Anybody doing PCB layout in illustrator?

[sfr]

I've only done a handful of PCB layouts, mostly really simple stuff, done by hand.  Really just a glorified version of my perf layouts, to be honest.

I'm looking to try my hand at stuff a little more complex.  I have R.G.'s book, which is proving to big help. 

On OSX, so most of the programs I've heard about are a no-go.  I've tried one, (called simply "PCB" I believe) and haven't had the best of luck with it, although I'm still digging into it and trying to understand it. 

It occurred to me after seeing a post here a while back, that Adobe Illustrator should work decently for this purpose, particularly since I know my way around the program already.

So I'm curious, is anyone else using Illustrator for these PCB layouts?  If you are, do have a pre-constructed parts library you've assembled?  Are you willing to share?  It shouldn't be hard to construct a set of snippets of pads spaced for ICs and resistors and common cap sizes, but it might save me a little bit of work if someone's already got something.  I was thinking of just pulling things from a few .PDF files from Tonepad or GGG.

Also, does anyone have a resource listing common pad spacing for frequently used cap values?  I figure the most accurate way would be to measure what I have, but I don't always plan that far ahead.

[rbdl]

i've been thinking about it, but I couldn't be bothered creating all the components. I will one day though. All of the osx pcb programs I've used are crap so I think Illustrator is a good idea. Has anyone created a library?

[Bucksears]

Man, that's ALL I do my layouts in is Illustrator. Yes, I have created a library. I pretty much have standard trace sizes for component pads (two pads 'grouped' for standard resistor spacing, two for cap spacing, etc), off-board pads, component traces and ground traces. That's what I designed the Dr. Boogey, JCM800 and everything else in. If a scan of a PCB doesn't come out clear enough for me, I'll import it into Illustrator and redraw (trace) over it so it's clear.
The great thing is, if you have a PCB that have the parts too close together, you can expand the board and parts much easier than you could drawing it out on paper or otherwise. The best thing I did was to grid the background to 10 squares per inch, which comes out to 11 intersections, which is very much like perfboard.
I started out using MS Paint, but I can't imagine using anything else now.

- Buck

[any]

i've been thinking about it, but I couldn't be bothered creating all the components. I will one day though. All of the osx pcb programs I've used are crap so I think Illustrator is a good idea. Has anyone created a library?

Maybe slightly OT, but Osmond PCB for OSX is a great program and it's free.
You can either work all manual (draw traces between pads)
Or when you set up a partslist and netlist it will give visual feedback on what needs to be connected to what.
It took me about 2/3 days to get into it but now I can see It's a great program!
http://www.swcp.com/~jchavez/osmond.html
It's free for designs under 700 pins wich should be enough for most effects...
and starter libraries are available for download as well, I'd say give it a go... 

The great thing is, it exports the PCB as postscript wich can be imported into Illustrator!
I use Illustrator to put the text and other fun stuff in, or to create groundplanes if needed.

[birt]

i use it for perfboard lay-outs. scale 1:1 .
i just finished a "big" lay-out for 3 wahs, a synth, LFO, envelope and LDR control. this thing will have 12switches, 3 stompswitches and 14 pots.
it measures 6,6x6,8cm

[Doug_H]

I do perf layouts, turret board layouts (for amps), packaging design, and recently a schematic in Illustrator. (Eventually I'm moving all my schems to Illustrator.) It's not as slick as an Electrical/Mechanical CAD package, but it works fine and I've had it for years so I may as well use it. I can generate drill patterns quickly from the package design and using layers to turn things on & off is very handy. Plus, I hand it off to my wife on her Mac and she does the artwork for me. Overall I'm very happy with it.

Doug

[darron]

i actually use macromdeia flash haha. it works in vector and it's easy to draw with. maybe not hte most practical thing around. i recently also used it to draw the image for a enclosure i etched, then i placed the drill holes on the image. this allowed me to PERFECTLY match up all of the spacing of the internal components

if you DO find any good OSX software for schematics/pcb, please do let me know though. i might have to just install windows on this tonight to try some stuff out.

if anyone wants some example .fla files then let me know (:

[Gilles C]

Here is one I want to try someday.

http://kicadlib.site.voila.fr/

Gilles

[Pushtone]

I use Ill. for my whole project. I would be lost without it.
It won't generate Gerber files though so Ill it just
for us home etchers. No production potential.

I start with a TOP/SIDE view template file for each size 1590 box
with many layers for things like traces, drill template, and artwork.

This keeps EVERYTHING about a project in one file and locked in place
with each element directly on top of each other.

I start with the PDF file of the box downloaded from www.hammond.com.
http://www.hammondmfg.com/pdf/1590B.pdf
I open the Hammond PDF in Ill. Get rid of all but the TOP view and SIDE view
and the dimmension arrows.

I layout guide lines for the exact dimensions of the box and scale the Hammond
drawing to the guide lines. I print it to laser and check against a real box.
I can get a tolerance of 1/32 inches with Ill using its ruler, grid and guide lines to scale objects.

Once the box is right I lock that layer and create new layers for PCB outline,
traces, pads, components, solder mask, pots, drill template,
and finally artwork (which could be several layers on it own. Thats nine to twelve layers.

Ill can also open .dwg and .dxf files from auto-CAD.

My componant symbols are very simple. Like a rectagle for a resistor.
For pots and switches I look for .pdf, or auto CAD files to download from
manufacturers web sites and then do the same clean up and scale Like with the 1590 box pdf file.

[birt]

this is on 3 layers. one layer is the perf, one are the components and one is the text on top. if i print it on the real size its way to small to read the text so i make sure that layer is hidden.

http://users.pandora.be/vandijckheffen/bert/perflay-out.pdf

[mdh]

I've tried Eagle, which is available on OS X if you have X11 installed. But honestly, I haven't had much luck with that. I designed one board in Inkscape, which is a free vector illustration package similar to Illustrator. I started with a 0.025 inch grid and made a small set of pads spaced for resistors, ICs, etc. It was really easy (I just eyeballed the pad sizes, and made sets on 0.1, 0.2, ..., 0.5 inch centers, with and without orientation markers), and the results looked great. FWIW, Inkscape is available for most major platforms, in case anyone doesn't want to shell out for Illustrator.

I also really like the idea of encouraging people to distribute their pcb masks in vector formats. I've had a lot of trouble with fuzzy gifs and such, and I would prefer not to have to trace them as Bucksears described. Still, it's DIY, and we're lucky to have all of the resources we have!

[Doug_H]

I use Ill. for my whole project. I would be lost without it.
It won't generate Gerber files though so Ill it just
for us home etchers. No production potential.

I start with a TOP/SIDE view template file for each size 1590 box
with many layers for things like traces, drill template, and artwork.

This keeps EVERYTHING about a project in one file and locked in place
with each element directly on top of each other.

I start with the PDF file of the box downloaded from www.hammond.com.
http://www.hammondmfg.com/pdf/1590B.pdf
I open the Hammond PDF in Ill. Get rid of all but the TOP view and SIDE view
and the dimmension arrows.

I layout guide lines for the exact dimensions of the box and scale the Hammond
drawing to the guide lines. I print it to laser and check against a real box.
I can get a tolerance of 1/32 inches with Ill using its ruler, grid and guide lines to scale objects.

Once the box is right I lock that layer and create new layers for PCB outline,
traces, pads, components, solder mask, pots, drill template,
and finally artwork (which could be several layers on it own. Thats nine to twelve layers.

Ill can also open .dwg and .dxf files from auto-CAD.

My componant symbols are very simple. Like a rectagle for a resistor.
For pots and switches I look for .pdf, or auto CAD files to download from
manufacturers web sites and then do the same clean up and scale Like with the 1590 box pdf file.

That's almost exactly what I do. I trace the standard box from the pdf and use multiple layers for enclosure, components, board, etc, etc. I draw my own pots and other h/w although I'll keep the .dwg/.dxf idea in mind. I didn't realize you could read autocad stuff with illustrator (learn something new every day). I keep the whole project in one file too.

Doug

[any]

i actually use macromdeia flash haha. it works in vector and it's easy to draw with. maybe not hte most practical thing around. i recently also used it to draw the image for a enclosure i etched, then i placed the drill holes on the image. this allowed me to PERFECTLY match up all of the spacing of the internal components

if you DO find any good OSX software for schematics/pcb, please do let me know though. i might have to just install windows on this tonight to try some stuff out.

if anyone wants some example .fla files then let me know (:

well I did mention Osmond PCB for OSX just a few posts back.... great program.

[darron]

well I did mention Osmond PCB for OSX just a few posts back.... great program.

"Osmond PCB is a flexible tool for designing printed circuit boards. Only $195!!!"

Thanks. I looked over it ages ago after reading some nice feedback on it but got put off by the price. I'll give the demo a shot for layous but ill probably go back to flash for the finals.

Thanks (:

[any]

well I did mention Osmond PCB for OSX just a few posts back.... great program.

"Osmond PCB is a flexible tool for designing printed circuit boards. Only $195!!!"

Thanks. I looked over it ages ago after reading some nice feedback on it but got put off by the price. I'll give the demo a shot for layous but ill probably go back to flash for the finals.

Thanks (:

I that case you should read up a little closer, it's free and fully functional for projects with less then 700 pins.
Believe me, you can do a lot of projects with that limit.

[bwanasonic]

On OSX, so most of the programs I've heard about are a no-go.  I've tried one, (called simply "PCB" I believe) and haven't had the best of luck with it, although I'm still digging into it and trying to understand it. 

Have you tried Eagle? I'm not real fond of it, due to it's awkward interface and steep learning curve, but it's very powerful, and yields professional results. Forum member gaussmarkov has a nice library of common DIY parts on his site.

Kerry M

[Dave_B]

I use Ill. for my whole project. I would be lost without it.
It won't generate Gerber files though so Ill it just
for us home etchers. No production potential.

I start with a TOP/SIDE view template file for each size 1590 box
with many layers for things like traces, drill template, and artwork.

This keeps EVERYTHING about a project in one file and locked in place
with each element directly on top of each other.

I also do the same thing, but with Photoshop since that's what I know.  I import the PCB from Eagle, then align it with the pedal artwork in Photoshop.  That makes it real easy to mount the LED's on my board and position them exactly where I drill my holes.  I also imported R.G.'s template to keep me out of trouble with knob/jack placement.  I've done it a whole... one time.   

[Pushtone]

Here's a good example of how you can download data sheets from manufacturers and get them to a 1:1 scale.
It can be done with Adobe Ill. PhotoShop as well as Corel Draw and many sharewares that can open and edit a pdf file.

http://www3.telus.net/david65/pedal-pics/3PDT-SW-SCALED.pdf

I downloaded the toggle switch datasheet, 1590B datasheet,
the DC jack and the 16mm pot and opened it in Ill. and scaled them to size
using the dimmensions on the pdf.


In the above pdf I could quickly see I have a problem with my "all PCB mounted jacks and switches" project.
Can you spot it?
When the toggle it sticking out enough to get the nut and washer on - the 1/4" jacks will be into the box top.
That won't work.

Laying out the top/side views with scaled components helps see these problems ahead of time.