Guild TRIOCT (whhhaaaaaaat??)

[digi2t]

Here ya go folks. The latest, greatest, fandango hen's tooth. Just when you all thought that the Ludwig was some sort of manned mission to Effect Mars, this sucker will take it to a neighbouring universe. My Mutron Flanger trace just took a temporary back seat. The Guild Tri-Oct. No nitty-gritty details yet, but Mark believes that it's some sort of very early guitar synth missing link. Sort of like Neanderthal man... or your uncle Lou, who no one ever invites over for Christmas dinner, but shows anyway.

Here are the preliminary pictures to whet your appetite. WARNING: MATURE TRANSISTOR CONTENT, AND EXPLICT CAPACITORS. THIS PROGRAM MAY NOT BE SUITABLE FOR ALL BUILDERS. VIEWER DISCRETION IS ADVISED!





























































All together now....

WHHHAAAAAATTTTT!!!!

[mistahead]

Also do not press red button...

DAMMIT I WANNA!

[Thecomedian]

too...many...pictures AUGH

thanks for crashing my browser

[glops]

Holy mother of ...........

[Chugs]

Hmmm... Looks cool but needs a few more transistors I think... 

[tca]

Looks very symmetric that PCB...

[~arph]

Yeah, looks like we have a hex pickup and six similar circuit topologies in there.

ALSO: Don't forget to link to Mark's original description:

http://archive.ampage.org/threads/2/fxsb/085800/Re_First_octave_dividers-1.html

[Mark Hammer]

The Tri-Oct shares a lot in common with Michael Jackson's, Britney Spears', and Justin Bieber's choreography.  That is, there's likely a lot less going on than you think, but it LOOKS like a lot simply because there's so much of the same thing.

I suspect when Dino is done with it, we'll see that it is probably very similar to a Shin-Ei or Maestro octave-divider, but times six.  The interesting thing about it is not the effect itself, but where and when in guitar effect history someone had the idea to throw this together.  Not a stompbox, and not quite a guitar synth, it timidly explores the possibility of what one could do if each string was processed separately.  Keep in mind that by the late 1960's, there were already octave dividers for amplified reed instruments, like the Conn Multi-vider ( http://www.doctorsax.biz/conn_multivider_0001.htm ).  So flip-flop based dividers were known and used.  The shift in thinking came with the use of a divided pickup such that monophonic technology could be applied to polyphonic instruments.

The same sort of shift occurred with the development of MIDI.  Until MIDI came along in 1983, synths could be as complicated as you want, with walls full of knobs and patch cords.  But they were largely monophonic, because there was no readily available means for turning multiple concurrent key-presses into something to exploit multiple parallel processing of those notes.  Even the much-beloved Radio Shack MG-1 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moog_Concertmate_MG-1 ), produced in 1981, was not fully and truly polyphonic, even though it could play chords and seemingly filter and apply envelopes.  But once there was a way to have every single key pressed be processed individually....WATCH OUT!

And that's what the Tri-Oct system did.  We would not see a fully-fledged parallel-processed guitar synth until the 1976-77 period when several different products burst onto the scene.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guitar_synthesizer

[analogguru]

I suspect when Dino is done with it, we'll see that it is probably very similar to a Shin-Ei or Maestro octave-divider, but times six.

Nope... Far away from both. Dito from the Conn Multivider or the Vox Octavoice.  It has also nothing to do with any of the EH-stuff.

[Mark Hammer]

So what do you think it is?

[Morocotopo]

Oh Lord. You´re not gonna clone that, are you? The Ludwig already scares me...

What size is it? Looks like a Marshall head more or less...

The first divided pickup ever? Were you supposed to install it in replacement of one of the standard pickups or put it as an extra one?

Are the trannys germanium?

[bluebunny]

So what do you think it is?

I thought it was a beat-up iPhone...   

[petey twofinger]

we're gonna need a bigger boat ...

[Quackzed]

 
i have a guess of what it 'does'... but i'll keep mum and just say that it looks really cool. like a science fair project that made it to the big time.

[PRR]

> Are the trannys germanium?

The metal-can 2N404 2N388 certainly are.

The black jelly-bean epoxy transistors are almost certainly from TI's silicon foundry.

Ah, if you _read_ Mark Hammer's 2001 post they are revealed as 2N5133s, Silicon, broad current gain range, modest voltage, but good noise figure for the time (1.5dB at 1KHz 30uA 10K source).

Dunno how both types ended in one design. Maybe the PNP/NPN Ge pair is a doubler?

The PCB sure looks like someone worked in Big Electronics, though whether Computers or Military I can't guess.

The big 3-pin is a G.E. power transistor. We even know the polarity: collector is at +30V, and I bet there's at most a Zener (maybe just a cap) to its Base, so it's NPN. If it fails, any NPN power type will do. Plastic "2N3055" is most common (overkill but inexpensive).

[digi2t]

I could see myself using a Russian GT402/GT404 combo in a clone instead of the 404/388's. Much less expensive.

Size-wise, probably end up rack mounting this sucker.

I'll get to tracing it, as soon as I repackage the Mutron.

[deadastronaut]

So what do you think it is?

I thought it was a beat-up iPhone...  

wtf? ....is that a crude hex pup then?....nevemind, re-read it.

[analogguru]

The board houses what look to be 6 identical circuits lined up side by side and a seventh, which I assume is for straight signal. Each string circuit uses eight 2N5133's, a 2N388, and a 2N404 (yup, two Ge trannies!), along with six 1N270 Ge diodes, a trimpot (noted above) and a wad of big clunky ceramic caps. 

And I assume, that there are seven 2N5133 and one 2N4250 (or similar).

BTW, which value do the greenies and the vertical mounted resistor have?

[bluebunny]

I thought it was a beat-up iPhone...  

wtf? ....is that a crude hex pup then?....nevemind, re-read it.

I think you might be right, Rob.      Facetious?  Moi?? 

[deadastronaut]

pretentious moi?...(fawlty towers )