Deluxe Micro Man

[njkmonty]

so the description of what Ive described, could be normal for a delay pedal which simply hasn't been calibrated?

[jbgron]

Yes.  Sounds exactly like mine before I calibrated it.

[njkmonty]

Im a "wandering in the dark"  guitar fx dude!
i am willing to cough up for a rigol or equiv oscilloscope in the future.
couple of questions are....
1) even when i get one what then?    shove some point probe somewhere and do something.?
i guess there is learning to use a basic one, but is anyone able to give some basic tips when the time comes to apply it to this???
(i know there are some pointers on the pdf) but even "inject a triangle wave???) this i hope doesnt require an electronics degree to work  out?!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fo7QQNdSIMQ

[jbgron]

The first step is tweaking the trimpots until you get delay. You'll need a signal generator to inject waves but you can use your pc and headphone jack to do this. Just google 'signal generator software'. But prove your cicuit works before heading down the scope path.

[njkmonty]

ok had a little more success, found some ic voltages from rusty_pinto at

fre-stom-bo-es.or-...

and found that mine where all close, so after looking at the schematic a bit i though i might be able to connect the output jack tip to pins 14 and 15 to here whats going on, yippee, i found a bit of a buzzing sound, and was able to adjust the trim pots quite easily to get an reasonable delay, remembering  i wasn't getting any dry signal. Ok i thought
lets try the output of ne570,  pins 10 and 11, and didnt get anything, am currently going over solders, and see if anyone has any suggestions???
Yes NE570/SA571 are the same part, but different manufacturer part naming convention.

I had posted voltages before, but it looks like some content was lost in the website server move. I'll re-post mine:

Supply = 12VAC

IC11 output = 15VDC

IC7, Compander, SA571 in my case (VDC):
Pin1 = 1.10
Pin2 = 1.78
Pin3 = 1.78
Pin4 = 0.00
Pin5 = 1.78
Pin6 = 1.78
Pin7 = 9.74
Pin8 = 1.78
Pin9 = 1.78
Pin10 = 2.98
Pin11 = 2.98
Pin12 = 1.78
Pin13 = 15.00
Pin14 = 1.78
Pin15 = 1.78
Pin16 = 1.07

IC1/2/3/4, BBDs (VDC):
Pin1 = 15
Pin2 = 7.25
Pin3* = 5.17 (IC1), 7.00 (IC2), 5.08 (IC3), 4.66 (IC4)
Pin4* = 5.16 (IC1), 6.97 (IC2), 5.07 (IC3), 4.64 (IC4)
Pin5 = 0.00
Pin6 = 7.22
Pin7* = 7.16 (IC1), 7.94 (IC2), 7.50 (IC3), 7.71 (IC4)
Pin8 = 0.00

*The input (pin 7) DC offset directly affects the output DC offset (pins 3/4). Again, these are MY bias settings, which were evaluated on a scope by setting the input offset such that the maximum signal passed through the BBD will result in symmetric clipping and distortion (top/ bottom). This will vary from BBD to BBD, but they will probably be close enough for you in most cases.

[njkmonty]

ok , after checking all bbd chips, and getting them all close to rustypinto  's voltages,  i still got much of the same probs, so i decided to
see if any "delay only" signal was to be heard coming out of  (after c8 (10uf) going into pins 14/15 of ne570, and woohoo!!

i could hear delay!!! this allowed me to easily rough tunes the trim pots to get rough ballparks to work with, but what i did notice,
was that pins 10 and 11 of ne570, where a little higher than rustypinto  (about 3v  his where in 2v's) so nothing was really coming out (i think?)
what is suppose to be coming out from pins 10 and 11?
i think i can see feedback pot  connected after it
anyone make sense of my dribbles?

[njkmonty]

Im about to upload a quick youtube video to help explain what is happening in this build.
I've verified dry signal, and wet, all pots/switches seem to work, lfo etc
somewhere around the commander and last opamp something going amiss!
but i cant get wet and dry the same time as intended?!!!!!



also how do i connect a youtube videohere where you can play it in this forum?
ie not just a link?, the same way as a picture is displayed in our responses

[njkmonty]

[rustypinto]

somewhere around the commander and last opamp something going amiss!
but i cant get wet and dry the same time as intended?!!!!!

Looks like you've debugged it down to that area, but i know for certain that the blend works as intended (verified by a few others too).

Check that you've populated the parts in that area correctly, and use the "PCB Bottom Side 1:1" (page 4, bottom half) to compare your own PCB assembly to what was designed and verify that all the traces are present and making the proper connections. Check specifically for solder bridging and missing traces.

[njkmonty]

You are correct, the blend pot clearly works all pots and switches, do, what i mean is there is delayed (not super clean) going into
pins 14 &15 of controller.(This being my first analogue delay pedal attempt),  seems to be correct. From pins 10& 11 of controller, im getting a slightly cleaner and quieter delay signal coming out and heading towards the final 1/2 of opamp ic12a 4558.Its on the other side of this opamp i get nothing pin 1!. Correct me please if im wrong , but is the ic12a section, there to clean up signal, and get it to correct unity to mix with dry signal at blend pot???
ive checked solder heaps but will do again, maybe add detailed voltages in that area to assist???

[njkmonty]

after all the debbugging, i still thought that i did everything, right,  measured everything before putting in even capacitors!,

received a futurlec order today and tried the sa571n commander after pulling out the NE570 (i think i got from smallbear), and what do you know it worked straight away!!! woohoo!

which makes me wonder,..
why one chip worked and the other didnt,   a bad one? or something else?
any way will no doubt post further queries  about fine tuning the calibration, anyone used dirk hendriks,  probe circuit thingy?

one other thing. i was thinking of doing the flashing lfo led mod, would that be at the junction of pin 1 ic5a (4558) and r42 330r?
i got it flashing around in that area , just was wondering if there was a recommended place that wouldnt do anything negative to the sound?

[rustypinto]

received a futurlec order today and tried the sa571n commander after pulling out the NE570 (i think i got from smallbear), and what do you know it worked straight away!!! woohoo!

which makes me wonder,..
why one chip worked and the other didnt,   a bad one? or something else?

one other thing. i was thinking of doing the flashing lfo led mod, would that be at the junction of pin 1 ic5a (4558) and r42 330r?
i got it flashing around in that area , just was wondering if there was a recommended place that wouldnt do anything negative to the sound?

Cool, i'm glad you found it. I have run into bad companders before too. I've been using On semi branded SA571 myself. Come to think of it, i did have an NE570 die on me before (don't remember where i got it though).

On the LFO LED: you can start at pin1, but it will probably change the bias on the JFET, which modulates the clock (IC9). Add it and play around with the modulation to see if its acceptable. You can also try pin 7 without changing the frequency too much. Ideally, you would want an op-amp buffer driving the LED since that would be unimposing.

[njkmonty]

have got the bug , with analogue delays, have just breadboard a aquapuss with 2 cool audio v3205s, nice.
i believe this build (Deluxe Micro Man) is all working correctly, but  when i turn the "delay" pot from about 70% to full clock wise, that high pitch squeal kicks in.
with the dm2 clone  the trim pot connected to the mn3101 can be adjusted to  slightly reduce delay and completely remove squeal.
from what i gather this build has the trims to bias the bbd,s and 2 trims for gain on the 4558 ics.  i believe Ive biased the bbd's very well without a scope, is there any other suggestions to remove this squeal?

here is  breadboard aquapuss and  micro man with squeal at long delays

[rustypinto]

Concerning the "squeal" (clock noise):

When i built mine, i used shielded, two-wire cable. You must attach the shield conductor to the PCB ONLY (the pad labeled "DLG" of the PCB assembly), not at the pot. I can't tell if thats what you did or not, thats just how i reduced most of my clock noise. I also noticed some reduction when the unit was put into the enclosure (not sure why).

[njkmonty]

yeah i did all the shielding etc correctly.
what i did try a few moments ago is swapping the smallbear 2n5457 with a different brand. this has reduced the squeal considerably , by about 50%, still present, though.
its funny that the breadboard  delay has about same delay time, no shielding , (all over the place and id quiet as!)
(i guess prob due to the trim pot?)
does anyone know by the way what sort of pic i could use for breadboard delay to implement digital potentiometer for a tap tempo feature?

[njkmonty]

eventually boxed it up.
tried everything to get rid of squeal  in the longer delay settings.
even replaced the last 2k4 resistors coming fromm bbd with a cancel 5k trim pot but no change. still sounds great would love to have it  squeal free all the way, even cut traces going to and from footswitch and shielded them , no change!
from what ive read this is from the bbd chips? is it worth trying others? as ive read in some forums about some "real" ones displaying these symptoms. or should i not bother?

[kugua]

I have made one used this schematic DeluxeMemoryManRevD.pdf,the sound is good but has some noise like the white noise .I donnt know why .this noise frequency is about 3000HZ