Recording setup

[Rock_on]

I dont know if this is the right place,

So here's my thoughts

Guitar>amp>mic>computer (vst fx example amplitube... Just an example)>mic the speaker>audition/audacity

Guitar>computer (vst fx)>speaker out>(buffer?? Line in to mic converter or just lower the volume to avoid distortion)>amp>mic>Audition/audacity

Guitar>computer (vst fx)>mic the speaker>audition/audacity

In recording, what's the best?

And in live performance, what's the best too? (ignore the audition/audacity)


And btw what should i use? Buffer or preamp?? So i can plug my guitar to computer? Without it, it's fine but i think it would be better if i use one..


Sorry coz i cant afford those expensive interfaces,equipments,etc

[artifus]

as joe meek said "if it sounds good, it is good"

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan09/articles/loudelectricguitar.htm
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/Dec02/articles/recordingguitars.asp
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug07/articles/guitaramprecording.htm
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug98/articles/20tips.html

rules are made to be broken

[Jazznoise]

It really depends on your approach, style and philosophy. Some people use hardware or software amp sims - Sansamp, Dr. Boogie's, Line 6 etc. - others use amps. The difference here is between capturing the output of a processor and sound of an instrument in a room.

If you like how your guitar sounds in the room, with an amp. Then mic'ing it is your best bet. Mic technique and choice varies amongst people. I use an ECM 8000 alot, but my 57, EV635a and RM700 all get used from time to time.

For DI'ing to an interface from a hardware amp sim, just jack straight in. For software sims you'll need to DI your guitar before it hits the preamp so that it sees a high impedance (500K+ is what you're looking for). Since you'll be monitoring the output of the software and processing involved in simulating an amp takes time, you'll need to lower the buffer size so that the latency is smaller and the sound won't "lag" behind your playing too much. Some people are fine with 512 samples, I prefer 256 or lower. This can be important, and I've been involved in a masters experiment before where they deliberately lagged my speech playback behind me by various rates. We constantly try to resynchronise, and this weird feedback jams our speech near completely.

If you've spent alot on gear, cheaping out on interfaces always seems strange to em. Avoid built in soundcards as they're prone to ground loops. Something like a 100 dollar 2 in 2 out interface will make a big difference. For software I use Reaper as it's very stable for multitracking (Live setups, bands, multi-mic'ing a single instrument) and I like it for editing and mixing too.

[Mike Burgundy]

+1 on the interface. Roland duo- capture or a Focustrite 2i2 will go such a long way...
Both have a hi-Z input so it's possible to plug in a guitar directly, and sport nice mic-pres.

There's nothing quite as nice as using a good well setup amp, in a great sounding room, with really good, well setup mics. There's an art to that, and a price tag, but with experimentation you can get really good results with more affordable stuff too. I've also had very good results with a POD.

[Resynthesis]

These days I like to split my guitar signal so I've one feed going to the amp as usual and a DI to my computer interface. This means I can have both the normal miced speaker and can later use the DI track for reamping and/or processing with VSTs

[mremic01]

The first thing you'll need in a recording setup is an interface. I'll definitely second the Focusrite 2i2. Focusrite uses the same preamps in their cheaper stuff as in their fancier interfaces and tend to be a bit nicer than similarly priced models put out by other manufacturers. I'm also going to strongly recommend ditching Audacity for Reaper, which is a real DAW. For basic recording, Reaper is no more difficult to use, and offers so much more.

I've messed around with a few recording methods and here's what I've found.

I hate vsti's. PodFarm, GuitarRig, and all that.  I could never get them to sound right and spent more time fiddling than I did playing.

The Pod 2.0 is a great way to record quietly and get a ton of different sounds. Some tones are better than others. But for < 99$ on the used market, it's an incredible tool. Even if you wouldn't want to use it for your primary tones, you have so many options for parts of a song that call for a different sound or a cool effect. The one thing I don't like about it is that there's a tiny bit of latency. It's only noticeable when I'm trying to double track with a mic going into one input and the Pod going into another. The signal coming out of the Pod is just a fraction of a second behind the mic.

Sansamp's Character Series pedals have cab sims built into them and you can plug them straight into an interface. No latency issues and all and they sound great.

I've tried putting the Marshall Cab Sim from Tonepad after some pedals and running it straight into my Saffire 6, and it was ok. Not as good as other options, but useable.

I bought an AxeTrak isocab, which is incredibly useful but doesn't sound all that amazing. It really cuts down the sound of your playing, while still being audible. It doesn't pair well with my 100W amps, but sounds much better with my 5W amp and pedals.

There's also the Palmer PD09 and The H&K Red Box. Those have cab sim circuitry built in and connect to your speaker output so you can get the power amp's effect on your tone in your recorded signal. Both get pretty good reviews, but I haven't tried either yet. I did try running my Dual Rec and JCM800's DI ouput into the Marshall Cab Sim and then into the interface and it was still kind of harsh, but better than just the DI outputs by themselves.  

Then, of course, you could always just mic a cab like you would in a studio. But then you need to get the amp loud enough to get some speaker excursion.

Right now my preferred recording setup looks like this:


Guitar -> Signal Splitter -> DR Boogey -> Marshall Cab Sim -> Blackheart BH-5 -> AxeTrak -> Focusrite Saffire 6 Input 1
                                      Split Signal -> Sansamp British -> Focusrite Saffire 6 Input 2

[Kipper4]

+1 on the interface.
I dont think you will be happy with the sound you get from an onboard sound card. Basically they are made from cheap componants and are intended to make beeps and such.
The latency will drive you mad and as someone pointed out earlier you will likely get a ground loop.
you wont regret getting an interface for recording. get something that has asio drivers (not asio4all).
you can buy second hand and get one with a couple of in/out and built in mic pre's.
Those Focusrites are nice but can be expensive in some countrys.
check this out


http://homerecording.com/bbs/general-discussions/newbies/introduction-multitrack-computer-interface-recording-323561/

not spamming.

I hope it helps

[Resynthesis]

get something that has asio drivers (not asio4all).

I always try asio4all as well as the manufacturer's driver. It's sometimes turned out to have lower latency and/or been more stable.

[Rock_on]

Hey guys

Sorry for the late reply, my friend has an interface but he told me that it was brought not here in our local shops.

Can i just make one? Negative for the passive DI

Cant audio transformers and maybe it would be expensive..

Can i just make one?

Like buffered preamp? Something like that?

Haha enjoying my college life... Though little busy

[reverberation66]

I usually just set up a boombox and press record. Live to tape, sounds great!  I have a four track cassette recorder if I wanna get fancy.  10 dollar microphone. 

[Kipper4]

You could just make one if you know how to make an AD/DA converter. (analogue to digital converter, digital to analogue)
Essentially that is what your interface is for.
Shop around seriously they are not ALL expensive.
If you read the post i linked to you'd understand why its important to get an interface to make better recordings.
A buffered preamp as you call it won't convert your analogue signal  (eg mic/mic preamp) to a digital signal that the computer can understand and work with.

Yes you can just get a boombox and press record that would work but its going to be difficult to get the levels of all the band instruments at the correct volume. This is why we mix tracks. to alter the volumes, add effects if needs be, etc.

Fortunately for us our ears can hear a good sound level by just listening to one instrument or more at a time and filtering out the others. But a mic cant do this and this is why we need to mix tracks. Well part of it anyway.

Check it out stick a tape machine (phone) in the band practice room and press record and listen back and see how many minutes it is before you start to hear something that sticks out as too loud, too soft. Too dynamic.

It might work in the context of singer/song writer (vocals and guitar say) for someone wanting to get there ideas down for further development or just as a so i dont forget what i wrote 5 yrs ago.
But a full band is a differant story.IMO
I wish you luck.

[artifus]

I usually just set up a boombox and press record. Live to tape, sounds great!  I have a four track cassette recorder if I wanna get fancy.  10 dollar microphone.  

^ that's the spirit!

if you are to use your computers internal sound card any buffered pedal should serve as an input buffer/impedance matcher. you may need level attenuation too and you'll want to familiarize yourself with your onboard sound cards driver and software to disable any fx or mic boost, etc it may apply to incoming signals. consider asio4all. some widoze centric links for you:

http://www.native-instruments.com/knowledge/questions/847/Windows+7+Tuning+Tips+for+Audio+Processing
http://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/downloads/Windows_7_Optimization_Guide.pdf
http://www.asio4all.com/
http://www.reaper.fm/
http://www.guitarampmodeling.com/

have fun!

*also* http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=85913.0 http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?;topic=95461.0 http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?;topic=100542.0 may work if you only have mic in. worth a look. lofi but will get you going so you can try some freeware before spending any cash.

*also, also* about the sound card snobbery: is this not akin to insisting on the ridiculous?  i agree and have a decent audio interface to use when appropriate. i am also out and about with a laptop occasionally and a cheap diy matchbox sized device to get down a quick idea or capture a spontaneous moment quickly and without fuss can be handy. not to mention useful with low spec netbooks, androids or linux or 'old' clunky hardware with limited driver resources. some of these recordings have made it on to commercially released material despite their audio 'quality'. some of the opinions expressed here appear to be based on myths started some ten years ago. technology moves on. the op has made their situation 'quite' (as in almost, and that's considering translation difficulties) clear so let's help them out in making the most of what they've got.  if i requested mods for my squire strat you wouldn't suggest i instead buy a two thousand dollar fender and if i asked if i should buy a 200 dollar fuzz face off of ebay you'd scream at me that i could make my own for twenty.  

Yes you can just get a boombox and press record that would work but its going to be difficult to get the levels of all the band instruments at the correct volume. This is why we mix tracks. to alter the volumes, add effects if needs be, etc.

Fortunately for us our ears can hear a good sound level by just listening to one instrument or more at a time and filtering out the others. But a mic cant do this and this is why we need to mix tracks. Well part of it anyway.

Check it out stick a tape machine (phone) in the band practice room and press record and listen back and see how many minutes it is before you start to hear something that sticks out as too loud, too soft. Too dynamic.

you'll be recommending auto-tune next  

such a recording can be quite enlightening for a band as to how they should arrange themselves, so to speak...

a recording is a recording and performance is king when discussing 'quality' in musical terms imho. sorry - rant over  

[Rock_on]

Omg!! Headache.... I'll just wait and save money to buy an interface..

Oh can i ask one more thing for last? You guys familiar with condor cab sim??

Is it standalone? I mean just plug the guitar then to (preamp first if needed) interface or direct to pc (rog said that not me ) or guitar> (preamp if needed) amp>condor sim??

Well if it is standalone (rog also said i can use it for headphone practice) can i put speaker instead of headphones jack?? How many watts is it??

I want to use it in our classroom when the teacher is not yet in our class..

[Rock_on]

Omg!! Headache.... I'll just wait and save money to buy an interface..

Oh can i ask one more thing for last? You guys familiar with condor cab sim??

Is it standalone? I mean just plug the guitar then to (preamp first if needed) interface or direct to pc (rog said that not me ) or guitar> (preamp if needed) amp>condor sim??

Well if it is standalone (rog also said i can use it for headphone practice) can i put speaker instead of headphones jack?? How many watts is it??

I want to use it in our classroom when the teacher is not yet in our class..

[petey twofinger]

 my latest and favorite approach is using my korg pandora , sure its a cop out , but i like the sound / effects and nothing beats a single usb cable to the pc , guitar cable  to the pandora , and a pair of headphones . i suppose this is very similar to using a pod . it aint the best tone , perhaps , but man is it simple , andto my ears its sounds fantastic . the emu 0404 i use is great but man its a hassle to get setup

[StephenGiles]

One word of warning - volume too high through headphones can damage your ears. I know that it sounds much better at the time, but when you wake up in the night and all you can hear is hissing in your ears you may have slight regrets!

[Mustachio]

I've been setting up a small cheap recording set up just for fun. It's cheap and works well , The main interface is a behringer xenyx 1204usb , usb mixer with 4 xlr inputs with preamps the rest of the channels are stereo 1/4.  Could probably pick one up for 100 bucks or less.

If you want to use something like this to record the whole band at once on one track your best bet is to isolate the drummer as well as you can and mic everything. could build little blanket forts around the drums and amps,and run headphone amp to everyone. You can also record one track at a time, start with a metronome click track, then lay down part by part .

My set up I have a virtualizer for reverb/delay , composer pro compressor, bbe sonic maximizer . I use the rack effects really light in fact I just got the compressor and haven't set everything up how its going to be. I normally just ran reverb in the aux2 fx loop of the mixer. The sonic maximizer will probably go between the mixer and the power amp and only used for sound outside of the usb mix.

I prefer the sound of a real amp and a mic that's set up well. And I don't like the latency when running in and out of the computer for processing my guitar signal. But all those VST plugins could be useful for mastering your recordings and cleaning them up making them sound more refined. I don't usually go through that effort myself I just just hit record and usually delete it after haha.

When I had a band together over here some times I would just hit record on the computer and only have 2 mics going in the room and the audio quality of practices where very listenable with a bit of post processing eq it was great! I wouldn't call it studio polished but sounded nice.