Belton Brick Reverb - Which one? (short, medium, long)

[chromesphere]

Hey guys, i was going to order a Belton brick whilst i was ordering some stuff from Mammoth (they stock them now incase you didnt know) and was wondering, which one to get?  This might be circuit dependant, idk i havent used one before...Also, long with reverb may not mean...better like with delay?  Shorter actually might sound better? 

Anyone with experience with these, your opinion is appreciated, thanks for your time!

Paul

[armdnrdy]

Shorter is better!

Think about what reverb is. Even with the shorter brick, when adjusted to the longest delay time, it starts approaching a slap back type delay.

Go with the shortest!

[chromesphere]

My finger was hovering over the buy button and there was an alarm bell ringing in my head.  "ITS NOT A DELAY PAUL" lol

Thanks armdndy ill get the short brick

Paul

[stevie1556]

I built the Rub-A-Dub and the long brick sounds amazing in it.

[deadastronaut]

another vote for the long brick..

[chromesphere]

Well, I haven't pulled the pin on it yet.  ill check the datasheet and check what the min max times are because if the long as the same min delay time as the long delay, then its a given.

Edit: Not sure there is a datasheet.  Only thing I can find is maximum delay times, 2s 2.5s and 2.85s

Paul

[Craiz]

With that short of a difference between them, I think this is a good time for that old bit of wisdom - you can make big smaller, but you can't make small bigger. (This is assuming that you have plans to include an amount control of some sort, of course.)

[Paul Marossy]

Edit: Not sure there is a datasheet.  Only thing I can find is maximum delay times, 2s 2.5s and 2.85s

Data sheet: https://www.smallbearelec.com/Projects/BTDR-1H.pdf

[deadastronaut]

http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=1211

note the different pin connectons for 1-H/ 2-H

[John Lyons]

With that short of a difference between them, I think this is a good time for that old bit of wisdom - you can make big smaller, but you can't make small bigger. (This is assuming that you have plans to include an amount control of some sort, of course.)

I agree!

[Paul Marossy]

http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=1211

note the different pin connectons for 1-H/ 2-H

That must the 2nd gen brick I just heard about recently?

[deadastronaut]

^ yep, Heres mine with the BTDR 2-H...2.8s.

[kodiakklub]

just built a ghost echo with the spec'd long spring. sounds amazing, though the ghost echo adds in a little slapback on purpose through the 2399 i think/read.

you def want the new version: http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=1211

[armdnrdy]

Notice how there's no short delay bricks left in stock?

http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=1211

That should tell you which one is more popular.

For the guys that built reverb units with medium and long delay bricks:

How do you know which one sounds better if you didn't A/B the different bricks?

I listened to many sound samples of different builds before I made a decision which circuit to build. I was looking for a reverb that sounded as close to a Fender type spring as I could find. I chose a build with the short delay. I was amazed how good it sounded when it was finished! (read: Fender type spring like)

Now if what sounds good to you is a shimmering slap back, then the medium or long brick is for you.
I can get that same sound with a delay pedal set with a short delay and the short reverb for depth.
IMHO, You can't get the short more realistic sounding reverb with the medium or long brick.

[kodiakklub]

Notice how there's no short delay bricks left in stock?

http://www.smallbearelec.com/servlet/Detail?no=1211

That should tell you which one is more popular.

For the guys that built reverb units with medium and long delay bricks:

How do you know which one sounds better if you didn't A/B the different bricks?

I listened to many sound samples of different builds before I made a decision which circuit to build. I was looking for a reverb that sounded as close to a Fender type spring as I could find. I chose a build with the short delay. I was amazed how good it sounded when it was finished! (read: Fender type spring like)

Now if what sounds good to you is a shimmering slap back, then the medium or long brick is for you.
I can get that same sound with a delay pedal set with a short delay and the short reverb for depth.
IMHO, You can't get the short more realistic sounding reverb with the medium or long brick.

1. you assume that smallbear bought the same number of units of each "length"
2. i built a clone of a pedal that spec'd a long tank in the factory unit, therefore, bought and installed a long tank
3. you are the first person on this thread to mention fender. no one here has said they are chasing a fender sounding reverb

i do believe very much in A/B'ing, but you are assuming a lot........

[Paul Marossy]

I built an early GGG reverb, I thought it sounded pretty good. I have one installed in two of my amps that previously didn't have reverb. IMO it's close to a Fender spring reverb sound, depending on which amp model you want to compare it to. But my Twin Reverb still sounds the most heavenly.

[armdnrdy]

Karl,

I'm not one to assume.

Before I built my reverb unit I watched Smallbear's stock (which is displayed on the product page) go up and down for two years, with the short brick selling down more often.

The type of stompbox that we are referring to is a reverb pedal....Agree?
I would imagine (here I go assuming) that you would want a reverb pedal to sound like a....well...a reverb pedal! Agree?
One of the most compared reverb sounds is the Fender...Agree?

I was also going by the person who started this threads comment:
My finger was hovering over the buy button and there was an alarm bell ringing in my head.  "ITS NOT A DELAY PAUL"

I posted on this thread to help Paul not to argue.  

[kodiakklub]

i suppose they should rebrand the long one as a delay tank then, cause it's obviously not a reverb tank 

[armdnrdy]

In case anyone has any questions on what it takes to produce an optimum reverb.

Reverberation is the persistence of sound in a particular space after the original sound is produced.[1] A reverberation, or reverb, is created when a sound is produced in an enclosed space causing a large number of echoes to build up and then slowly decay as the sound is absorbed by the walls and air.[2] This is most noticeable when the sound source stops but the reflections continue, decreasing in amplitude, until they can no longer be heard. The length of this sound decay, or reverberation time, receives special consideration in the architectural design of large chambers, which need to have specific reverberation times to achieve optimum performance for their intended activity. [3] In comparison to a distinct echo that is 50 to 100 ms after the initial sound, reverberation is many thousands of echoes that arrive in very quick succession (.01 – 1 ms between echoes). As time passes, the volume of the many echoes is reduced until the echoes cannot be heard at all.

[Paul Marossy]

Reverberation is the persistence of sound in a particular space after the original sound is produced.[1] A reverberation, or reverb, is created when a sound is produced in an enclosed space causing a large number of echoes to build up and then slowly decay as the sound is absorbed by the walls and air.[2] This is most noticeable when the sound source stops but the reflections continue, decreasing in amplitude, until they can no longer be heard. The length of this sound decay, or reverberation time, receives special consideration in the architectural design of large chambers, which need to have specific reverberation times to achieve optimum performance for their intended activity. [3] In comparison to a distinct echo that is 50 to 100 ms after the initial sound, reverberation is many thousands of echoes that arrive in very quick succession (.01 – 1 ms between echoes). As time passes, the volume of the many echoes is reduced until the echoes cannot be heard at all.

Reminds me of how a mirror's reflection in another mirror can be altered by changing the angle of one of the mirrors - you can go from a few reflections to very many - but it's sound waves instead.