subcaster 6111

[LightSoundGeometry]

well the pentaboost will not work and I cant get the subcaster to work either ..feel though I have it hooked up properly , I cant find the error. some fresh eyes, insight and help is much appreciated.

learned as much as I can so far about teh 6111 dual triode and am using Dano's schematic ..maybe I have all bad tubes ?

the 6.3 for the heater

[Scruffie]

On the power buses, do you get continuity between row 30 and 35?

[thermionix]

What's it doing or not doing?  What are your plate and cathode voltages?

[LightSoundGeometry]

On the power buses, do you get continuity between row 30 and 35?

yes i do, my BB doesnt need the jumpers for the buss runs . I double checked anyways just now and got continuity

[LightSoundGeometry]

What's it doing or not doing?  What are your plate and cathode voltages?

it is doing nothing, ...even when I have teh 6.3 volts on pin 3 like supposed to be, I might of had a BB eror there I had seen.

pin 1 and 8 say 2p and Ip

1 = 4.46
2 = 0
3 = 250 mv
4 = 0
5 = 0
6= 4.5mv
7 = 0
8 = 4.52v

bench power supply is shorted red again as well on 5 volts when turned on

I have already hooked it up a bunch of efferent ways and nothing .. I have like 75 bucks worth of parts/tubes they all cant be bad can they ? wouldnt I be able to put volts on the heater and see teh tube light up ?

maybe I try this?
http://amps.zugster.net/tools/triode-calculator

not much on google that helps me in any way right now because I am still new to tubes
https://www.google.com/search?q=vacuum+tube+6111+pinout&biw=1360&bih=614&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiV9vaasJHMAhXDkoMKHepbChkQ_AUIBSgA&dpr=1#q=vacuum+tube+6111

[LightSoundGeometry]

so which amp would I be looking at that is similar to the BJT and FEt biasing eg common source amp or a common emitter..am i going to want to study common cathode? or there other types of tube amps and their pros and cons or benefits over each other ?




the final BB layout which I feel is correct, nothing, dead, bench power supply shirted red until i take off the lm317 from the heater:

[tonyharker]

What bench supply are you using.  The 6111 needs some 300mA for the heater supply.  Just apply 6v to the heater pins 6 & 3.  The 6111 should glow. If you are able you can monitor the heater current using the current sockets on your multimeter.  Let us know what happens.

[bluebunny]

You might want to tear it down and build it back up bit by bit.  I don't think for a second that you've been unlucky enough to buy a whole pile of crapped tubes.

You've demonstrated that you're getting 6.3V from the regulator.  Feed this to pin 3 and ground pin 6.  With 6V, you should see something of a glow on that filament, if not feel it.  You could also afford - with all that breadboard real estate - to splay the tube's legs two rows apart each.  This would also help avoid any shorts from those long, naked leads.

When that checks out, look at connecting up the input half of the tube: so R3 to 12V, C3 and R4 at the input, and the gain control.  You should now be able to trace your input signal at the plate using an audio probe.

BTW, I'm assuming you're counting the tube pins correctly.  The datasheet can be confusing, since it gives the view from below, but it's essentially the same as an 8-pin DIL: 1-8 counterclockwise.  And the pins are spaced equally except for a big gap between 1 and 8 (like an IC "divot").

Edit: Tony posted while I was ruminating.  Check that too.

[LightSoundGeometry]

You might want to tear it down and build it back up bit by bit.  I don't think for a second that you've been unlucky enough to buy a whole pile of crapped tubes.

You've demonstrated that you're getting 6.3V from the regulator.  Feed this to pin 3 and ground pin 6.  With 6V, you should see something of a glow on that filament, if not feel it.  You could also afford - with all that breadboard real estate - to splay the tube's legs two rows apart each.  This would also help avoid any shorts from those long, naked leads.

When that checks out, look at connecting up the input half of the tube: so R3 to 12V, C3 and R4 at the input, and the gain control.  You should now be able to trace your input signal at the plate using an audio probe.

BTW, I'm assuming you're counting the tube pins correctly.  The datasheet can be confusing, since it gives the view from below, but it's essentially the same as an 8-pin DIL: 1-8 counterclockwise.  And the pins are spaced equally except for a big gap between 1 and 8 (like an IC "divot").

Edit: Tony posted while I was ruminating.  Check that too.

`

I dont own any types of probes, i cant afford any equipment ..I am on a tight budget!

I took my time identifying the pins and feel as if its on the BB same as a IC 1-8 would be like you suggested. You can see the gap/space betwwn pin 1 and 8 and looking at it like the picture pin 1 is to my left, flipped right side up would put the tube just like an IC CCW

first I will tear down, and put 6.3 volts on the tube and see of it glows. Is a Probe somethign I can make at home with my stompbox parts? I wish I had a logic probe like we use at school as well for learning my logic gates..those are 30 bucks as well..electronics is very expensive hobby..I might be too poor to properly enjoy the hobby ...all my money goes to utilities, food and gas.

my power supply, not sure how it feeds current to a device if at all ? It's crazy, as much as I am learning in school, there is that much more I am not even being exposed to ..for example, regulators, tubes, board etching ect. I know you can watch youtube videos but I am paying a real college real money to teach me things; I learn from watching or being mentored. as far as learning everything on my own, I am not that smart and admit it. My reading comprehension is bad. I do the best I can with what I was given though. They say the brain is a muscle and can be exercised into shape, so I never quit or give up. knowledge truly is power; and a good feeling to have, very inspiring for confidence in all aspects of life.

BK Precision DC Power Supply 1610A




I will post back with pictures after i do what you guys have told me to do. back to basics, I need to do some more research into the pins and whats going on inside ..I can identify the heater and the grid ..I am still lost on the cathode/anode part but i am googling tube circuit symbols right now.

[bluebunny]

An audio probe is a cap and a jack plug. There's a simple schematic at Geofex.

Sent from my E2303 using Tapatalk

[bluebunny]

Sounds like you have the tube pins counting correctly too.

One step at a time: we'll get you there!

Sent from my E2303 using Tapatalk

[Jdansti]

my power supply, not sure how it feeds current to a device if at all ? It's crazy, as much as I am learning in school, there is that much more I am not even being exposed to ..for example, regulators, tubes, board etching ect. I know you can watch youtube videos but I am paying a real college real money to teach me things; I learn from watching or being mentored. as far as learning everything on my own, I am not that smart and admit it. My reading comprehension is bad. I do the best I can with what I was given though. They say the brain is a muscle and can be exercised into shape, so I never quit or give up. knowledge truly is power; and a good feeling to have, very inspiring for confidence in all aspects of life.

If you need a manual for your PS, you can find it here: http://exodus.poly.edu/~kurt/manuals/manuals/Other/BK%20PRECISION%201610%20&%201630%20Instrution.pdf

Regarding your brain, don't under estimate your abilities or your potential. The fact that you're building electronic devices and can discuss electronics with people from around the world on this forum speaks volumes about you. There are people out there who can barely replace a light bulb!

[idiot savant]

it is doing nothing, ...even when I have teh 6.3 volts on pin 3 like supposed to be, I might of had a BB eror there I had seen.

pin 1 and 8 say 2p and Ip

1 = 4.46
2 = 0
3 = 250 mv
4 = 0
5 = 0
6= 4.5mv
7 = 0
8 = 4.52v

bench power supply is shorted red again as well on 5 volts when turned on

These numbers are pretty suspect. You say you are getting 6.3v to the filament, but that doesn't jive with the voltage readings posted here.

Are you hitting current limiting on your bench supply?

here's a test:

-disconnect anything from your bench supply.

-turn it on and set it to 12V

-turn it off.

-get a 39R 10watt resistor. connect it across your bench supply. this will simulate a current draw of about 300ma @ 12v.

-turn it on.

-if your voltage is anything less than 12V at the positive lead then your current knob is set too low.

- in the low current range crank the knob up all the way.

-readjust voltage for 12v output.

-profit???


Basically, if you draw too much current relative to your set output your bench supply will hard limit its current output to whatever you set it to with the knob. The voltage will sag as low as it can to make your chosen current happen.

[LightSoundGeometry]

looks like I have some reading and testing to do, I think tonight I will have a few free hours to conduct the tests everyone has suggested. Will post results and pics hopefully tonight! its a beautiful spring day out here , enjoy the weather! 

[LightSoundGeometry]

just hooking it up this way caused the regulator to smoke and look like it caught on fire :






IS, I am not going to order a 10 watt resistor ..I am going to give in that I have no idea what I am doing..the smoke from the breadboard scared me a little but all I can say is the tube didnt glow and my bench supply probably is not working right either.

[LightSoundGeometry]

well , I think I should give the pentode another go, might be easier to learn on with less parts

I may be understanding this PS better, looks like its drawing  .5 amps? the regulator still works despite smoking like a bonfire earlier. There is 1.229 vdv on the F+ G3 which from what i can tell, with what I have learned so far, is the filament and one of the 3 grid plates inside. . pin five , labeled F- coming off the symbol ^ and junctioned with pin 3, labeled F+, is grounded to my common buss rail on BB.

[frequencycentral]

LM317, a trimmer, some caps and resistors is a rather elaborate way to achieve 6.3V, when 6V from a 7806 and a 100uF will do just as well. 6V is within tolerance for a 6111, trust me I've lit up plenty of them. Cuts down the parts count, and is more elegant a solution.

Also, 6111 are hardly little @#$%ers, you are unlikely to have harmed one on breadboard, even the standard ones are basically milspec, and will even tolerate 12V to the heater for a short time.

[LightSoundGeometry]

LM317, a trimmer, some caps and resistors is a rather elaborate way to achieve 6.3V, when 6V from a 7806 and a 100uF will do just as well. 6V is within tolerance for a 6111, trust me I've lit up plenty of them. Cuts down the parts count, and is more elegant a solution.

Also, 6111 are hardly little @#$%ers, you are unlikely to have harmed one on breadboard, even the standard ones are basically milspec, and will even tolerate 12V to the heater for a short time.

Hey Rick! I am back on the pentode boost because its looks easier to learn on. Thought I would learn this one first  

P1- 7.9 v
G2 - 9.44 v
F+,G3 - 1.22v
G1 - 6.1mv
F- - 9.0mv

I haven't tested yet, but the voltages sure look a hell of a lot better! going to eat before I fire her up with amp & geetar.



getting ready to make an audio probe, guess I will do the male ended one as I see there are both kinds.

FC, awesome advice as well, other ways to skin a cat, I could of used a better regulator with less parts to get there..the current is throwing me off now with the power supply etc , so I am going to learn tubes on the pentode then try the triodes later on.

my end goal is the sub mini tube amp , so I can house it in my old 50's realtone antique radio and have a cool little desk amp with vintage radio look


* I just watched Paul from Chrome Sphere probe a pedal with his guitar, so i guess its all about how you want to hook up the guitar, with either a male or female end..looks like the jack version is easier to make and you can leave your guitar plugged in and just plug into probe jack .


step one of my probe

[frequencycentral]

Use the LM317 for 1.25v like this:

9V (or 12V) to Vin,
adjust pin to ground,
1.25V will be at Vout once it sees a load.

No other doodads needed. No trimmer, no resistors, no capacitors. Simples.

[LightSoundGeometry]

Use the LM317 for 1.25v like this:

9V (or 12V) to Vin,
adjust pin to ground,
1.25V will be at Vout once it sees a load.

No other doodads needed. No trimmer, no resistors, no capacitors. Simples.

it did! i was just following your schematic and didnt comprehend what it said until just now. you only have to build circuit around it if its not spitting out proper volts or want something other than 1.25