Doing it wrong when it sounds so right....

[RJ]

Hi guys!

I recently decided to build a distortion pedal....I dug through the archives to get opinions on which rock the hardest, and I breadboarded a few candidates.  I built a Tonebender MKII, a Blackfire, and a Sweet 16....all cool but not quite what I was looking for.

So onto a Big Muff!  I whipped one up on the breadboard and really liked how it sounded...but it was very low output.  The gain, tone, and volume controls all functioned as intended so I figured I was on the right path.  The effect gave a great smooth distortion sound that had the tone I was looking for, just not the oooomph.  

So I ran that Big Muff circuit into an LM386 audio amp to drive it 200 times harder....and there was the tone I was looking for!  A great sounding, mid-scooped, notch-filtery kinda tone that ripped....similar to the tone that synth-rock bands like Orgy or The Anix use....really filtered and electro sounding.

But then I started to wonder why my Big Muff was so quiet in the first place as to need this reamping from the 386......I thought muffs were supposed to be really big and loud pedals.  Turns out I had all 4 transistors oriented backwards!  I flipped them around and the Big Muff was much louder and gainier and sounded like I think it's supposed to sound.

I don't really like the tone of it though....I prefer the reversed transistors and audio amp sound.  So my problem is.....do I just build this up because I like how it sounds, regardless of the fact that it's incorrect?  Or do I try to reproduce the sound of reversed transistors with properly oriented transistors?  The way it sounds with the transistors reversed and the 386 in the chain is exactly the kind of tone I was looking for....but it's done wrong!  So it's turned into an electonically philosophical dilemma for me!

Maybe this is a dumb topic for conversation, but it's been on my mind lots the last couple days.  Carry on with a mistake and pretend it's on purpose....or figure out what it's doing wrong that I like and reproduce that correctly?  

Just curious if anybody else runs into problems like this...thanks for reading!

-Ryan

[Narcosynthesis]

if it sounds good, then go for it

the only drawback i could see would be if you might burn out some of the components, since the transistors arent ni the right way round, but i dont know if that would actually happen or not...

David

[Skreddy]

As long as it's not too noisy with them the wrong way around, I say go for it.  I've been surprised in the past that the circuit works at all that way, but a little does come through.  Wierd.

Why not, though?  You've got yourself a new effect design.

[ibanezts808]

is it possible that maybe he has the transistors wired in as clipping diodes? Amplification is occuring, but the signal is still being clipped down?  not sure if that is possible, I'd think you'd have to have some type of amplification to clip.  I am a huge newbie by the way so please, no flaming.  :oops:

[RJ]

Thanks for the votes of confidence, Narcosynthesis and Skreddy! *high five*  

It's definitely not noisy.... but it's also not a typical sounding distortion....but it is a unique sounding one.  I did a couple other things to make it sound better with the incorrect way it's set up....such as pulling the clipping diodes out of both stages, that made a big difference in the sound and gain of the circuit....messed around with resistor values also...the same mods you'd make on a normal Big Muff for more gain.

ibanezts808, I'm not positive how this works either, haha!  With the transistors oriented backwards, the base stays the same but the emitter and collector are switched...so I guess this is a strangely set up 4 stage emitter-follower or buffer circuit, with an amp set for a gain of 200 stuck on the end?  Probably not how it says to do it in the textbooks eh?   :wink:    

Thanks for the input guys, much appreciated.

-Ryan

[Mark Hammer]

Sometimes you just have to go with your gut.  If memory serves, today is the 90th birthday of this guy who - get a load of this - sticks a guitar neck on a railroad tie and then glues chopped off bits of an arch top to the sides of the railroad tie and then sticks a microphone on it.  Yeah, right, like THAT's gonna work.

[ibanezts808]

Sometimes you just have to go with your gut.  If memory serves, today is the 90th birthday of this guy who - get a load of this - sticks a guitar neck on a railroad tie and then glues chopped off bits of an arch top to the sides of the railroad tie and then sticks a microphone on it.  Yeah, right, like THAT's gonna work.

that was totally over my head, I gathered that it is probably a joke about a common device in music that started that way, but I can't quite picture it.   :oops:  :oops:  :oops:

[object88]

I think that's a reference to Les Paul and the electric guitar.  (I had to check myself...)

[RJ]

Well said, Mr. Hammer!  Thanks!

-Ryan

[troubledtom]

is it useful, do you like it? that's all that matters!
            i'll drink to that,
                      - tom :wink:

[Doug_H]

"If lovin' you is wrong... I don't wanna be right..."

Sorry...

Bottom line: Always trust your ears.

The guy who designed the Rat plugged in a 47 ohm resistor by mistake and the rest is history.

Doug

[birt]

soundclips :lol:

[Alex C]

That sounds great to me; I second the idea that as long as nothing is damaged, go for it!  

The Log:

[RJ]

That's a great pic, Alex!

Thanks for the input everybody.  It's definitely useful to me and I'm definitely gonna trust my ears......gonna go ahead and build it up....and then do some soundclips for birt :wink:

Thanks again,

-Ryan

[NeveSSL]

Was wondering how this project is going?  Got it built yet?  Can't wait to hear it!

Brandon

[jmusser]

Are you talking about Les Paul, Mark? I'm just taking a shot in the dark here.