as in your face as the bog,woodstock tone

any remedies?  buffer? if a buffer will work, where do i get the schem?

thanks for all your help guys

Brent

[RDV]

I emailed Dave Fox about this and he said that the Hendrix, Trower, Marino sound is the Fuzzface into the Univibe into a slightly overdriven amp. He also said though that you have to either back off the guitar volume to clean up the FF a bit or actually back the gain on the FF down. His sound samples demonstrate that he does know what he's talking about. He's a super nice guy who has answered every email I've ever sent him also. Here's his website: http://www.foxroxelectronics.com/

Sound samples of the CC2 with good vibe sounds: http://www.foxroxelectronics.com/Audio%20Samples.html

Regards

RDV

[b_rogers]

thanks rdv..i guess im just used to diming that gain knob i never thought to back it down...i was thinking i needed  match the output of the fuzz to the input of the vibe impedance wise, or it was the axis was matched to the vibe a little better...sometimes the answer is right in front of you...

[RDV]

I just barely back off the guitar volume which seems to do the trick. Univibes and FFs are hard to get a sound with IMO. It's a one trick pony combo, so much so, I rarely use them live. I guess I need to break down and put together a pedalboard. I've got a carpet covered piece of plywood now, but my kittens have been using it as a bed/scratchboard.

Bad Kittens!

RDV

[RDV]

After participating in this thread, I decided to get out all my FF circuits I built(& my aNaLoG.MaN Sunface) about a year ago when I first started DIYing. I tried them all with my Eastvibe to see if any of them would get that nice round warm vibe tone. The chain was: guitar - FF - Easyvibe - Ibanez ADL Analog delay - Dual Ruby amp(maybe 1 watt) - 2-10" cab. I also used the same cheapo(non-alkaline) 9v battery in each.
Here's the results:

1. Ge FF with 2n404 tran. - Pretty good but kind of muffled. I think I might have damaged the transistors while soldering, kinda quiet & muffled overall.

2. A.M. Sunface - Too loud & hairy to get a good vibe tone with the vibe(not Mike Piera's fault, I ordered it with hi-gain 2N508 tran).

3. Si FF with 2N4401 @ Q1 & 2N5089 @ Q2 - Also not good, amazingly enough it sounds just like the Sunface. Makes the vibe over-vibe.

4. Si FF with Smallbear's BC108C sound-a-likes - Ding Ding Ding, this one sounds great with the Easyvibe. I have no idea why, but it really does get a nice vibe tone. I can't remember, but I may have used AMZ's YAFF values on this one. This was not the most impressive FF I'd built I thought at the time, but I think I'll have to give this one a go with the Easyvibe. Hell, I may put them in the same box if it works out well live. A JIMI-IN-A-BOX.

I stopped trying to get FFs to sound good with my rig(JCM900) cause it just wasn't happening. I figured a Plexi type Marshall was the only way it would work. I guess I'm gonna give it one more try with the Easyvibe though.

RDV

[Bluesrock]

Brent,

In my experience, the only way to make the univibe sound good is with the RM Axis Fuzz and the guitar volume down. The axis pushes the higher freq. and makes it more brilliant, it has more presence. BTW, this is with the following FX order: Wah, Axis, Vibe!

Best Regards,
Koen

[b_rogers]

thanks for all your responses guys...i tried all my fuzzes again before the vibe and couldnt get it to work right...BUT..  i tried my HWY 89 (awesome pedal) first as a boost, then vibe, into si FF and got a bit closer but i lost the ability to clean up with the vol knob. guess its time to throw together the AXIS!!  i have always wanted one of those but just havent gotten around to building one.  what are you guys opinion of the RM axis?  should i build that or the unidrive?

[RDV]

Try the Axis. Can one have too many fuzzes?

RDV

[b_rogers]

fuzz rules...when i tell people i use a fuzz they look at me funny, like who uses a fuzz anymore?  but after hearing my rig they always want me to build them one!

[phillip]

Do you have any Boss pedals?  I was thinking that you could maybe put a Boss pedal in between the Fuzz Face and Univibe since the Boss pedals have a pair of buffers that are always in the signal chain, even when bypassed.

Whatever you do, don't put a Boss (or any other pedal with the JFET switch that leaves buffers in the signal chain all the time) before a Fuzz Face or ToneBender because those two buffers seem to drive the Fuzz Face into next week...it starts sounding like a metal zone...dreadful.  I'm not sure if a Boss pedal will have the same effect on a Univibe or not.

Phillip

[b_rogers]

does a ts-5 have a buffer? i wish i could jam out all day but ive got 3 acres to PUSH MOW today or the snakes are gonna take over!!  BTW phillip i love your site...its one of the ones that made me want to build my own effects

[dr]

....try this:guitar>octavia>wah>vibe>fuzz>amp....in that order.

[phillip]

Yep the TS-5 also has the JFET switching similar to the Boss pedals

Phillip

[b_rogers]

man its hot out there...i will try the ts-5 first and see if that helps. i cant remember if ive tried that order before DR but i will tonite.  BTW i heard some really cool clips on harmony central from LOVEPEDAL newest offering called BELIEVE. its a clean boost into fuzz with only one knob. sounded really good. check it out if you can..

[Bluesgeetar]

Hey b.  What kind of amp you using?  I also have a Sweetsound Ultravibe with Sweet footcontroller.  I don't even use my fuzzes with it.  I just turn up the amp and let the tubes provide the overdrive sound.  The ultravibe doesn't seem to like SS amps for driven type sounds nor does it like small amps with small speakers.  Gotta go at least 12".  I'll send you some sound samples as soon as i'm through upgrading my DAW.  Waiting on my two Opteron 246 to come from Newegg.  Dual CPUs!  Sweet!

[b_rogers]

i have a PV classic 50 410 right now but i am trying to save up for a marshall and 412 cab.. i just had to move about 30 miles so i blew most of my money on unexpected things....the pv isnt too bad it has a great clean channel, but the lead side is retchid

[1wahfreak]

Another thing you might want to try is to put a Rangemaster in front of the vibe using the neck pick up (single coil). I did this on my last recording of Voodoo Chile and it really added some life into the vibe. It sounded much more "Hendixy" than I thought it would. I was trying to find a good vibe tone using a Fulltone vibe but everything I tried sounded kind of dark. The Rangemaster really brought out the highs that were missing. Maybe it was just my set up.

[b_rogers]

man, the axis has some resistor values i dont have like 680K,820k  how important are the correct values in this circuit?

[b_rogers]

anyone tried the allies fuzz in schematics2?   looks easy

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