Reamping question

[Jazznoise]

I'll try and do a run without the DI sunday, it's the Mother's birthday Saturday so I can't really shut myself away for the day (As happens once my amp goes on  ). You're in luck as I haven't moved the mics but expect a honkier, mid rangey guitar track with alot more noise - that's the general result of direct mixer-amp signal paths.

In terms of gain structure it went mixer-DI-and into the amp, which is a Vox VT-50 (one of them hybrid amplifiers). For the first signal it I had the level reaching the tubes kept pretty tame, 12 o clock, and then I'd a 2nd preset of the same settings where I was driving the tubes (3 o clock) and adding a touch of the digital-amp emulations distortion (1-2 o clock). I did a little A/B wiggling of levels so I felt that the distortion coming out of the amp was the same and the levels on the recorded tracks were almost the same(You'll notice the transients act different, and this meant I after comparing RMS I still had to manualy adjust the sound for equal perceptual loudness), as I said earlier, about 1/2 the output level of my aux seemed to be plenty as the previous recording - This is unscientific and truthfully I should have probably used a DMM meter to compare but I was interested in the sonics and "viability" of reamping.

I wouldn't trust Soundcloud's waveform generator, it makes everything looked like a Dance track that was slamming a Master Bus Limiter. But yes there is sonic differences and on good headphones I've done partialy blind tests and people seem to prefer the re-amp.

[artifus]

Just looking at the waveforms in soundcloud shows that they are not exactly alike.

close your eyes. listen.

*edit* such an eye dominated culture. did you know that the human ear can hear ten more octaves than the eye can see? frequency wise. and that the ear presents to you an accurate three dimensional model for your brain to consider as reality? and that stereoscopic vision is an illusion? listen.

A wise old owl lived in an oak
The more he saw the less he spoke
The less he spoke the more he heard.
Why can't we all be like that wise old bird? 

[boogietone]

I am well aware of visual / acoustic psychophenomena and the associated (d)illusions. 

Nonetheless, to both my eyes and ears the "live" and "reamped" pieces are clearly different. I was actually surprised that the part I preferred was the reamped one.

[TimWaldvogel]

So let me ask this. Most people always believe the radial xamp is MUCH better cause it's active vs the 99$ passive reamp box. Maybe it's cause they have a higher price point?

Are there any advantages to using a passive circuit vs using an active circuit with the same transformer isolating the input?

[wavley]

So let me ask this. Most people always believe the radial xamp is MUCH better cause it's active vs the 99$ passive reamp box. Maybe it's cause they have a higher price point?

Are there any advantages to using a passive circuit vs using an active circuit with the same transformer isolating the input?

I don't understand the need for an active circuit here, you have a balanced line level driver that's perfectly capable of driving a transformer that already has great CMRR, so unless you're building some tone shaping in it seems like it's over complicating things.  I have a FET based active DI and it's my least favorite for this application and my tube DI is only useful if I want to drive it hard as an extra gain stage. Of course I've never used the radial so I may be wrong.

Of course it's worth a try, I mean how much is an op amp or a couple of fets and support parts? An edcor transformer is only $6 so even if you built both you aren't out much and I bet you can find uses for both.

[boogietone]

There are no inherent advantages or disadvantages really. I use the radial x amp mostly because it is what I keep hooked up most of the time. It is pretty transparent though that is subjective. No matter what you use, active or passive, it will color the sound. Unless the reamp box really has a loading effect or some tone shaping circuits, either will work fine for most applications and the amp or effects chain will have more effect not the signal than the reamp box does. If you do find that the reamp box loses you some high end for instance, you can compensate by throwing an eq with some low end cut before the send as an easy work around. I might use a linear phase eq in this instance as well.

[TimWaldvogel]

Thank you all for your responses, maybe this time I'll make a passive one with the option of flipping a switch into an active eq or something. And I'll play around with it. I think I maybe just try an inductor in there that way my amp feels as if it sees an inductive load and see if it mAkes any difference to me

[wavley]

Here you go via the Tape Op forum  http://messageboard.tapeop.com/viewtopic.php?t=77888