My First Build - Noob Advice Required about components.

[steveyraff]

pot mounting first. the pots you have are for pcb mounting. the intention is for the pins to go through the board itself, no wires needed. for "flying leads", manufacturers offer solder lug terminations. these are the tags w/ the hole in the middle.

however. we all usually just make do, or booger, bodgie, kludge with what we have at hand. so, without using the rivet hole (it may allow the rivet to loosen, or a shorted wire to the case) wrap the wire you have, in this case solid core makes it easier, around the end of the pin. squeeze it w/ pliers or otherwise hold it so it doesn't move, and solder. that's all there is to it.

you can, of course, cut a tiny bit of vero board ~5x3 ?, and push it onto the pins, and solder. then solder a stranded wire into another of the holes along the pin tracks. that way you keep the blokes at alpha happy by correct use of their product, and you keep me happy by correct use of stranded wire, and you keep yourself happy because the end result is reliable and component-stress free.

to orientation. turn the pot down, as if a volume control. that direction is anti- or counterclockwise. the wiper is now at the ccw pin. this end is cold, and will most often be nearest the ground, as in this case. the other, cw terminal, is hot, and the full signal comes in there. the middle, common, centre or wiper is the output, the variable. think in terms of ccw and cw, instead of 1,2,3, and the confusion will generally disappear.

as for "reverse", it describes the curve of the change of resistance relative to the rotation of the shaft. the resistance at the wiper still increases as you turn cw, but it increases at a different rate. the pot itself is not reversed.

is that a socket I see?

Very well explained.

On my first build (the one not boxed in yet), I just used pliers to wrap and crimp the single core wire around the pin/lug of the pot. That held it in place and I soldered it on then, without using the hole. So I guess this is the way I should stick with, yea?

Great explanation about the pot orientation. Understanding, and thinking in terms about how it actually functions, solves the confusion.

YES! Thats IS a socket you spotted. I put that socket in before my prior questions in regards to the subject were answered.

I'm making another copy of the more complicated drive pedal that this thread is actually about. This time, I am NOT socketing any of the Diodes or Transistors. I still often wonder why my friend seemed insistent that if I didn't socket these, they'd definitely be damaged. Did he mean just through the heat of soldering? I'm lot better with my soldering now and more speedy, there isn't as much time for heat to build anymore.

Thanks for listening to my queries and providing very useful help and tips. Its highly appreciated.

P.S

I've been trying to move to stranded wire for my wiring. Trouble is, when I tin the ends, they never fit through the PCB or vero board holes.

[Kipper4]

I use insulation tape to hold the sockets in place on the componants side then solder one leg. I mostly build perfboard builds. It works for pcb's too.
Remove the tape and solder in the other componants legs etc
The reason I use sockets in most of my builds is because if I'm not going to box it I can reuse the transistor for another build.

[duck_arse]

show us how thick is your stranded wire? you need to twist the loose strands tight before you tin, so the end won't splay/fray/spread. you only need enuff solder to hold the strands together in a bunch. there is a frowned upon technique, where you get rid of excess tinning solder by banging the hand holding the wire with still hot solder on the bench. this will flick the extra off, but you never know where it will go ....

[Kipper4]

Mostly on my thigh if I remember correctly Duck pops.

[mth5044]

I'm a nude solderer, so I don't use that technique too much.

I'm also a nude cooker, but cooking bacon has never been a problem 

[Jdansti]

Sometimes you get an unnoticeable thick section of solder near the end. I use some sharp wire cutters to snip off the end at a steep angle after I tin. This makes it kinda pointy and helps to thread it through the PCB hole.

[steveyraff]

http://tagboardeffects.blogspot.co.uk/2010/07/zvex-super-hard-on-updated-version.html

Can you guys help me finish this side project I'm working on?

I have it all finished - its just the offboard wiring confusing me. I was following the mad bean standardised offboard wiring diagram (http://www.madbeanpedals.com/tutorials/downloads/StandardWiring_MBP.pdf) , but on this circuit, there seems to be a different method of wiring in the LED? And what is VE? In most builds I've seen, the LED and a resistor goes between the switch and the DC input. So I am not sure how to wire this one up and where that LED + VE cable is supposed to be going?

[Jdansti]

VE+ is the positive side of the LED. Follow the off board wiring diagram but omit the resistor since it's already on the board and connect the VE+ to the long lead of your LED. The neg lead of the LED connects to the switch as shown. 

[steveyraff]

VE+ is the positive side of the LED. Follow the off board wiring diagram but omit the resistor since it's already on the board and connect the VE+ to the long lead of your LED. The neg lead of the LED connects to the switch as shown. 

Thanks.

I've done everything as shown, but I ain't getting any signal at all. Wether its bypassed or not. For a brief moment, I got bypassed signal.

I'll send a few photos of my offboard wiring. I must have messed it up somewhere along the way, somehow. Oh and my LED isn't working - although I am pretty sure its getting power so it might be a dud LED. I can hear a little bit of background noise when the pedal is switched on so something must be going through somewhere.

[Jdansti]

Good attempt, but I see some beginner's mistakes. Unfortunately, the off board diagram doesn't do a good job of showing the power jack terminals, and this led you to connect it incorrectly.

It's hard to tell from the photos, but is the purple wire connected to the lug that is riveted in the center of the jack?  Once I know this, I can help you more.

[Jdansti]

Here's how the jack should be connected. Follow this and connect the board ground, switch ground, and 1/4" jack grounds all to the same point, such as one of the 1/4" jack sleeves or the power jack ground as shown below.

[steveyraff]

Good attempt, but I see some beginner's mistakes. Unfortunately, the off board diagram doesn't do a good job of showing the power jack terminals, and this led you to connect it incorrectly.

It's hard to tell from the photos, but is the purple wire connected to the lug that is riveted in the center of the jack?  Once I know this, I can help you more.

Some help would be great, thanks John. As you can probably tell from this, and the questions I had about my last pedal - Off Board Wiring is what I struggle with the most.

So from PCB Input, to switch centre lug. From PCB Output, to switch upper right lug. From PCB 9V to DC Lug (via purple wire, not sure if this is the correct DC Lug to go to?). Middle DC socket lug to battery snap positive. Battery snap minus to jacksocket Sleeve. PCB LED + VE  to LED Annode, then LED Cathode (flat side) to the switches upper left lug.

By the way, I am confused as to my orientation here... is the jack socket on the left for Input? I presumed it is. If so, input jack tip lug to switches bottom right lug. The sleeve to switches lower left lug. The output jack TIP lug to switch middle right lug. The Pot's two lugs connected to switches bottom left lug.

On the switch I have the bottom left, middle left, bottom middle lugs all connected. I also have a jumper connecting the switches bottom right lug to the top middle lug.

I think this explains ALL my off board wiring. I have looked carefully to see if anything is touching one another, but so far I can't see anything like that.

At the last minute I panicked a bit and oddly connected the input jack socket sleeve with the other jacks tip lug. I think this is wrong anyway ?

Plenty of noob errors here I am sure.  

[Mustachio]

Take a look at this too its good reference.

http://generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_sw_3pdt_tb_gi_dcj.pdf

[steveyraff]

Take a look at this too its good reference.

http://generalguitargadgets.com/pdf/ggg_sw_3pdt_tb_gi_dcj.pdf

I guess I could try rewiring it that way Mustachio. Although I am confused as to why it seems completely different to the way I've currently done it following the other diagrams.

EDIT: Whatever I've done - I am now getting bypassed signal. When I engage the pedal, as I first press the switch, the LED comes on very brightly, but instantly fades down until it looks barely on.

Any ideas?

DOUBLE BONUS EDIT: Ok, I think its something to do with a little jumper I put into the switch to join up what I think are grounds. I toggled the little wire about and suddenly the LED glowed brighter. Now the effect seems to be 'sort of' working. I am getting signal with the pedal engaged, and the pot is working, but I feel something is not quite right. It definitely seems a lot darker than normal, and when the pot is turned all the way down, the engaged signal is quite a bit lower and darker than the bypassed signal. I soldered the jumper cable a little better. Definitely doesn't sound anything like I think it should though.

[mth5044]

and when the pot is turned all the way down, the engaged signal is quite a bit lower and darker than the bypassed signal. I soldered the jumper cable a little better. Definitely doesn't sound anything like I think it should though.

When you turn the pot lower, the volume goes down. What are you expecting to happen, it goes up? 

For the dark tone, check that you have the correct value input cap.

[steveyraff]

and when the pot is turned all the way down, the engaged signal is quite a bit lower and darker than the bypassed signal. I soldered the jumper cable a little better. Definitely doesn't sound anything like I think it should though.

When you turn the pot lower, the volume goes down. What are you expecting to happen, it goes up? 

For the dark tone, check that you have the correct value input cap.

Lol - Oh I understand that part. I just listened to a lot of Super Hard On reviews and my understanding was that when the pot was down fully, it would be the same volume as the bypassed signal. The values are all correct (I hadn't many to go wrong with!). It is very dark sounding. From a lot of audio and written reviews, it was my understanding that it would be the opposite if anything - a brighter sound when engaged. Instead, it gets darker as the pedal's pot is increased.

Very strange.

[Kipper4]

I'm not at home to look at my sho right now and this wifi connections tenuous but I will say I'd get some practice soldering before doing those switchs. As seen in the 3pdt thread if you overheat the terminals too much then the epoxy cracks and the switch can go bad.
Been there. And it's an expensive lesson when the whole board costs less than the switch.
I use the left over resistor legs to make the jumpers on the switch and solder just enough to allow the solder to flow and get a good mechanical bond.
Can I ask what type of solder you are using.
I use low melt 60/40 lead stuff.
Also I think the fact you are using single strand wiring is not helping. I use seven strand and tin the ends before doing switches and pots.
I also tin the pot and switch connections before hand. Tinning the wire ends allows you to cut the ends short before soldering the two together. If the wires insulation shrinks back a bit get that as close to the connection as possible and then you can trim the through hole wires after.
Sorry if I'm teaching my granny to suck eggs but I thought it might just help
Rich

[steveyraff]

I'm not at home to look at my sho right now and this wifi connections tenuous but I will say I'd get some practice soldering before doing those switchs. As seen in the 3pdt thread if you overheat the terminals too much then the epoxy cracks and the switch can go bad.
Been there. And it's an expensive lesson when the whole board costs less than the switch.
I use the left over resistor legs to make the jumpers on the switch and solder just enough to allow the solder to flow and get a good mechanical bond.
Can I ask what type of solder you are using.
I use low melt 60/40 lead stuff.
Also I think the fact you are using single strand wiring is not helping. I use seven strand and tin the ends before doing switches and pots.
I also tin the pot and switch connections before hand. Tinning the wire ends allows you to cut the ends short before soldering the two together. If the wires insulation shrinks back a bit get that as close to the connection as possible and then you can trim the through hole wires after.
Sorry if I'm teaching my granny to suck eggs but I thought it might just help
Rich

I think my soldering is OK at the moment. I am using 60/40 too. I mostly used stranded wire on this build, but yea, theres a few single core ones in there that I'd left over.

I am thinking of stripping my switch and starting it over again tomorrow. It was obvious I'd done something wrong or shoddily there since it started working again when I added more solder to the jumpers. I think I'll just remove the battery clip because I honestly never use those so its just adding extra complications to my novice off board wiring problems.

Asides from all of this, I've been listening to more SHO clone and original pedal demos and this one definitely sounds a lot darker with a volume dip at unity gain. When the gain is up full, its dark and not as tight, a very muddy broken sounding distortion. I am sure my 5K1 resistors are correct, but the different colour codes on those on the example pictures throws me a bit. Cap values are definitely correct, and its the correct diode.

Disappointing as I just did this on the side as a quick reward because of the other pedal I'm doing being a bit of a beastly build. Oh well. 

Thanks for the help so far.

[steveyraff]

No luck with the Super Hard On. Either that or I just don't like it and its nothing like how I thought it sounded on demo's.

However, I did make a successful copy of the Pete Cornish G-2. This one has a lot more of the suggested Cap mods to help with brightness. Despite these, there is little to no difference between it and my original version without the mods.



Its a great pedal, but the low end is very loose which takes away from its usability. I tend to only use fully open tone settings with it. Its a really excellent overdrive, reminiscent of my Orange Dual Terror's overdrive channel. I find the Tone control useless for my tastes as the darkness it dials in when rolled back makes the overdrive loose sounding, like... 'farting'.

By the way, why are some pots functioning the wrong way around? Does it mean I've them wired in the wrong order? Also, I'm making a mess because the stranded wire I bought is too thick and I have to keep trimming the ends down. Someone here mentioned they use 7 strand? That always seems about right when I trim it down to that. Is there a certain name for that kind?

I'll enclose these pedals in the next few days and post some pics and audio demos. Thanks all for the help all the way.

Any suggestions on other good overdrives to try? I was thinking something fairly high gain. Was going to go for the Triple Wreck but it looks like another beast of a build.

[Kipper4]

Which schematic did you use for the g2 ?
And what size input cap did you use? This can make a huge difference to the overall tone of a pedal.