How to populate a Morning Glory/Bbreaker/KoT pcb without instructions

[eh la bas ma]

Hi,

I recently started El Rey de la Gloria Azul II project from delyk (on musikding).
Unfortunatly there isn't any BOM or instructions on delyk's website.
I contacted him a week ago, and he answered me that he's gonna try to do it as soon as he can.

https://www.delykpcb.com/product/el-rey-de-la-gloria-azul-ii-pcb/

Few days later, I thought I could populate the pcb by myself, identifying the changes from version 1 to version 2.
I used a multimeter to check continuity between the different component's location but something is obviously wrong with my work. I only have a signal in bypass mode, the led doesn't even light up.

My questions would be : a/ What would be the most secure way to populate a pcb without instructions in case it happen again ?
                                     b/ can you help me populate this one (I know I should be more patient, but it could be instructive, right?) ?

Here's what i did for a kind of Morning glory project on this delyk's pcb :
Rpd = 2.2 M
R1 = 1M
R2 = 3.3k
R3 = 4k7
R4 = 10k
R5 = 220k
R6 = 6k8
R7 = 1k
R8 = 6k8
R9 = 47k
R10 = none
Rx1 = 68k
Rx2 = 1M
Rx3 = 22k
Rx4 = 12k
Rx5 = 12k
Rx6 = 100k
C1 = 47 nf
C2 = 47 pf
C3 = 10n
C4 = 10 n
C5 = 100n
C6 = 10n
C7 = 10n
C8 = 1uf mlcc (don't have mlcc so i took an other type)
C9 = none
C10 = 100uf
C11 = 100uf
Cx1 = 100pf
Cx2 = 470pf
Cx3 = 100n
Cx4 = 10uf
Cx5 = 1uf polarized
Cx6 = 10n
D11 = backward : square pad for diode + (continuity with 9V on DC power jack) , round pad for - (there is continuity with ground)

and here is a picture :



Edit : I worked with this schematics from Aion's Cerulean which is a close project, I compared with the first version instructions (download > BOM)
https://aionfx.com/app/files/docs/cerulean_documentation.pdf
https://www.delykpcb.com/product/el-rey-de-la-gloria-azul-pcb/

[GGBB]

I don't mean to be critical, but no-one should ever buy a commercial PCB that doesn't come with at the very least a list of part values. Or maybe no-one should ever sell a commercial PCB without providing at the very least a list of part values.

There is no easy way to populate the board. You essentially have to reverse-engineer the board component-by-component, trace-by-trace. Then you will have a - hopefully accurate - schematic with which you can compare to whichever circuit you want to build and figure out the correct part values.

[eh la bas ma]

That's too bad.
I didn't ordered this pcb, I didn't even knew there was a second version. I ordered the first one but I guess it is discontinued...

Reverse-engineer the board is done with a multimeter on continuity mod and that's all ?

[antonis]

http://music.codydeschenes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/JHS-Morning-Glory-Schematic.png

Fresh battery in your DMM and go.. 

edit: Wrong version posted..  Aionfx is more close to your PCB..

[eh la bas ma]

Some part's locations are hard to figure out : R10's right pad is connected to 9V+ and left pad is connected to the fifth leg of the LM833 (+ IN B). I can't find it on both schematics.
C9 is connected to Volume's left pad. C9's upper pad is connected to Rx3. I thought it was 100n and then I thought it was the one you need to left empty if you build the gain stage, like C8 on Cerulean.

I am not sure about the polarity protection diode (D11) does it makes sense to put i t backward ?

[antonis]

R10's right pad is connected to 9V+ and left pad is connected to the fifth leg of the LM833 (+ IN B).

It can't be 'cause pin 5 (+ IN) should be connected on VB (junction of 47k/47k resistors..)

edit: It might be 10k/10k VB so check for another 10k going from pin 5 to GND..
(after all, only one 47k is included in your BOM..)

[PRR]

..Reverse-engineer the board is done with a multimeter on continuity mod and that's all ?

Reverse engineering is done with your brain.

Eyes, meter, etc are just for clues.

[GGBB]

I am not sure about the polarity protection diode (D11) does it makes sense to put i t backward ?

Depends on the type of polarity protection. If it's a parallel diode (connects between Vin and ground) then it should be backward. If it's a series diode (between Vin and circuit power) then it should be forward.

[eh la bas ma]

R10's right pad is connected to 9V+ and left pad is connected to the fifth leg of the LM833 (+ IN B).

It can't be 'cause pin 5 (+ IN) should be connected on VB (junction of 47k/47k resistors..)

edit: It might be 10k/10k VB so check for another 10k going from pin 5 to GND..
(after all, only one 47k is included in your BOM..)

Your help is very much appreciated, I just have a hard time to understand what you mean. There is a little section (with the polarity protection diode) cut from the main circuit : Is it a buffer section ? According to the Cerulean, that's where both 47k go.
What does "VB", "VR" or "VA" means ?
I read somewhere it means half voltage ?
There is two 47k in "El Rey" BOM and only one 10k resistor.
In the first version schematics There is R5 and R6 (10k and 4k7)in serie going to some caps then going to the opamp. A jumper should replace the 4k7 if i don't build a bluesbreaker. Maybe this is R10 ? The two emplacements under R10 (R9 and R11) are connected to each other. R9 is also connected to 9V+, and R11 to the big cap (C11) next to them. I figured it was part of the "buffer section" . R10 is also connected to R1 and R1 to R11... I am getting lost...

[eh la bas ma]

I am not sure about the polarity protection diode (D11) does it makes sense to put i t backward ?

Depends on the type of polarity protection. If it's a parallel diode (connects between Vin and ground) then it should be backward (anode to ground). If it's a series diode (between Vin and circuit power) then it should be forward.

Ok, thanks.

Can I do some damage to this kind of circuit if I place this polarity protection the wrong way ? Do I have a second chance to desolder and turn it around if I am wrong ?

"Vin" designate 9V's pad on the pcb ? What do you name "circuit power"? Is it the 9V pin on the power jack ?

Edit: opamp's pin 8 is connected to the square pad so I assume D11 orientation is right. 

[Rob Strand]

Surely the guy that did the board can tell you the schematic he used?

If not, just get a schematic and match up the designators (R1, C2 etc) with PCB.   You can see the connections clearly on the PCB.  It's a lot easier to see on a bare board than a populated board so putting the time in up front will pay off later.   Use the multimeter conductivity buzzer to check "long range" connections.

[eh la bas ma]

Surely the guy that did the board can tell you the schematic they used?

If not, just get a schematic and match up the designators (R1, C2 etc) with PCB.   You can see the connections clearly on the PCB.  It's a lot easier to see on a bare board than a populated board so putting the time in up front will pay off later.   Use the multimeter conductivity buzzer to check "long range" connections.

I think i did that yersteday. That's how i came up with the long list of values in the first post. Being my first "reverse-engineering-using-my-brain" thing, I meet some difficulties  along the way. Notably some inner networks like "ground" and "VB" . Some pads are ringing with others when I didn't expect they would because they're linked by these networks that I am still trying to understand.
Clearly I could wait for Mister Kyle Daley from Delyk to send me something, but he doesn't happen to be in a hurry. I never heard a bluesbreaker-ish pedal before, only in concerts, in video, or in my dreams... I guess i am in a hurry, moreover, beeing as lost as i am now means i am learning (painfully but still) ! It seems the real difficulty here is that the board is intended for three different projects, with interesting mods (bright cut, clip, hard clip). A few component's locations should be jumped or skipped for every versions (Morning glory, KoT, Bbreaker).

I never spent so much time before trying to make sense with three schematics of the same hybrid circuit, if I succeed i will have those famous circuits engraved for ever in my mind. I can almost tell you every cap and resistor values by heart already and in good order ! Maybe i can even hope to understand precisely what's actually happening when someone will use it ...

[Rob Strand]

I found this doc on the website.  It looks like it has all the info in it.

https://www.delykpcb.com/product/el-rey-de-la-gloria-azul-pcb/?attachment_id=1064&download_file=5c5b866ab67ba

It seems the real difficulty here is that the board is intended for three different projects, with interesting mods (bright cut, clip, hard clip). A few component's location should be jumped or skipped.

It does confuse things.   Just follow the columns, if a part isn't listed just leave it out.

[eh la bas ma]

Thank you, this is version 1 instructions. I already put it at the end of my first post. I worked with it but there is some significant differences with version 2.
It really looks like Delyk looked at aion' s cerulean (which is exactly the same 3-in-1 project) and did something much closer to the cerulean with his "Rey" version2.

For exemple the optional gain stage is now designated, on El Rey II's pcb, by "Rx..." and "Cx..." exactly like aion's schematics. None of that in previous version 1, he kept with the normal designations.

Can you tell me how do you call the little separated section of the circuit with the polarity protection diode, and what is the difference between 9V+, "VA" and "VR" on the cerulean schematic, please ? So that I can find these with the multimeter (link is https://aionfx.com/app/files/docs/cerulean_documentation.pdf ).

[Rob Strand]

Thank you, this is version 1 instructions. I already put it at the end of my first post. I worked with it but there is some significant differences with version 2.
It really looks like Delyk looked at aion' s cerulean (which is exactly the same 3-in-1 project) and did something much closer to the cerulean with his "Rey" version2.

For exemple the optional gain stage is now designated by "Rx..." and "Cx..." exactly like aion's schematics.

It's quite possible it follows aion' cerulean.    You could try to compare all the documents and see what it is different.   You might find they are very close.   The biggest problem would be an Rx and Cx on the V2 board that is different to the all the documents.  That would be very annoying.   It might help comparing the PCB pic in the V1 PDF with the PCB you have.    The PCB pic currently on the Delky website might be V1 or V2, it depends how fussy the guy is about showing exactly what you are buying.

[eh la bas ma]

There is a big picture of the Version II at Delyk's. It is the first link in the first post, here it is : https://www.delykpcb.com/product/el-rey-de-la-gloria-azul-ii-pcb/

I did compare the two versions with the Cerulean and with the JHS schematics ( http://music.codydeschenes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/JHS-Morning-Glory-Schematic.png ), that's how i came up with the long list of values in the first post . I proceeded with the soldering, but the 9V electric power doesn't hit the pcb, the led doesn't light up (it does if i test it with a battery) and there is no signal. Only in bypass mode i can hear my guitar. Like something stops or absorbs all the electric power. Could it be the polarity diode ?

Edit : i tried to replace the DC power jack and it is still the same, i read 0.5 V on the multimeter, where it should be 9V. Even with the black probe on ground and red probe on positive lug of the DC power jack, I read something going between 0.5 and 0.9 V. The power supply unit is Onespot and works perfectly with other stompboxes. A different power supply does the same, unfortunatly.

[Rob Strand]

Could it be the polarity diode ?

Somewhere in the PDF I posted I remember reading the protection diode was around the wrong way!
(on page 4, D11)

[eh la bas ma]

Well, i am gonna try to turn D11 around just in case.
There is also the JP1 thing (on page 6),located in the bottom left corner. Any idea what does it do ? I have soldered every switches so I went with the last option : jumper on pad 2 and 3 (assuming pad 1 is the closest to the edge of the pcb).

[Rob Strand]

There is also the JP1 thing (on page 6),located in the bottom left corner. Any idea what does it do ? I have soldered every switches so I went with the last option : jumper on pad 2 and 3 (assuming pad 1 is the closest to the edge of the pcb).

It changes the connection of C2 (see schematic, C2 is near IC1A).

From what I can see this will have no effect on the operation of the pedal.   It's more to do with following the original pedal schematic exactly.

[eh la bas ma]

Yyyeeehhaaaahaahhaha!

Rob you're the best !

The led Lights up!

Let me try with a guitar now...

Edit : no sound. But still, Progress ! Thank you so much !