phaze 45 blend/mix mod?...(tonepad)

[deadastronaut]

Hi guys just built a tonepad phase 45 as a surprise birthday prezzie for a mate, ..not boxed yet.

subbed 47n for 50n,

j201's..reversed.

100k's for all 150k's..

sounds much better than a previous build, more lush and less subtle than before.....however.... when i have distortion in front, it has  heap loads of depth which sounds f.... awesome and van halenified....but.

i reckon it would be better to have a  ''blend'' for it...to get a bit more subtle to over the top phaze too...when distorted.

any ideas?..ive read the 3.9M can be swapped for a depth pot, (which value?)  but if the depth was fully CCW would that 'just'' be my distortion?...or do i need a blend rather than depth mod as i first thought?

going to have to build myself another now too...sounds great.

cheers

edit:

just tried this,

split input signal 1 goes to input,  1 goes to lug 3 pot. (100k)

phase out goes to lug 1 pot.

overall out to lug 2 pot...seems to work ok...simplest way i could think of.. ........would the 3.9M swap for a pot do the same?

any thoughts?...

[Kipper4]

Cant wait to see the outcome of this one.

[midwayfair]

Here ya go:

http://www.lynx.bc.ca/~jc/phase45modded.gif

I did the depth mod on my Smoothie (Madbean's 1590A phase 45). There's a demo on my youtube. It can also give you some vibe sounds in the same pot. Hugely useful mod, I highly, highly recommend it.

[deadastronaut]

cheers jon,  i'm not into the vibey thing though too warbly for me, just want to blend clean/distorted  with phase..

believe it or not its not subtle at all when distortion is on.....still quite subtle (floydy) when clean, which i like too.

heres a clip of  phase off , then on with my dodgy but workable ' blend' fully CCW,...... then 120clock,...... then full on, .......then fiddling with the blend..speed etc..

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7464107/phaser%20bollox%201.mp3

am i right in thinking that if i reduce the 10k from IC1b to out it will lift the level of the phaser a little...?..




heres how i have it at the mo....

[midwayfair]

cheers jon,  i'm not into the vibey thing though too warbly for me, just want to blend clean/distorted  with phase..

Er ... I think you misunderstood me. The Depth control in Justin's schematic is a wet/dry blend. It bypasses the phasing stages -a clean blend without any added circuitry, just a pot that replaces two resistors already on the board.

It just HAPPENS to sound slightly vibey on the lower settings, because that's kind of how vibes work (they're a phase shifter with a different frequency ratio, so some frequencies don't get "phased out"). It's going to sound a little vibey regardless of how you implement a clean blend.

[deadastronaut]

right so......

you mean the 10k on the right of IC2

and the 10k above the 10 uf?..IC1?

...i'll have a look..

[Paul Marossy]

am i right in thinking that if i reduce the 10k from IC1b to out it will lift the level of the phaser a little...?..

Yes, you are. If you make it a pot you will be able to vary how much phaser effect you get - to a point.

[deadastronaut]

cheers paul, i'll socket it and see how i get on...thanks man.

my dodgy 'blend'' works well, it just needs a little lift on the ''phaser side'' as it is a little lower output than the straight signal....noticable when distorted.

not sure if the 'blend' jon suggests would actually remedy that..

[Paul Marossy]

I prefer the making that one 10K resistor from IC1-B a pot vs. the 25K "mix" control shown here. I find it to just be more useful.

[deadastronaut]

i'll try both then..

[deadastronaut]

experiment result 1:

removing that 10k  IC1B..and replacing value..

10k-1M... phasey up to 47k...from then on goes very vibey...

10k -100R  Phasey...but loses phase at 2.2k/1k...level does go up a little but loses effect..around 2.2k....so 10k is about optimum imo.

next experiment.....to follow.

[deadastronaut]

....

[midwayfair]

It replaces the two 10K resistors that form a voltage divider between the output of the first gain stage and the last gain stage. Tonepad doesn't label their parts, but backtracking from the output, if you see that .05uF cap, there are two 10K resistors. Lug 2 goes at the pad where they're joined. Lug 1 goes to the pad connected to the output of IC1A (pin 1). Lug 3 goes to the pad connected to the output of IC2B.

[Paul Marossy]

removing that 10k  IC1B..and replacing value..

10k-1M... phasey up to 47k...from then on goes very vibey...

10k -100R  Phasey...but loses phase at 2.2k/1k...level does go up a little but loses effect..around 2.2k....so 10k is about optimum imo.

I like that it can be more like a vibrato if you want it to be.

[deadastronaut]

@paul:, yeah it is a good easy mod..

[kaycee]

I had a fair muck about with this idea a while back. In the end I didn't like messing with the wet dry mix of the circuit itself, or the external bias for that matter. What I liked best was a proper blend, I think the buff n blend it was?

Adding the depth to the 45 isn't really worth it, the 90 however...IMO anyhow.

[deadastronaut]

@kaycee:  hmmmm...so not worth bothering with then ...i looked at the beavis buff n blend earlier..

but read that it had a dead spot (lower vol) dip in the middle....12'0clock....hmmmm....which is pretty much what i have with just my ''dodgy blend''...which does work without vibing..

i'll take a look at that beavis buff n blend, and maybe breadboard it and try it out...cheers..

if the buff n blend works i'm surprised nobody has knocked up a layout for this...

[midwayfair]

Guhhhhhh, their layout is different from the schematic.

Lug 2 is correct.

-One of the 10K to be removed is the one just in front of the 1ouF cap, center bottom. (One outter lug goes to the left side of that one)

-The other is .... where you have the center lug of the 22K. (The other outer lug goes to the north side of that one.)

The two standing resistors stay. Don't touch them.

[deadastronaut]

@jon : ha ha...nightmare eh...

image above updated....

correct!..?

[Paul Marossy]

I had a fair muck about with this idea a while back. In the end I didn't like messing with the wet dry mix of the circuit itself, or the external bias for that matter. What I liked best was a proper blend, I think the buff n blend it was?

Adding the depth to the 45 isn't really worth it, the 90 however...IMO anyhow.

I found the 25K mix knob to be much less useful compared to changing the 10K resistor that is connected between the output of the first opamp and the output right before the 0.05uF cap with a "depth" pot instead. With the 25K mix control only about 15% of the range of the pot actually had any affect on the phasing. I thought it was pretty pointless. I have yet to try it, but I think maybe an 8.2K resistor in series with a 2K pot would probably make a fairly usable "depth" control, subtle as it may be.