Most "Classical" Chorus pedal ?

[DiyFreaque]

A great many of the best 1st and 2nd generation chorus sounds actually came from the assorted multi-phase units found in string synthesizers and some polyphonic synths during the 70's and early 80's. These used several nonsynchronized BBDs at the same time. The DIM-C (which sounds great) adopted (and adapted) a similar approach, except that its two BBDs are synced to the same LFO but sweeping in opposite directions. A great many of these classic tones are demoed quite nicely at modezero.com (and no, please do not attempt to contact the webmaster).

Notable among these multi-BBD 'ensemble choruses' was the chorus unit in the Solina string synth (think strings in Gary Wright's "Dream Weaver" and PF's "Wish You Were Here").  This, and quite a few other, ensemble chorus used three BBD's, each modulated by the mixed output of one phase each from two tri-phase LFO's, with no mixture of the dry signal on the output.

Another thing that, to my mind, enables choruses to sound pleasingly thick without too much wobble, is cutting the bass in the wet path. If you stick a small value cap somewhere prior to the mixing point that can have the effect of attenuating content below about, say 600hz, you get to keep the animation it provides but lose much of the wobble. Softens the impact in a very pleasing way. Highly recommended for bass players who wish to use a chorus but can't put up with the detuning it provides (basses need to be rock solid in their pitch/intonation).

I never fail to learn something new from you Mark - that's good information to have.  And info that has been under my nose for quite some time, too.  Part of the magic of the Dim C not only is the anti-phase modulation, but also the equalization and high pass crossmixing between delay channels that occurs prior to the output.  In this case, it's now obvious to me that the dry bass, which is boosted prior to the crossmixing, goes a long way in killing the wobble that the anti-phase modulation doesn't get (though obviously you can still make the Dim C wobble by increasing the depth/frequency of modulation ratio beyond the original specs, albeit it's a sort of balanced wobble).

I've posted this sample in my Build Report thread, but I'll mention it here as well, because it may be relevant to Mark's discussion.

The Dim C project allows the delay lines to be modulated by external CV, and this example is of it being used in a very, um, un-DC2-like fashion.  The delay lines are modulated by a pulse LFO.  The part I think is relevant to Mark's explanation is, if you listen to what happens, the higher notes are much more affected by the modulation than the lower notes.

I'm using the stereo input.  It starts out with my DW6000 'dry'.  A little ways into it, you hear the sound switch to 'stereo' as I turn on the on-board chorus in the DW6000.  A little bit after that, I un-bypass the Dim C and you hear the pulsing begin.  All of the pulsing heard in the sample is the Dim C.  I start off with a fairly low modulation index, increase it, then towards the end decrease it.  You'll notice that the bass side of things remain relatively uneffected by the increase in modulation index.

http://mypeoplepc.com/members/scottnoanh/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/dimc_dw6k_pulse.mp3

It's a 2 MB sample.

Now, here's a question that's bugged me for a bit.  Some choruses use 1024 stage BBD's, yet others use 512 stage BBD's.  The chorus on the DW6000 uses a 256 stage BBD (as does the chorus mentioned in another current thread).  What effect does using a different number of stages have?  Obviously, you need to clock a 1024 stage much more quickly than a 256 stage, which I think would be an advantage (higher clock would allow higher bandwidth, I'd think).  So, what was Korg up to when they chose a 256 stage BBD?  It sounds pretty good to my ears, though perhaps a bit 'flangier' than your ordinary chorus....

Cheers,
Scott

[puretube]

highly educational thread...
:wink:

[Doug_H]

I'm using the stereo input.  It starts out with my DW6000 'dry'.  A little ways into it, you hear the sound switch to 'stereo' as I turn on the on-board chorus in the DW6000.  A little bit after that, I un-bypass the Dim C and you hear the pulsing begin.  All of the pulsing heard in the sample is the Dim C.  I start off with a fairly low modulation index, increase it, then towards the end decrease it.  You'll notice that the bass side of things remain relatively uneffected by the increase in modulation index.

http://mypeoplepc.com/members/scottnoanh/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderfiles/dimc_dw6k_pulse.mp3

Slightly OT, but, that clip reminds me a lot of Jean-Luc Ponty, something from "Fables"- "In the Kingdom of Peace" or "Plastic Idols". The pulsing sound really caught my attention there.

Very nice!  Thanks for posting it.

Doug

[DiyFreaque]

Thanks, Doug.  To be honest, when I made the sample, I was more intent on just demonstrating the effect of pulse on a signal, and wasn't concentrating a whole lot on what I was actually playing.  When I recorded it, I was sitting on the floor playing it (no room on the bench to put the synth), and I was reaching up over my right shoulder to adjust the CV intensity.  Guess I should take that approach with all my compositions  

Take care,
Scott

[puretube]

CS-5
F*llt*ne`s latest...
(scroll down  )

[MartyMart]

Thanks Ton, never tried a "real" Tri-Chorus but the version in my Line 6 Mod Pro sounds
gorgeous 
Three CE-1's  .....  YUMMI  !!

MM.

[alfafalfa]

Personally , I still go for The TC Electronics  Chorus/Flanger. Why , because is a most luscious sound (used in stereo) but at the same never gets in the way of your guitar and amptone. The flanger part I don't like at all.
In 1976 I bought  one of the first Roland amps because of the chorus effect ( stereo). I was very much into the Steve Hackett sound then and kept this amp for quite some years  together with an AC 30 for the rougher sounds. But there  was always  a tiny bit too much wiggle in the sound so eventually I got tired of it and disposed of the amp.
Then I had the Boss CE 2  and liked it for a couple of years until I got rid of it because I used it mono and with distortion it interfered with the feedback because of the modulation, it hadn't a dry out signal.
Now I only use the TC chorus and sometimes the chorus sounds in an old Rocktron intellifex which is a very good piece of rack equipment.
And I now prefer a slightly detuned effect (harmonizer) without the modulation.

Alfalfa

[StephenGiles]

2 ADA flangers connected in stereo, especially after a glass of good Argentine Malbec!

[Mark Hammer]

2 ADA flangers connected in stereo, especially after a glass of good Argentine Malbec!

That's like taking acid and Nyquil!

Ton,
The color-changing pushbuttons that Mike Fuller notes in the CS-5 writeup are cute.  I picked up some similar switches with a square front some years back.  It's neat trick to flip a little piece of plastic over, depending on switch position.  Not exactly visible in the dark, but then this isn't a pedal-board device anyways.  The benefit of the switch is that the indicator consumes no current and risks no pop coming from sudden current draw for an LED.

[captntasty]

When I got the CE-2 back in '80something I didn't like it, still don't after revisiting it... it's just harsh.  The best chorus I've found is out of damn near any delay rack unit...  Currently using a DeltaLab Effectron ADM1024.  I use it for delay but it's chorus capabilities are admirable.  I used a very inexpensive (2 of em) Digitech RDS 1900 delays.;.  they can probably be had for $50 or less.  Another good one (I've found) is the Ibanez RC99 Rotary Chorus... unfortunately it ticks... shielded cable to the LFO anybody? 

[Prive]

I love my CE-3 in stereo mode with two marshall amps out1 direct and out2 just chorused signal, the most "Roland Jazz Chorus" tone, mixed signals in the air not the output stage, maybe i'm crazy.......

Saludos, Marcelo.

[mjones99]

the chorus in an ADA MP1 is sick! awsome 80's sound. yes +1 on the effectron!