How to make the time between each delay longer in pt2399 delay?

[nguitar12]

What I am asking is the time between each delay. Not the repeat time.
I heard someone say putting two pt2399 in series will extend the delay time.
I am not sure whether (the delay time) mean (the time between each delay) or (the total repeat time).

Can someone please help verify it?

[mth5044]

Repeats/Feedback control the number of repeats heard, the delay control off pin 6 controls the time between delay sounds.

You can cascade PT2399's to increase the the delay time. You are basically delaying the delay each time you add a new chip until you send it to the output to be heard.

[slacker]

Not sure I understand, what do you mean by repeat time?

[Ice-9]

If I am correct and I think you are asking about making the initial delay time longer using 2 PT2933 chips then yes you can.
By feeding the output of the 1st PT into the input of the second PT then you can double the initial delay to about 1 second.
You could then feed the signal from the second PT back into the first PT for the feedback or repeats control. You could even have two feedback loops which would produce some different repeat timings.

[deadastronaut]

i am currently still working on this very thing.....again ......using 4 pt2399's...

you won't be able to do it with one 2399 ..

with 4 delays in series ( current  mirrored ) plus tapping off each delays output seperately

you can get different 'timing jumps'  ...

the more delays you have the more jump options, but they are all derived from one  long delay.....

which get shorter with each 'timing jump'

e.g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFIXWbCWFIg

which ended up as this..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7PK-rRSYzg&list=PL6E5UJVYbhpACMJUfXtC0F6WabNQGO0Vr

which now has 4 levels for each ''timing jump''  

coming soon...

[nguitar12]

Repeats/Feedback control the number of repeats heard, the delay control off pin 6 controls the time between delay sounds.

You can cascade PT2399's to increase the the delay time. You are basically delaying the delay each time you add a new chip until you send it to the output to be heard.

I am very confused here. From what I understand pt2399 in series should cut the delay time in half as the delay of two chip will fill the "gap" of each other. I never heard the long delay in the demo clip of the multiple pt2399 bulid. Usually the repeat sound very crowded. Is it just because they forget to show the longest delay setting?

[nguitar12]

i am currently still working on this very thing.....again ......using 4 pt2399's...

you won't be able to do it with one 2399 ..

with 4 delays in series ( current  mirrored ) plus tapping off each delays output seperately

you can get different 'timing jumps'  ...

the more delays you have the more jump options, but they are all derived from one  long delay.....

which get shorter with each 'timing jump'

Can you show the longest delay setting? I don't see any different in the delay time between your build and standard deep blue delay.

e.g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFIXWbCWFIg

which ended up as this..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7PK-rRSYzg&list=PL6E5UJVYbhpACMJUfXtC0F6WabNQGO0Vr

which now has 4 levels for each ''timing jump''  

coming soon...

[deadastronaut]

Can you show the longest delay setting? I don't see any different in the delay time between your build and standard deep blue delay.

really...i'l just build one of those then..

as you make the delay time longer the repeated sound will degenerate and become lo fi.....whether its 1 pt2399 or 4/5/6/7....
the pt2399 is just designed that way, frankly its well overdue an update, but its a lot of fun to mess with ,  anyway..when you have 4 you do indeed
get a longer delay, and when using the shorter (deep blue delay max time equivalent ) with 4, the repeats will be a lot cleaner than the deep blue delay could ever be.......
@1:36. longest times..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He98Uzb4C7s&list=PL6E5UJVYbhpAkdWbi0hSacGDBc7fUJmXt

now the deep blue delay at max time...@2:22
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOKJNrcGYJs

[nguitar12]

I see that now. But obviously your longest delay setting should be at 2:04 not 1:36.
btw. I think the delay time in 1:36 is long enough to me. Can it be achieved by 2 x pt2399?

Still I don't understand why pt2399 in series will make the delay longer. The delay of two chip will fill the "gap" of each other and should cut the delay time in half isn't it?


PT2399A ---------------->  Repeat 1A  ----------------->   Repeat 2A  ------------------>   Repeat 3A ....etc
               └   PT2399B ---------------->  Repeat 1B  ----------------->   Repeat 2B  ------------------>   Repeat 3B ....etc

Resulted in:

PT2399A ---------------->  Repeat 1A  -- Repeat 1B -->   Repeat 2A  ---Repeat 2B---->   Repeat 3A  -- Repeat 3B ....etc
             (PT2399B) ┘

I hope you can understand what I mean by the above diagrame......

[samhay]

^Still I don't understand why pt2399 in series will make the delay longer. The delay of two chip will fill the "gap" of each other and should cut the delay time in half isn't it?

You are assuming that the output of each PT2399 is fed to the output mixer. This is a bad assumption, and if you only feed the output from the 1st PT2399 into the 2nd PT2399:

in -> PT2399 -> PT2399 -> out

then you will get twice the maximum delay length (and twice the minimum).

Further, your diagram would not lead to the repeats filling in the gaps. If the 2 PT2399 have the same delay, then you will simply have the 1st repeat from the 2nd PT299 sitting on top of the 2nd repeat from the 1st PT2399, etc.

[nguitar12]

You are assuming that the output of each PT2399 is fed to the output mixer. This is a bad assumption, and if you only feed the output from the 1st PT2399 into the 2nd PT2399:

in -> PT2399 -> PT2399 -> out

then you will get twice the maximum delay length (and twice the minimum).

OK I started to understand what you mean. But the shortest delay will also doubled by twice right?

Is there any two PT2399 schematic out there so that I can do some experience?

[samhay]

^But the shortest delay will also doubled by twice right?

Yes, but with some output switching (of the PT2399s) you can get around this.

^Is there any two PT2399 schematic out there so that I can do some experience?

Perhaps this would be a good place to start: http://www.madbeanpedals.com/projects/ZeroPoint/ZeroPointDD.pdf

[nguitar12]

^But the shortest delay will also doubled by twice right?

Yes, but with some output switching (of the PT2399s) you can get around this.

^Is there any two PT2399 schematic out there so that I can do some experience?

Perhaps this would be a good place to start: http://www.madbeanpedals.com/projects/ZeroPoint/ZeroPointDD.pdf

Thanks. This is exactly what I am looking for. Is this schematic + layout verified yet?

[deadastronaut]

Yes...all madbean stuff is verified, cool projects on there by brian. 

[Fp-www.Tonepad.com]

That dual 2399 is a nice one, I guess any amount of PT2399 could be cascaded, it used to be a feat to have a single one.

[deadastronaut]

^ yep, ive had 5 pt2399's going on breadboards....nice.

[Fp-www.Tonepad.com]

How 'bout cascading your 4xpt2399 circuit?....
If we think of them as modules it'd be doable to have as many as wanted (power supply would be odd, because of the extreme differences in current draw between min/max delay times).
Almost like a 'delay module mixer' kind of deal where clever switching would series/parallel the modules. A few blend controls and you could end up with a mess of repeats.

[slackshampoo]

Anyone have the schematic to the madbean zore point? Tried google and all the links i've found are dead 

[TGP39]

http://www.madbeanpedals.com/projects/archives/Delay/ZeroPoint.zip

[Mark Hammer]

How 'bout cascading your 4xpt2399 circuit?....
If we think of them as modules it'd be doable to have as many as wanted (power supply would be odd, because of the extreme differences in current draw between min/max delay times).
Almost like a 'delay module mixer' kind of deal where clever switching would series/parallel the modules. A few blend controls and you could end up with a mess of repeats.

For experimental purposes, I put together a dual "Cave Dweller" (Madbean) to use with a modular synth I've been gradually assembling.  It is configurable as two delays in parallel, mixed down to mono, OR two delays in series.  The "killer app" is that the feedback path can be cross-fed such that the feedback signal can be fed to the delay it came from or to the other delay.  Other things to get to first, but I'm looking forward to firing it up.

As an aside, I'm also pondering adding taps to the Rebote 3 I made.