Cloning the fuzz circuit from a Dan-O-Wah

[BassClarinet]

Hi, all. I'm new to this forum. I'm a bass clarinet player who uses a piezo based system and effects pedals for electro acoustic playing. I asked this question on a different forum and was directed here. I'm hoping you guys can get me started in the right direction.

I've been on a bit of a wah quest for a few months, but I've recently purchased an Ibanez Weeping Demon that I'm quite happy with and I'm willing to call my quest compete (for now). But, for a while I was using a Danelectro Dan-O-Wah, which sounded really good despite being made of plastic and looking like a truck.

I prefer the Ibanez wah, but the Danelectro had this really over the top fuzz built in that I'd like to keep on my board. My goal here is to copy just the fuzz part of the Danelectro wah into a very simple tiny pedal (ideally a 1590LB, but a 1590A or something else small would work too). The original has no knobs or controls of any kind aside from an on off button and I'm aiming for that kind of simplicity too, I've got a Swollen Pickle if I want versatility.

I'm fairly handy with a soldering iron, but I've never done a pedal or cloned a circuit before so I'm looking for some help.
I've found one source online saying that the fuzz/octave part of the wah is a clone of the Foxx Tone Machine. This would make some sense because Danelectro has a stand alone copy of that pedal, so it wouldn't be hard for them to add it to this pedal. Can anyone confirm or deny this?
There are some pictures of the inside of the pedal here http://imgur.com/a/0Twvw, I'm fairly certain the fuzz/ octave stuff is the top circuit board. The fuzz is activated by a button on the top of the pedal (on the right side from the perspective of these pictures) and the octave is activated by the lowest button on either of the banks running down the side. Any ideas on how to parse out what does what?
In general, how do I get started on this?

[smallbearelec]

I was using a Danelectro Dan-O-Wah, which sounded really good despite being made of plastic and looking like a truck.
I prefer the Ibanez wah, but the Danelectro had this really over the top fuzz built in that I'd like to keep on my board..
I've found one source online saying that the fuzz/octave part of the wah is a clone of the Foxx Tone Machine.

The Effects Database
http://www.effectsdatabase.com/model/danelectro/mini/frenchtoast#pictures

describes the French Toast as a clone of the FTM. There's a DIY kit here:
http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/effects-projects/octave/foxx-tone-machine/

that you might want to look into.

[BassClarinet]

I've considered the FTM kit route, and I might end up going that direction ultimately, but if it's possible I would really like to build something simpler and smaller. I don't want the octave effect, and if I can match the tone of the Dan-O-Wah (which has no adjustment) then I don't need any pots to adjust it.

If what I'm thinking of is going to be way too difficult then I'll drop it, but I'd really like to duplicate the simple, fuzz only, non-adjustable circuit.

[Blitz Krieg]

why?

[whoisalhedges]

Looks like the ocatve circuit of a FTM is just a diode, a capacitor, and a resistor - that's all the octave switch adds to the circuit. Leave those off (and the switch that puts them in circuit), and it's just a fuzz.

Do you need a tone control, or do you generally leave it in one place (hell, does the Dan-O-Wah even have a tone control on its fuzz)? I've got some ideas that would fit in half an Altoids tin.

[BassClarinet]

Do you need a tone control, or do you generally leave it in one place (hell, does the Dan-O-Wah even have a tone control on its fuzz)? I've got some ideas that would fit in half an Altoids tin.

No, the Dan-O-Wah doesn't have a tone control. I have a Swollen Pickle that I use for versatility, the Dan-O-Wah just has a super over the top fuzz that's kind of fun. I would really rather not put a great big pedal on my board for what amounts to a special effect.

My hope is that by removing the octave, and all of the controls, I can reduce the circuit into something small (like your half an Altoids tin). But, I don't really have the skill-set on my own to either work backwards from the Tone Machine diagrams on the internet to make the design, or to reverse engineer the board sitting in front of me. That's why I'm asking for guidance from all of you who know more that I do.

[BassClarinet]

why?

Because it's something that I've had on my board and made use of. I don't use it enough to dedicate the sort of space needed to keep the Dan-O-Wah, or maybe even a full sized Tone Machine clone. But, if it can be reduced in size, I would like to keep access to that sound.

[whoisalhedges]

I probably don't know that much more than you, but I've had success trimming the fat in circuits.

I'll post something after work.

[whoisalhedges]

Maybe try something like this?



I tossed a pair of Big Muff-lite clipping diodes on Q2 to maybe save on a gain stage. Left in both tone filters but ditched the tone (decent bass & treble, scooped mids fixed) and sustain (it's full up, of course) pots. Just one lone volume control. If it doesn't have enough gain to appropriately drive the clipping diodes (might be the case), pop in a 10uf capacitor to ground bypassing Q2's emitter resistor.

This should sound pretty much like what you're after.

[BassClarinet]

Awesome. Thank you so much for your help, I really appreciate it.

Edit: As I study your diagram, I'm not seeing the volume control that you mention. I don't need it, and I know enough to add that in if I want it, but am I missing something that should be obvious here?

[roseblood11]

R15...

[BassClarinet]

R15...

Right, I'm just an idiot. Thanks.

[duck_arse]

can I ask, what's R1 doing? can I tell, there's a junction dot missing R9//R10//Q3 base?

(also, don't wire J2 like that. also, R16?)

[whoisalhedges]

can I ask, what's R1 doing? can I tell, there's a junction dot missing R9//R10//Q3 base?

(also, don't wire J2 like that. also, R16?)

Yeah, it was thrown together in like 10 min... R1 and R16 are pulldown resistors and should not be soldered straight to the jacks, they'll do no good there. They should instead be the first and last things after & before the tip connections.

And yes, that's absolutely supposed to be a junction. That part isn't as much an error as the Rpulldown/jack screwup, I just don't bother with junction dots when drawing schematics for myself, because I'm terrible at the editor and can't use it properly. Instead, I leave a break when there's supposed to be a (to me) obvious bridge - like in the neg feedback between Q2 emitter & Q1 base.

I should remember to edit the stuff I draw before offering it up for human consumption.

If wired correctly, I still think it should sound like the fuzz part of the FTM with a reduced parts count. Might even be better (and use fewer parts!) with a 10u cap bypassing Q2's emitter resistor and dumping the bridged-T filter in the feedback in favor of a single 100k or so resistor, and maybe a treble bleed cap or RC filter at the base of Q1 (because it does influence the frequencies being fuzzied). There's already a tone filter at the end, we're dumping the octave, the whole point is simplifying it, etc....

[whoisalhedges]

Maybe more like this:

[GibsonGM]

R1 is only 1K, dude?  (just pointing that out...I know it's still in the works!)

[duck_arse]

Maybe more like this:

yes, possibly more like that, except I can't see anything. cut and pasted the url, tried various spellings, nothing except "error".

[whoisalhedges]

yes, possibly more like that, except I can't see anything. cut and pasted the url, tried various spellings, nothing except "error".

Huh.

[BassClarinet]

FWIW, I had assumed there was a connection between R9, R10, and Q3 base just like you intended. But, I appreciate the other fixes that you made. I'll be ordering parts in the next day or two and I'll be sure to report back once I get it up and running.