Why doesn't anyone talk about "pushing" a solid-state amp?

[Mark Hammer]

My sense is that the properties of tube amplifiers are generic enough (all have output transformers, similar output stages, similar power supplies, similar preamp structure, etc) such that any of them can be made to behave in interesting ways if "pushed".  In contrast, when it comes to solid-state amps, some have front ends that ARE designed to be "pushable", while others may have jack-to-output-transistor design that does not plan around being pushed, or even in being immune to most "normal" pushing.

What this suggests is that people don't generally talk about pushing SS amps because it is relevant to only a subset of such amps, and not all of them.  The down side of this is that it tends to minimize discussion of those SS amps that DO anticipate big input signals and try to handle them in interesting and musically valid ways.  The distracting side is that the front end of many SS amps that respond to being pushed is often really just a distortion pedal (same old op-amp-plus-diodes thing) in its inception.

[Steben]

There are FET-preamp based SS amps which, if pushed, are different from opamp-diode types.
The question is, do they differ enough ?

I repeat that the main nasty thing about SS poweramps is the feedback correction circuitry, bringing in linearity to the top of the building, killing all (even if small by some tastes) gradual distortion. The typical SS power amp is in this like a big OpAmp, and most modern ones are IC opamps, but with muscles. Joe's soft-compression opamp is a nice starting point for a soft compression poweramp which brings in non-linearity and I already mentioned it but nobody answered.

And I like to also repeat that Tube power amps can produce the ugliest tone also with this feedback circuitry. I remember the Plexi power amp in different versions, with people urging to mod the modern ones to non-feedback models. Silver and Black Champ models which are discussed about on how much the feedback resistor should be, or on whether to scrap the resistor at the end...

And of course there is the 386 poweramp chip (as SS as it can get...) which is pushed daily by most DIY'ers here on the playroom...

[Ge_Whiz]

Yes, I do have the schematic for the HH VS Musician amp, but I'm not going to share it for two reasons. Firstly, an excellent little company called MAJ Electronics now owns the rights, and I have a vested interest in keeping them in business - they support both my HH and my old Laney 'Linebacker' amps. You can buy the schematic from them for £10. Secondly, it won't tell you what you want to know. Both HH and Laney were shrewd enough to encapsulate the characteristic sound of their SS amps in proprietary circuitry - an enclosed board for HH, and a mystery IC in the Laney. MAJ still manufacture and supply these 'secret' parts.

BD13UK - want to sell that HH amp of yours? Please PM me.

[Steben]

Yes, but it is so damn simple to make your own SS device/amp which sounds good. There is the complete list of equalizing, compressing, passive and active, soft and hard clipping

[Mark Hammer]

Did ALL H&H amps have those luminescent face panels?

[gez]

Both HH and Laney were shrewd enough to encapsulate the characteristic sound of their SS amps in proprietary circuitry - an enclosed board for HH, and a mystery IC in the Laney. MAJ still manufacture and supply these 'secret' parts.

The Laney's use CMOS logic chips.  4069 if I recall.  Not that secret then! :^)

[Mark Hammer]

Yup.  I plum forgot where the site was that had a huge archive of Laney amp schematics, but a substantial number of solid-state ones had their own built-in tube-sound-fuzz/Red-Llama/Hot-Tubes...nudge-nudge, wink-wink.

[bass_econo]

Isn't this basically what the Pignose amps do?  I'm talking about the smaller ones that everyone loves.

[George Giblet]

>Yes, I do have the schematic for the HH VS Musician amp, but I'm not going to share it for two reasons.

That's fair enough.   Thanks for the honesty and the tips.

[Dragonfly]

Nah, all depends what music you're into.  Punk relied on that sound a lot...

Really? What kind of punk? I know Greg Ginn used a solid-state amp, but what about bands like the zero boys .....

ahh...the zero boys....i'm friends with a couple of em...theyre from here in indy...next time i see them, i'll ask em what they were using in those days....

andy

[Herr Masel]

ahh...the zero boys....i'm friends with a couple of em...theyre from here in indy...next time i see them, i'll ask em what they were using in those days....

andy

!! Please do, I'd really like to have an answer to that one. So did you ever get to see them play live?

[Ge_Whiz]

MAJ are a great little company, really helpful and won't try to sell you what you don't need. Tell them you can fix it yourself and they'll sell you the parts and tell you what you need to do. What they charge for schematic sets is very fair.

Gez, thanks for the tip on the Laney IC! I did have my suspicions, like, I didn't believe that Laney had custom chips made for their amps...

I think that some early HH guitar amps may not have had the luminescent panel - so cool - and I don't recall that their PA amps did, but I could be wrong - but it became a trademark on their later guitar amps.

[gez]

thanks for the tip on the Laney IC! I did have my suspicions, like, I didn't believe that Laney had custom chips made for their amps...

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=28015.0

I think the link is dead now but I snagged the linebacker and others.  I, along with a number of other guitarists, used to have to plug into a linebacker on a regular basis (though I didn't own it) and all of us liked the overdrive on it...now that's rare (getting a load of guitarists to agree on something)!

[Joe]

This is a pretty easy, good-sounding SS output stage:
http://www.analogalchemy.diystompboxes.com/pedals/microamp.gif

As shown it runs from a battery, but can be "enlarged" pretty easily. I tested something similar at 40V with a TIP142 for the Q2, driving one of those 70-volt line transformers, and it worked pretty well. You just bias Q1 so that Q2's emitter is around 1/2 supply voltage and produces the most volume. Needs a preamp stage or two, or may be driven by a distortion pedal. The darlington transistor is not required but will increase the volume.

Another easy amp is simply an opamp stage driving a matched push-pull pair. The opamp reduces crossover distortion in the class-B output stage. (High-powered amps require the opamp to handle a higher voltage, and the output needs short-circuit protection.) Still pretty easy though.

[Ge_Whiz]

thanks for the tip on the Laney IC! I did have my suspicions, like, I didn't believe that Laney had custom chips made for their amps...

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=28015.0

I think the link is dead now but I snagged the linebacker and others.  I, along with a number of other guitarists, used to have to plug into a linebacker on a regular basis (though I didn't own it) and all of us liked the overdrive on it...now that's rare (getting a load of guitarists to agree on something)!

Flippin' typical! I get dragged away from home to my in-laws for Christmas, and you guys have a a sneaky discussion behind my back about my favourite amplifiers! I missed that thread completely.

I have two Linebackers - a 100R and a 40R (if my mate ever gives the latter back to me).