Toilet plunger talkbox

[momo]

Hello, I watched the video tutorial on the toilet plunger talkbox and was wondering the following...
He used a small amplified spkr to put in the plunger, now what I would like to do is use something like a Ruby to drive the spkr.
So 2 questions, what would be the simplest circuit available to drive the speaker?(the Ruby seems good, but If there was something simpler with small parts count that would be great).
Also, can you distort the sound? or do you need a clean signal to the tube, so if its better a clean signal, a small parts count build that can drive a spkr might be it.(Im trying to eliminate an extra casing for the amp and put the circuit in the plunger.
Or maybe have an enclosure that encases the amp and spkr/plunger but that might be too big.
What do you guys think?
thanks

[modsquad]

FYI, I was going to build a talkbox from scratch for my son who wanted one.   I ended up looking into it and the proper parts etc.  Unless you want one to play around with I would just get a Heil Talkbox for $149.   I ended up doing it for my son and now the dang kid can play "Do you feel like we do".   Dang kids 

[momo]

I dont have 149 dollars to spend on that and I have all the components /spkr.
So lets make this simple, what is the simplest circuit available to drive a small spkr?,
thanks

[Timebutt]

I don't think you'll find a simpler design than the Ruby amplifier, can't go wrong with that one
When using a guitar on talkbox, I think a distorted signal will get you the most interesting effect, and Ruby is capable of some very nice drive when pushed so that makes things even better I'm about to build a talkbox powered by a Ruby myself but am waiting for parts etc.

[SISKO]

Its better to drive a talkbox with an already distorted signail becouse its harmonics content make it easy to understand the modulation of your mouth.

The rubby is the best option becouse of it simplicity plus you can distortion it very easily with no other component

[petemoore]

  Build it and try different components...like amp, you can always do better...until you do good enough and decide to actually use the thing.
  The thing about talk boxes is I think they work best [for live use] with 3 amps:
  A guitar amp so guitar sounds 'normal' most the time.
  A TB amp to power the guitar through tube into the oral cavity.
  A PA amp to amp what comes from the mouth and is picked up by a mic.
  LM3886 amp gets a bigger bang but requires a bigger PS also.
  One thing I like about the plunger talk box is it uses 'a speaker' instead of a HF driver, HF Drivers are expensive and can be hard pressed to produce lower frequencies without blowing.  But I would look for a 'better' speaker for the application, little monitor speaker salvages will make it 'work' but, upgrades is upgrades, the driver being a big part of the tone, volume, and reliability factors.

[momo]

Hey thanks you all for that, Ive got quite a collection of 4-6-8 inch spkrs, finding one that will nicely distort with the ruby is easy, so ill do that. As far as micking my mouth, I dont gig for now and this is mainly to show to my daughter the magic of these things...im lucky my 8 year old daughter is facinated with what she calls "my inventions" , this will definetly hook her for life!( im planning to do a theramin sometime, THAT would permanetly stamp her brain  as to how great it is to tinker with electronics!)
Maybe soon she could register to the forum?
thanks for the replies

[anti-idiot]

i was researching some Marshall schemos of SS amps. just the small ones (10w, 20w Valvestates). I was thinkin' 'bout using the power amp of those (TDA2030). My first idea was using Craig 8w practice amp. For the talkbox you'll need an already distorted signal. My ideas was this:

Guitar - Distortion - PowerAmp-Driver:    :Mic-Mic's Preamp - Amplifier

anyway, with that in mind (pretty much like Danelectro Free Speech TalkBox) I'll only use my one and only Guitar Amp.

Sugested poweramps:
any 8w GGG-amp
any SS poweramp (my choices are 8010 or 8020 Marshall VS Mk-I, found on www.schematicheaven.com)

...and any good mic preamp.

[anti-idiot]

watch those videos (more talkbox fever on the net)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EIQxwotn3k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=An9_LG3Mc08

[Mark Hammer]

A talkbox signal has to pass through what is essentially a "hostile" path.  First you don't have all that cone surface  asvailable to produce air movement.  Second, it has to go through a length of tube which was never designed to reflect sound internally.  Third, it has to pass through a resonant space made of your mouth before being detected by the voice mic.  When you consider all of that, while HUGE volumes are not required, you need enough volume to make it past all those barriers to feeding the mic with a noice robust signal.  You want the volume of the guitar signal bouncing off your tonsils to be loud enough that it compares/competes effectively with all the other noise the mic might pick up.  Otherwise, if you turn the mic channel on the mixer (or whatever recovery amp is associated with the mic) up too far, you end up amplifying lip noises, tongue clicks, teeth grinding, and sniffles (none of which appears in the studio version of Rocky Mountain Way )

So, a Ruby may or may not be a suitable amp to use.  A few suggestions to make it a more workable solution. First you probably want the hose/tube to be as short, solid, wide and straight as is feasible so that its own resonances and sound-absorption properties play less of a role.  Second, if you have a small mic cartridge  available to you so that your mouth can wrap around the tube end and mic at once, that will allow the mic to capture more mouth cavity signal than extraneous signal, permitting you to use less gain on the mic and a driving amp that isn't going to rattle your fillings.  It may even be possible to get yourself a length of 1" diameter copper plumbing pipe, give it a nice gentle bend so that it goes up straight from the speaker to around your mid-chest then arcs forward to a point where you could wrap you mouth around it without bending down or stretching up, as if the tube WAS the mic stand.  A small electret cartridge can be attached to the side of the opening of the pipe, and the wiring from the mic run along the side of the tubing/pipe down to the amp box where a suitable mic preamp brings it up to a level you don't mind sending out a phone jack to an amp.  Obviously, you want to make sure that there is no possibility of moist mouth contact (hell, ANY mouth contact) with that copper pipe resulting in you being grounded in ways that bring on the "magic blue lights".  Been there.  Done That.  Bon Scott says "Hi".

[momo]

Just found this, I like the enclosure,,,
http://www.mocheez.fr/I%20Play%20The%20Talkbox/Custom.html

[Paul Perry (Frostwave)]

A good name for it would be the "Pottymouth".

[gez]

Instant talkbox - a cheap, metal-ended, slim mike plugged into a headphone jack/mini-amp.  Sound comes out of your mike and you stick it in your mouth.  Although really quiet, so was that toilet plunger one by the sound of things.