Wave soldering using a solder pot

[gtudoran]

Kipper4 - i really meant that i really do think this is one of the most civilized forums. What about Blackie far from me the thought of being offensive in any way, and i really dig the poster ... all gold if you know what i mean

Only members are allowed in this forum as far as i can remember, but a disclaimer was posted in the original topic. And totally agree with the fact that for some of us, those methods are not suited.

So just to be 100% sure that i've made my self clear I didn't find any post offensive in any nature and if somehow something like that was understand from my previous posts then i can assure you that was not the case.
Ohh shite ... now i see what happened: i've posted my last post after Blackie but was meant to be above it (he was writing in the same time) - so yap that was the ... problem.

Regards,
DeX

[stallik]

last weekend, I settled down at my workbench with a nice cup of tea, a small pcb & few components. I use an illuminated magnifier cos I'm going blind and was too close to the work to notice the soldering iron cable wrap around my cup. The tea ran off the bench, onto my chair and was guided by my thighs to an area that I wish it hadn't reached.
I don't consider myself a klutz but like anyone,  can be damn clumsy. The pain was ... uncomfortable. Had my grandson (a regular visitor) been sitting there, my pain would have been intolerable.

[gtudoran]

@stallik with the risk of being a smart ass there is a rule in my shop and should be a rule in any shop: NO eating /drinking / smoking when working, never ever (various reasons) - wanna do that ...take a brake go outside, stretch you bones, see the sun and go back to work (don't forget to wash the hands before you eat drink or smoke as you don't know what is on a shop table - from dust to chemicals).

Regards,
DeX

[karbomusic]

Devil's advocate - I got my first chemistry set when I was 8 and in the 60s there were no real limits on what could be in that set and dad said "don't blow yourself up". I got my first 15,000 volt neon transformer when I was 12 with a similar warning and got A+ on all my science projects until I was 18 without blowing myself or my class up - that has continued throughout the decades and I'm 52 now with an amazingly small number of scars and the scars I do have taught me lessons learnable by no other means. We even had lawn darts back then if any one remembers those which were basically accidental suicide kits for ages 8 and up. I used to call them Darwin Darts.

I enter this thread without watching the video and based on the comments, expect there must be some vat of molten solder someone can fall into only to find a 2 inch diameter tray with molten solder in it. Don't get me wrong, please give all the necessary disclaimers of danger etc. I have no problem with any of that but most of us, who know anything, would know absolutely nothing without being exposed to such dangers; not having any info out there is likely to cause someone to go 'aha' and just make the mistakes minus any guidance whatsoever. I'm not sure shielding the information is going to actually protect someone (whose naivety is of such high level) from themselves anyway. YMMV.

Don't flame me because it's not a disagreement but an observation... it's just I was taken back by what I saw after reading what I read. Had someone sheltered me this way growing up, I'd be missing out on most of what makes me a valuable contributor to society now.

[stallik]

@gtudoran, @ karbomusic
Not disagreeing with your eat/ drink ethic but I don't have a shop. It's my home and I do a tiny amount of work on pedals just for the enjoyment. I really like my tea and when I'm into something, I don't stop for anything. If I imbibe something bad, tough! I've only myself to blame.
I too was allowed to 'be careful' when playing with things that are now considered too dangerous. I recall boiling mercury in school chemistry class to create ( if I recall correctly) mercuric oxide as part of the curriculum. I've indulged for many years in extreme sports which has left me damaged but would do it all again because... well, just because.

So, I act like a careless idiot. The point I was trying to make is that what I might accept as a reasonable activity for myself takes on a whole different light should anyone else enter my arena.

[karbomusic]

Not disagreeing with your eat/ drink ethic but I don't have a shop. It's my home and I do a tiny amount of work on pedals just for the enjoyment.

The only rule I have is no Styrofoam cups on the same side of the table as my soldering iron. More seriously, I don't want to take away from the safety aspect but had I not been exposed to the things I was exposed to, along with the risk of maiming myself, I'd have missed on about 80% of what makes me, me today. I tried and learned from many very dangerous activities but even in my ignorance I was extremely careful as evidenced by my being alive and sitting here typing this right now. Point being, those activities taught me things that keep me safe in as many other ways simply from having those experiences. Thusly, I am a bit on the fence as to how I/we decide who does/doesn't have the right to take those same chances provided the proper warnings are in place.

[R.G.]

More seriously, I don't want to take away from the safety aspect but had I not been exposed to the things I was exposed to, along with the risk of maiming myself, I'd have missed on about 80% of what makes me, me today. I tried and learned from many very dangerous activities but even in my ignorance I was extremely careful as evidenced by my being alive and sitting here typing this right now. Point being, those activities taught me things that keep me safe in as many other ways simply from having those experiences.

There are many places in my life that by all rights I should have been dead or maimed. Yes, those are teaching moments. I value them highly. But I would by far rather someone have pointed out to me that it could have hurt me a lot before I had to find out on my own. I feel that it's my responsibility to tell people about things that may not be obvious but could damage them a lot. After that, it's **their** responsibility to do or not do them.

Thusly, I am a bit on the fence as to how I/we decide who does/doesn't have the right to take those same chances provided the proper warnings are in place.

And this is kind of the right approach except that there is no fence. Tell them the dangers make sure they know what they're getting into, keep them from making obviously stupid, deadly mistakes, then let them decide once they have been informed. We do not and never will have the right to keep people from taking the same chances we may have done. They have to make their own mistakes. But not telling them the possible consequences is morally wrong.

[stallik]

And this is kind of the right approach except that there is no fence. Tell them the dangers make sure they know what they're getting into, keep them from making obviously stupid, deadly mistakes, then let them decide once they have been informed. We do not and never will have the right to keep people from taking the same chances we may have done. They have to make their own mistakes. But not telling them the possible consequences is morally wrong.

Well put RG

[karbomusic]

As I said earlier, I certainly don't disagree with ^that. I was tempted to say it should be tempered realistically as in not over dramatizing it in 'scared straight' fashion (it might backfire) but at the same time there is value to the fact that the 'one with a real knack for it' will see through that and succeed while those who need to stay away probably give up the idea. Hopefully anyway. Good discussion either way.

[blackieNYC]

Sometimes, rarely, I do that thing where you put the handle of the soldering iron in a clamp and tin (a lot of) wires with it.  The careless danger actually puts me on point, hyper-aware, adrenaline pumping, screaming warnings to anyone who comes within 20 feet. No accidents so far.

a paradox, maybe.
I wish all the stupid things I do would make me smarter. But then many do, don't they?  Unless one keeps doing them.

[Jdansti]

I agree with all of the safety issues and warnings, and I'm intrigued by this technique. I worked the first 10 years of my career in an environmental lab. One of my responsibilities was digesting water and soil samples in beakers of boiling concentrated nitric acid. I'd have 50 beakers at a time cooking on hot plates under a fume hood. This operation was made relatively safe through training, engineering controls, administrative controls, personal protective equipment (PPE), and safe work practices. All of the safety suggestions mentioned above fall under one of these categories. In my opinion this operation could be made much safer by implementing these controls.  Bolt the pot down and place a clear bench shield between yourself and the pot-engineering controls, use proper PPE (face shield AND goggles (glasses aren't good enough), aluminized leather apron, leather gloves with long gauntlets, leather shoes (lace up or boots-no exposed foot skin)), use safe work practices such as using tongs to hold the board (you'd need a way to positively hold the board so it doesn't drop and splash), don't eat/drink/smoke/have sex in the lab-administrative controls. This list isn't all inclusive-I'm sure there are other controls that would need to be used.

It should be remembered that even with all of these safety controls in place, the operator needs to be constantly vigilant about each and every action he takes. Every move has to be deliberate and carefully executed. As R.G. said, I cringed as the OP held the board by a capacitor in his bare fingers and dipped the board into the pot.

Good luck to you!  We want you to continue your participation on the forum, so PLEASE be safe!

Edit: I've read that dross contains powdered lead particles that can easily become airborne, so it is recommended that dross be placed in a container with a lid.

[CodeMonk]

I agree with all of the safety issues and warnings, and I'm intrigued by this technique. I worked the first 10 years of my career in an environmental lab. One of my responsibilities was digesting water and soil samples in beakers of boiling concentrated nitric acid. I'd have 50 beakers at a time cooking on hot plates under a fume hood. This operation was made relatively safe through training, engineering controls, administrative controls, personal protective equipment (PPE), and safe work practices. All of the safety suggestions mentioned above fall under one of these categories. In my opinion this operation could be made much safer by implementing these controls.  Bolt the pot down and place a clear bench shield between yourself and the pot-engineering controls, use proper PPE (face shield AND goggles (glasses aren't good enough), aluminized leather apron, leather gloves with long gauntlets, leather shoes (lace up or boots-no exposed foot skin)), use safe work practices such as using tongs to hold the board (you'd need a way to positively hold the board so it doesn't drop and splash), don't eat/drink/smoke/have sex in the lab-administrative controls. This list isn't all inclusive-I'm sure there are other controls that would need to be used.

It should be remembered that even with all of these safety controls in place, the operator needs to be constantly vigilant about each and every action he takes. Every move has to be deliberate and carefully executed. As R.G. said, I cringed as the OP held the board by a capacitor in his bare fingers and dipped the board into the pot.

Good luck to you!  We want you to continue your participation on the forum, so PLEASE be safe!

Edit: I've read that dross contains powdered lead particles that can easily become airborne, so it is recommended that dross be placed in a container with a lid.

Possibly, but minimal I think. But it wouldn't take much to @#$% you up for life.
Now it make me wonder, how much of that shit I may have inhaled over the years.
But my rooms always hand VERY good ventilation.

I used to pull about 5 lbs of dross out of one machine a day (not really that much when you consider the weight of it).
I just dumped it in a 5 gallon metal bucket.
After that it was someone else' problem.
I dunno what was done with it, but every six months I would empty the machine and take that to a metal scrapyard.
I imagine the dross went elsewhere, but who knows? The EPA and OSHA wasn't as strict back in the early - mid 80's as they are now.