My First Build - Noob Advice Required about components.

[steveyraff]

Ok thats worth keeping in mind. Thanks Kipper.

Well - I guess I still would like to know if 'solvent-based' is safe enough to use with water slide decals - if anyone knows?

I can't find this info anywhere.

[Jdansti]

It's been a long time since I've used water slide decals, but I think that the solvent based varnish caused the clear places on the decals to turn white. I can't say that I'm very sure of that.

Something else to consider is whether you're using inkjet or laser printing. Inkjet might have some issues with water based finishes. You might want to search the forum for "water slide decals". There may be some tutorials.

Edit: read this. http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=104431.0

[steveyraff]

It's been a long time since I've used water slide decals, but I think that the solvent based varnish caused the clear places on the decals to turn white. I can't say that I'm very sure of that.

Something else to consider is whether you're using inkjet or laser printing. Inkjet might have some issues with water based finishes. You might want to search the forum for "water slide decals". There may be some tutorials.

Edit: read this. http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=104431.0

Thanks as always John. I had searched, but never came across that thread. It seems oil based finishes either leave an amber tint after curing, or can dissolve the paint, making it soft. I wonder is that the same for solvent based?

I should probably go for water-based and play it safe.

Also never thought about sanding and buffing until I read this. Good tip though.

[steveyraff]

Decal went on today.

Scrapped the first one as I got a crease in it from trying to hard to get every bubble out.

Second try worked a little better. Followed the advice found in many youtube videos, as well as this board on how to apply them correctly.

I think its on as good as I am ever gonna get it. Maybe I have a bad quality paper or something though. Heres what happens; I apply the decal on my enclosure, then place and position it, then wipe it off with wet fingers and push the air bubbles off over the sides. I push the bubbles out using wet fingers, I've tried kitchen paper, clean sponges etc. Either way, I get it so I am happy, not a bubble in sight.

THEN - Within the first few minutes of drying, the whole decal surface becomes textured. It begins to look the same way an enamel finish would, this seems to be caused but 100's of tiny, little mini bubbles all across the surface. Hard to describe, harder to photograph. It literally looks like a textured enamel finish. I actually don't mind it much, and I presume it'll stay put once I start applying clear coat over it for a few layers. I just wonder is this normal. I am starting to think that its the actual decal layer shrivelling or warping that causes it - this leads me to suspect my paper isn't as good a quality as it could be. It was very expensive so I figured it'd be fine.

I wonder am I treating my surface properly. I buy my 1590BB's pre painted white. I just clean the surface with water and a cloth then leave a very small amount of water on the surface. The first time I thought perhaps I left too much water on the surface - second time I used hardly any to the same outcome.

Steve.

[steveyraff]

Ok , so the enamel bubbly effect on the decal was liveable.

THEN I tried to seal it with a layer of polyurethane clear coat. DISASTER.

The polyurethane doesn't seem to like the decal paper and it instantly crinkled up upon contact. I've probably messed this whole enclosure up at this stage. Cant see this all coming off again.

I feel like just buying new paper AND buying new Acrylic spray online. I have to buy both these online as I can't find them locally. I already spend about £30 on all this so I'm going to have to spend that AGAIN. I'm pretty frustrated right now.

I'm opening a bottle of wine...
Goodnight.

EDIT: Here's a thought. If this blistering was made even worse when I tried to seal the decal on with a clear coat layer - perhaps the problem is the polyurethane coat. Maybe its the spray that is warping the plastic on the decal paper??

[Kipper4]

Oh man I wish I could help you out there Stevie but I've never done water slide decal.

[steveyraff]

Oh man I wish I could help you out there Stevie but I've never done water slide decal.

Took everything off down to the white paint using the girlfriends nail polish remover. I'm gonna buy acrylic clear coat and try that tomorrow night.

I really think its something to do with the chemicals in this polyurethane spray reacting with the thin plastic decal membrane. It smells strongly of solvent - I think its causing it to pucker up. I need something gentler. On this board a lot of people speak highly of Krylon Acrylic clear coat spray. It costs a fortune though. Sigh....

[Kipper4]

Your in the uk right?
I'm not sure this clear coat I use will work with decals but I can't see why it wouldn't.
I use
Rust-olium crystal clear
It costs around 7 squid in my local hardware store
This is the stuff

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rust-Oleum-Crystal-Clear-Gloss-Spray-Paint-Protective-Top-Coat-400ml-/170830231158?pt=UK_DIY_Material_Paint_Varnish_MJ&hash=item27c6467676

And here's a post I found by searching the forum about decals

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=69155.0

[steveyraff]

Your in the uk right?
I'm not sure this clear coat I use will work with decals but I can't see why it wouldn't.
I use
Rust-olium crystal clear
It costs around 7 squid in my local hardware store
This is the stuff

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rust-Oleum-Crystal-Clear-Gloss-Spray-Paint-Protective-Top-Coat-400ml-/170830231158?pt=UK_DIY_Material_Paint_Varnish_MJ&hash=item27c6467676

And here's a post I found by searching the forum about decals

http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=69155.0

Cheers dude. Yep, I'm in Northern Ireland. I seen this can of RustOleum right next to the can I picked up - but neither say Acrylic so I am reluctant to risk this still. I am considering just spending the fortune on the Krylon Acrylic spray to make sure I am doing it all correctly.

I seen that thread - but thanks for the heads up. I am sure I am doing everything else correctly in terms of applying the decal. I am convinced its this potent polyurethane spray I am using - it sure smells toxic anyway, its not reacting well to the fine decal membrane.

Thanks man.

[PRR]

I think you should water-slide and seal a soap-dish or candy-tin before you go back to that pedal. Little scraps so you are not sacrificing a whole costly sheet for every lesson.

I *suspect* the "bubbles" would have evaporated-out if you set it in a warm place a few days. At least that's what I get with wall-paper; I've learned to let it rest before going back to pick flaws.

Does sound like your sealer loves to eat your water-slide. Again a scrap and a spritz on a soap-dish would test the chemistry quicker/cheaper.

[bluebunny]

If it helps, here's the combination I use all the time: laser waterslide from Crafty, paint and clear coat from Halfords.

[steveyraff]

If it helps, here's the combination I use all the time: laser waterslide from Crafty, paint and clear coat from Halfords.

Hey thanks guys,

Bluebunny - what kind of clear coat specifically do you buy in Halfords. I have a Halford's in town here, never even thought about going there.

I ordered Krylon Acrylic coat spray online as I seen many people on this board use it with great results - but then they emailed me to say the total was going to be over £30 for postage and I cancelled and refunded. Thats just ridiculous.

Is the clear coat you use from Halfords an acrylic? I really don't want to make the same mistake twice. It it non yellowing?

Thank you!

[bluebunny]

I use the Halfords brand clear-coat.  It's on the same racks as the Halfords brand paints.  I think it's acrylic.  You can probably check online.

Edit: The clear coat is "acrylic based" (as is the paint).

[bluebunny]

BTW, I've not noticed any of my pedals go yellow.  Some are up to three years old and they enjoy whatever daylight (i.e. UV) comes through my office window.

[steveyraff]

I use the Halfords brand clear-coat.  It's on the same racks as the Halfords brand paints.  I think it's acrylic.  You can probably check online.

Edit: The clear coat is "acrylic based" (as is the paint).

I use the Halfords brand clear-coat.  It's on the same racks as the Halfords brand paints.  I think it's acrylic.  You can probably check online.

Edit: The clear coat is "acrylic based".

Thank very much man. I went on the website and seen that one. It got bad reviews, but I guess these people are referring to its use on car body parts. They have another one that seems basically the same called Halfords Universal Clear Lacquer that got better reviews. Maybe I'll try it. Hope I've better luck this time!

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_206575_langId_-1_categoryId_165495

[steveyraff]

This Acrylic spray definitely seems a lot better.

I sealed the waterslide decal with a layer of it before applying. Then when it dried, I soaked the decal and applied it to the enclosure.

I pushed out the bubbles, followed all the usual guide instructions.

When I came back to check on how it was drying, there was a little bit of the same problem. Some wrinkling around the holes, and some blistering - but not as bad.

Like the polyurethane, when I then gave the whole enclosure with applied decal its first overall coat, the decal instantly wrinkled up and blistered some more.

I read on only one guide, that it may sometimes do this and that it should be left to dry as the decal will shrink back to itself and iron out all those blisters and wrinkles during the drying process.

At the minute, I feel a bit out of ideas, and quite frustrated. I've done everything any of the many guides I've said requires. I can only hope that when I check on it tomorrow it has miraculously ironed itself out while it dried out. I'm not very positive about that outcome though!

I'm reverting back to a glass of wine again for now...  

EDIT: Just checked on it. I GIVE UP! I've literally followed every guide on this site, youtube, others etc. This one appears to be screwed now aswell. The writing is all messed up from the wrinkling and I can't see it every straightening back out. It looks horrible.

[Jdansti]

You're not alone. I think the people who make it work are supernatural!  This is why I print my graphics onto photo paper and glue the photo to the box. From there I either spray on about 8 thin coats of clear varnish or use Envirotex pour on epoxy.

[steveyraff]

You're not alone. I think the people who make it work are supernatural!  This is why I print my graphics onto photo paper and glue the photo to the box. From there I either spray on about 8 thin coats of clear varnish or use Envirotex pour on epoxy.

I just cant understand it John. I have tried many new things in my life - but this is the first time I've followed something so carefully and it still repetitively fails. I mean, I've watched step by step video guides of the exact process I am doing with the exact materials, yet mine is doing something the video I can see with my own eyes is not doing. It just doesn't make sense. So, so irritating.

[bluebunny]

I sealed the waterslide decal with a layer of it before applying.

You're spraying the decal *before* applying it?  I do mine naked.  (The decal, not me!)  Only when the decal is applied and dry (I'm usually patient and wait a day) do I apply the clear-coat (multiple thin coats, btw).

[steveyraff]

I sealed the waterslide decal with a layer of it before applying.

You're spraying the decal *before* applying it?  I do mine naked.  (The decal, not me!)  Only when the decal is applied and dry (I'm usually patient and wait a day) do I apply the clear-coat (multiple thin coats, btw).

You must be using a Laserjet printer? Inkjet decal paper is not sealed. If you print on it, then put the decal paper into water, the image will run off immediately. Funny thing is, when I spray the decal paper before putting it into water, there is no reaction like the pictures show. It dries perfectly smooth and looks great. Its only when the decal is applied to the surface of the enclosure and then starts to dry out that it begins to wrinkle up all over.

Could there be a reaction between the paper and the enclosure surface? I buy my aluminium enclosures pre-painted white. It's all I can think of.

Does anyone coat the enclosure surface with a layer of lacquer before applying decals on to it? Just a thought. I have no idea what to do anymore.