Effects loop stompbox switch.

[SiBailey]

Hey everyone. My 1st post here. I want to get into building stompboxes and eventually having a go at building amps.
I make guitars and I am a guitar tech, but have little knowledge of electronics...
Anyhoo. What I want to do at the moment is a passive switch for my effects loop. I'll explain more.
I like to use most of my stompboxes in my effects loop of my Boogie Dual Rec. The effects loop is good, but I also like to have some of the pedals in the front end of the amp, as the loop is not 100% wet, and when using pitch shift or kill switch effects from tremolos etc, its not good as you still retain some of the dry signal. Therefore, I want to wire a simple switch that lets me have my effects going through the loop most of the time, but if I choose to, have them all going through the front end...
In my head (and on paper) I can't seem to figure out the wiring of the switch. I'm thinking the enclose will have 6 input jacks, these being
1 from guitar
2 To amp
3 beginning of effects
4 end of effects
5 amp loop send
6 and loop return
I thought using a DPDT switch would work and you can easily have 3+4 to the center terminals, to meet up with 1+2, or 5+6. However, what happens when the loop is engaged, then the signal from guitar no longer goes to the amp. I've enclosed a drawing (not a schematic, or to scale)

Can someone help me to tell me how to wire the switch correctly, or if I'm even using the correct type of switch...
Hope this is clear, and I appreciate any feedback or help

[SiBailey]

...haven't worked out how to post pictures yet....

[Pollinator95]

I still haven't woken up completely so I may not make sense, but why do you need a send and return to the pedals? Can't you just have the pedals directly after your guitar and THEN to the input of the amp/effects loop? I'll try and make a diagram.

To post pictures you'll need a Photobucket account or similar. Upload photos from your computer to Photobucket, and then from there to your post.

[Pollinator95]

That's what I've come up with, the middle row seems a bit weird to me though.
If you used a 4PDT you could use the extra row to connect a LED.

[Quackzed]

i thought the pollinator had it, but you still need to connect the send to the return when the 'front of amp' is selected as the send / return will be 'on' with 1/4" plugs inserted...
its a tough one...
basically with one switch you need to move the effects from front to loop as well as true bypass both of em...
check out geofex.com for relay switching, or remote switching,maybee then you can use a momentary sw to 'flip' all the connections at once...

[caspercody]

Try these links:

http://www.beavisaudio.com/projects/ABSwitches/

http://www.beavisaudio.com/techpages/PedalHacker/index.htm

http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazine/Issue/2007/Nov/The_DIY_True_Bypass_Lesson.aspx

http://www.singlecoil.com/tb-strip/tbstrip.html

I made the one on the Premier Guitar web site, and works great. On the Single Coil web link there is a link half way down to add a master bypass or a tuner bypass.

Rob

[Pollinator95]

Quackzed, I hadn't thought of that; I've never used an amp with an effects loop. Is that true for all loops?
If I understand that right, when there's a plug in the loop's jacks you need to connect send and return or you won't get a signal?
Would this one work?

[SiBailey]

Thanks for the reply guys. I think pollinator may be onto it.
I appreciate the links caspercody , but the issue is not about making the pedals true bypass, but more about the subtle changes in tone and sound when effects are put throught the front of the amp and through the effects loop.
I don't know if it helps Quackzed, but the amp does have a foot switch to turn the effects loop on and off. What I would be doing most of the time is having the guitar strait into the amp, then when I want effects I'd turn the effects loop on via the footswtich on the amps controller. Then when I wanted to have the subtle change in sound, I'd press the "custom" foot switch and rout all the stompboxes through the front of the amp.
I think you may have a winner caspercody. I'll wire it up asap and let you know If its done the trick...
Thanks for the help.

[Quackzed]

that'll do it...
though the first would work as well, if you have a switch to turn the fx loop off... but you'd have to turn the loop off each time you selected 'front of amp', with the last switch layout from pollinator you can just press the front/loop selector and leave the fx loop on without it cutting out or having to turn it off when fx are routed to front. nice!

[Pollinator95]

I'll accept compensation in the form of ginger cookies, thank you very much 
If your amp already has the loop-defeat, you could choose between using a 3PDT and your amp's footswitch OR using a 4PDT with LED OR using a 3PDT without LED. I'd just get a 4PDT, unless you've already got thousands of 3PDTs lying around and live in a desert island.

[SiBailey]

Ah thanks guys!
any chance i could be cheeky and ask for a diagram with the LED?
no worries if not
thanks again though

[Pollinator95]

Using a 4PDT, just imagine the row of lugs in this drawing added to the one I posted previously. The resistor doesn't need to be 1k.