Any Bow Wow Yoy Yoy Experts Here?

[Paul Marossy]

I have a question. On the only schematic I have ever seen, there is shown a single 100K pot. On some pictures I have seen of the original units there is a dual pot in it with wires connected to both pots. Does anyone know what is up with that?

[Jdansti]

Maybe it's two wahs in one and the pots sweep in opposite directions to make it sound more like human speech. R.G. covers this in the last section on wah technology on his Geofx site.

[alfafalfa]

The original just had a single pot ( neg log , if I remember correctly)

I bought a Schaller when it came on the market and have always been disappointed with the Yoy Yoy sound , imho it's useless.

Alf. 

[digi2t]

There are two versions of the Bow Yoy pedal. The early model (and some later ones) were just Bow Yoy, or bypass. Later models also served as volume pedals, hence the second pot.

I have two Bow Yoy pedals, both first generation. They only have the one pot. Two pots = volume function.

The original just had a single pot ( neg log , if I remember correctly)

I bought a Schaller when it came on the market and have always been disappointed with the Yoy Yoy sound , imho it's useless.

Alf. 

I have to echo this sentiment as well. Yoy is very weak. The Bow is much better.

[Mark Hammer]

I am a huge huge fan of the Schaller Bow-wow/Yoy-yoy pedal.  Those folks whose preferences lean towards blues-rock or power-rock of various kinds will likely find little of interest for them in the Yoy side.  I suspect it provides more appeal to people who like funk or perhaps various forms of jazz fusion...or include Bon Jovi's "Livin on a prayer" in their set and don't want the hassle of a talk box.  In most discussions of the pedal, I refer people to Manu Dibango's 1972 soul-funk hit "Soul Makossa" for a shining example of what it adds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2jYjUiulMQ

I've owned one on two occasions, though I think one was under the "Kent" moniker.  Neither included volume-pedal function.  Why I sold either of them is a mystery lost in time, though it may have been out of some foolhardy notion that I could simply buy another when I had the money.  As near as I can recall, it had one pot.

[alfafalfa]

In most discussions of the pedal, I refer people to Manu Dibango's 1972 soul-funk hit "Soul Makossa" for a shining example of what it adds

That's a good example of what it sounds like!

Just very "transparent" if there are more instruments playing it easily gets lost in the mix.

But the the regular wah (bow)  sound was very good. I used it to get feedback (infinite sustain) on my AC30 amp abd it did a great job there.

[Paul Marossy]

I bought a Schaller when it came on the market and have always been disappointed with the Yoy Yoy sound , imho it's useless.

Very much of that depends on the transistors used. With BC109s, my clone sounds pretty anemic. But with some MPSA18s in it it's quite usable if you ask me. On the Yoy Yoy setting I find that you have to be a little more dramatic with rocking the treadle and also you have to ride the sweet spot.

I am a huge huge fan of the Schaller Bow-wow/Yoy-yoy pedal.  Those folks whose preferences lean towards blues-rock or power-rock of various kinds will likely find little of interest for them in the Yoy side. 

I have yet to use it in a band situation now that I have it per the corrected schematic, but the Yoy Yoy seems to me to be usable in any situation. With low gain transistors it's pretty weak indeed. I like it, it's not your typical wah sound. Kinda dry sounding, but in a good way. Especially when you learn how to ride the sweet spot.

[Paul Marossy]

Also, has anyone verified that the 500mH inductors are indeed what were used? One example has inductors marked "3H1". Makes me wonder..... 

[digi2t]

If I get a chance, I'll open up my units and measure the inductors inductance and resistance. The schems say 500mH, but if I remember correctly, the wire gauges look a tiny bit different between the two. Anyway, my inductance meter will tell the tale.

[Paul Marossy]

If I get a chance, I'll open up my units and measure the inductors inductance and resistance. The schems say 500mH, but if I remember correctly, the wire gauges look a tiny bit different between the two. Anyway, my inductance meter will tell the tale.

That would be awesome. I would be very curious to see what you find.

[Mark Hammer]

Am I the only who finds those jacks just plain weird? 

It's not the rubber/plastic coating so much, as the fact that it is on the contact for the plug tip.  What the deuce is up with that?  Yoy vay!!! 

[digi2t]

Okee Dokee, I opened one up. The other is packed away. Here you go...

Looking at the gutshot you posted above, the upper inductor measures 366mH/20ohms, and the lower one comes in at 1.7H/124ohms.

Someone might want to update the schematic. 

[Electron Tornado]

Am I the only who finds those jacks just plain weird?  

It's not the rubber/plastic coating so much, as the fact that it is on the contact for the plug tip.  What the deuce is up with that?  Yoy vay!!!  

Look at the one on the right. It looks like there's another contact behind the one with the plastic sleeve. It may be wired to connect power to ground when a cable is plugged in. Why it was done using the tip of the plug (hence the need for insulation) instead of the sleeve is strange.

Just my guess.

[Paul Marossy]

Am I the only who finds those jacks just plain weird?  

It's not the rubber/plastic coating so much, as the fact that it is on the contact for the plug tip.  What the deuce is up with that?  Yoy vay!!!  

I noticed that too. It's probably their way of making a switching jack.

Okee Dokee, I opened one up. The other is packed away. Here you go...

Looking at the gutshot you posted above, the upper inductor measures 366mH/20ohms, and the lower one comes in at 1.7H/124ohms.

Thanks for doing that! Hmm... I knew something must be up with those inductors since those markings didn't make a lot of sense. Can you tell me which one is which on this schematic? http://www.diyguitarist.com/Schematics/BowWowYoyYoy-StillWrong.gif

[armdnrdy]

I would imagine since R9 (1M) is tucked away behind the inductor marked "3H1" and on the schematic L2 is separated from R9 by just one .022uf cap, I believe that "3H1" = L2

[duck_arse]

3h1 is the ferrite material used for the cores.

the extra jack connection may be for extra german precision grip on the plugs.

[Paul Marossy]

I would imagine since R9 (1M) is tucked away behind the inductor marked "3H1" and on the schematic L2 is separated from R9 by just one .022uf cap, I believe that "3H1" = L2

So it looks to me like L2 is 350mH nominal and L1 is 1.5H nominal.

3h1 is the ferrite material used for the cores.

Yes, why didn't I think of that? 

[digi2t]

On the schematic you linked, L2 would be the one that I measured at 366mH/20ohms, and L1 is the 1.7h/124ohms.

armdnrdy pegged it right.

[Paul Marossy]

On the schematic you linked, L2 would be the one that I measured at 366mH/20ohms, and L1 is the 1.7h/124ohms.

armdnrdy pegged it right.

Cool, I updated the schematic. So I believe that there is finally a correct schematic on the internet after all these years.
http://www.diyguitarist.com/Schematics/BowWowYoyYoy.gif

[digi2t]

Nice Paul. Just some more fodder here;

The original pot in mine measures 140K, and on my DMM, seems to be very linear. It even has 100K stamped on it, yet it dials up to 140K quite smoothly, in both directions.  
Also, my unit uses BC114N transistors, the black epoxy domed ones. Remember, my unit is the first version, with the all metal casing. I think good replacements for the BC114N would something along the lines of a BC209 or 2N4967.

BC114 datasheet is here; http://www.datasheetarchive.com/indexer.php?file=Scans-00105705.pdf&dir=Scans-005&keywords=BC114&database=user-highscore#

There is also this schematic as well (don't know if it's accurate, I haven't really studied it).


The one you've posted (and corrected) is accurate though. I used that one to mod my other one.

The rev. log. pot thing may have come on later versions. I know for sure that my first runs are linear.