how to make Boss DD-3 sound better?

[vseriesamps]

hey team

just wondering if anyone has any tips for improving the tone of a Boss DD-3 digital delay BESIDES throwing it in the garbage. I have a feeling even just adding a simple lopass might go a long way with this sterile mother.

Anyone with experience in this field please apply.

Thanks
K

[Mark Hammer]

I'm not intimately familiar with the DD-3 but I suspect it shares some attributes with a lot of earlier generation digital delays.

Understand that often electronic designers are groomed and raised on a diet of information that is derived from the world of audio reproduction, rather than production.  In such a world, things like maximum bandwidth reign supreme, because after all if you're going to be able to hear not only the kick drum but also the bass, the strings, the breathiness of the flutes, etc., you need the full 20khz, or as close to it as you can get.

When the first analog delays came out, they were a breath of fresh air because there was no tape involved.  At the same time, they were viewed by some as a kind of failure and "sloppy seconds" because they had much less bandwidth than would be considered ideal (generally little more than 5khz, and often less)....from a sound REproduction perspective.  When digital stuff started emerging, with the prospect of not only being able to achieved greater bandwidth AND longer delay simply by upping the RAM, but also being able to hang onto that same bandwidth for as many iterations as you wanted, it was treated as a breakthrough.  The general sentiment was "Finally!  Something that stands a chance of sounding proper and natural".

Of course, many years later we started to realize that what helped studios to process tracks involving *groups* of instruments would be different than what was ideal for *individual* instruments.  We also started to appreciate what were actually design limitations in analog delays as being virtues.  Analog delays, with their forced restrictions on bandwidth were treated as "warm-sounding", and digital delays, with their bandwidth ceiling lifted and left wide-open, were described as "sterile-sounding".

So what the hell happened?  Were we crazy back then, or what?  What happened was that we a) recognized the difference between processing of single vs multiple source audio, b) recognized the problem that accumulated quantization error produced, and c) recognized what actually happens to reflected sound in the real world.  Without deliberately attempting to, analog delays had come closer to what really happens to reflected sounds in the physical world, and digital delays had strayed from it for the same naive reasons.

So what does this mean for you?  Basically, what it means is that a great many first and second generation digital delays need more lowpass filtering for the wet signal to make it mimic true reflected sound more closely (or more accurately, to mimic what DOESN'T get reflected but rather gets absorbed).  Depending on the pedal design, and how the signal-level controls are implemented, this can sometimes be as simple as straddling a cap across the input and ground lugs of the related pot so as to bleed some treble to ground.  More specifically, a cap across the delay-level pot will help to "warm up" the delay signal by having noticeably less treble than the dry signal.  Similarly, a cap across the regen/repeat pot will take additional high end out of the regenerated signal with each repeat such that it gets duller and duller sounding with each repeat.  As you would expect, the cap values chosen should be such that the regen cap takes away MORE treble than the delay-level one does.  This way, the first repeat can be reasonably bright (as would early reflections) but additional repeats will be duller (as you would expect from re-reflections).

I can't recommend specific cap values, but generally .01uf is a good place to start, and you can work your way to smaller or larger values from there.  The result of both mods is generally a more natural-sounding echo.  Ironic, isn't it, that working *against* everything that one learned in the EE program with respect to audio engineering would make something sound more natural, warmer, and less sterile, but there you have it.

The bigger lesson is that values are generally always driven by context.  What is important in one context may be much less important in another.

[Doug_H]

This is pretty funny... I just bought a brand-new DD3 about a month ago and I love it. :lol:  I finally got around to replacing the digitech piece of junk I had.

Along with what Mark said, though. If you think it might benefit from an LPF, a simple crude test might be to put an eq after it and roll off the treble.  Better yet, run the dry output "dry" and run the wet output through an EQ to see what it really sounds like with repeat freqs rolled off. That might tell you if you're on the right track before you heat up the soldering iron.

I don't use long delay times much, mainly just for 80s style syncopated telegraphing patterns when the music calls for it. Very seldom used but indispensible when needed. I suppose for this kind of thing the "sterility" doesn't bother me too much.

This is the first time I've bought gear like this in a music store in decades though. I love boss gear too, for this kind of thing. I have a boss analog delay that is over 20yrs old and still works great.  My only complaint about the DD3 is a little bit of hum when using the wall-wart. Oddly enough, that is called out in the owner's manual too. I figure a little better PS filtering should solve it.

Doug

[Ben N]

Different strokes for different folks, or perhaps different tools for different jobs.  I love the chrystaline quality of the DD3 for certain jobs--Lanois-esqe long-delay atmospherics, or very short delays for fattening the sound in stereo.  But for a good old-fashioned slapback, it sounds cold and brittle, and I'd rather use a crappy old DOD FX90 analog delay.  I found that the best compromise for a single box on the pedalboard was a Danecho, with its hi-cut control.  But the Dano sucks tone big-time (ok, I just put it after a well-buffered chorus), doesn't have stereo outputs, and what is worse, is unreliable--something no one has ever called a Boss.  Mine just fritzed out on me when I connected an 18v pedal after it.  So there you go--back to the DD3.  I'd bet that you could fit a sub-mini DPDT toggle somewhere on the Boss to have a switchable hi-cut (caps on both mix and regen controls).  In fact, doesn't someone do this commercially, like AnalogMike, Keeley, Wampler or FX Dr?

Ben

[vseriesamps]

Thanks for the start you guys.

Mark when you say "across" the pot, you mean to ground, right? Because then it acts like a tone control. If it went across the first two wipers, it would have the opposite effect, right?

ben I much prefer the sound of the DanEcho, and I've found it hard to beat for the price. Except that the crappy hard to replace jacks take a dump about every 6-12 mos. on me, hard as I am on my gear. I could've saved up all my DanEcho money and bought a tube Echoplex by now.

I'll see what I can come up with and post any interesting results. In the meantime if anyone else wants to weigh in I'm still listening.

Cheers thanks
K

[vanhansen]

I have an ancient DD-2 and love it, will never part with it.  I don't use it right now as I've been playing dry lately, other than some chorus.  I've had the DD-2 for years.  It's beat to hell, has to run on an adapter (the battery clip is gone), but it works and works great.  I also have a Rocktron Intellifex LTD rack and the delay in it is pretty nice.  I haven't used it in several years though, saving it for my recording setup.

The DD-3 is pretty much the same as the DD-2, just priced lower.

[Johan]

if you use it after a lot of distortions/boosters it might just be that the DD-3 itself distorts. you can easily increase the headroom by just adding a single resistor in the right place.. it will change the responce of the level and feedback pots a little, but not so much it cant be compensated for.
I've even modified mine to work double as a clean boost... :shock:
I posted about both these mods about 1,5 year ago..use the search function...

Johan

[vseriesamps]

I'm starting to wonder if the simplest way to do this might be to put the delay line BEFORE my Fuzz Face haha

How's that for a mod? Never was a more vintage tone to be had . . .

K