Taming Volume

[Phend]

Hi,
Question,
How to decrease the volume of a loud effect so when switched between clean and effect there is not "that much" of a difference.
The SMD Muff Fuzz I made had that problem.
The solution was to put a 100K resistor between the output lead and the Volume pot, thus increasing the value of the pot.
It worked.
On the Harmonic Peculator build it seems not quite as effective. 
I have put a 1M resistor between the output capacitor and the volume (balance) pot with some result but not what I would have thought it would do.
Do I need to put a resistor between the pot lug and ground also ?
What am I missing here ?
Thanks

[GGBB]

I can't see why it wouldn't work, but you shouldn't need the resistor to turn down the volume. Have you wired the pot as in the drawing? pin 1 to ground, pin 2 to output, pin 3 to cap/resistor.

[Phend]

Somewhere along the circuits I seem to have used a B100K in lieu of a A50K (or B50K).
Maybe it looses volume when the resistance is Lowered ? ie 50 vs 100 ?

[GGBB]

Somewhere along the circuits I seem to have used a B100K in lieu of a A50K (or B50K).
Maybe it looses volume when the resistance is Lowered ? ie 50 vs 100 ?

Typically you would want A taper otherwise with B taper you have to turn way down for the same effect - which could be your problem. I don't think 100k vs 50k will matter.

[Phend]

I assume on a B pot, pins 1 and 3 could be switched, though it may work backwards.
Big confusion here on my part,
-The Input is an A pot but I may have it wired backwards but it still increases turned CW and down
  to zero "volume" turned all the way CCW.
-I have the Volume (balance) pot wired backwards, I guess, but it works turning CW to increase.

Look at these pictures.

Standard numbering
Looking at Giblet's circuit in the first post IS lug 3 ground on both Input and Output pots as like this: ?


Note the numbering on the output on this Axis Face


Here is an example, Look at the Vol pot, 1 is ground


Here is A50K pot, Bottom lug is ground ??

[antonis]

Muff Fuzz Q2 Output (Collector) resistance is 10k (almost negligible for op-amp version) where Harmonic Percolator's one is 91k..
Volume/Balance pots are effectivelly set in parallel with respective output impedance so you are able to make "loading" calculations..

[GGBB]

Here is A50K pot, Bottom lug is ground ??

[Phend]

1 2 3 got it. 3 isn't always ground.

[GGBB]

1 2 3 got it. 3 isn't always ground.

In the typical output level control, usually 1 is ground, 3 is signal, and 2 is output.

[Phend]

Thanks GGBB, now I won't have to rewire all my diy effects !
Many schematics do not have the lugs labeled.
Even in picture drawings the shaft is not shown.
For me, confusing but learning. 

[duck_arse]

c o u n t e r c l o c k w i s e - turn it down, coldest, goes to ground.

turn it up? are you turning the knob clockwise? then that is the hot end, where THE FULL SIGNAL is applied. and you know the wiper. forget 1 2 3 4 and 5. read the schem, for a standard voltage divider, do you want down anticlockwise or clockwise?


mind - I've been pipped this week for not knowing my up from my higher.

[Phend]

Yup, I would like Loud fully CW.
Which may I ask, from a resistance stand point in a pot, is Loud when the wiper is positioned in such a manner that there is the least resistance between it and the incoming signal.
Ie, in the schematic the wiper would be all the way Up. Hence basically connecting the incoming signal wire to the wiper of the pot with no pot resistance inbetween.

[antonis]

https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/voltage-dividers/all

https://www.instructables.com/How-to-use-a-potentiometer-as-a-voltage-divider/

[antonis]

For a pot wished to act fully CW for full output, signal should enter into lug 3 with lug 1 grounded (or wired at voltage level lower than the one of lug 3, nahhh forget it 'cause might be confusing..)

If you want to lower output amplitude for any pot setting you have to place a resistor in series with lug 3 where if you want to raise it you have to place a resistor in series with lug 1..

[Phend]

Did just that, resistor in series with lug 3 to tame the volume. (Lug 1 is ground)
I believe, that, often the volume control is set at max. Correct me.
Therefore, I think when switching from clean to effect the volume should be close to the same.
My HP build without the added resistor is rediculisly loud. So I tamed it down.
This must be an issue for many effect builds.?
Sure, sometimes,  maybe you want a boost, but in this case I don't.
Thanks for all the help, and look for a demo of this mojo HP soon.

[antonis]

My HP build without the added resistor is rediculisly loud.

What kind of clipping diodes you've used..??

[Phend]

One 1n34 in series with 1K resistor and an unknown,  can't read, from an old FM radio, it is a "fat" Ge.
The diodes can be switched on off.
The pair works, but tomorrow I will replace the fat one with another 1n34 to hear.
They are plug an play.
Transistors are Q1 2n404 hfe 180 and Q2 Ge 2n1340 hfe 70 .
Like 2n1340 Ge better than 2n3565 Si.

[antonis]

The diodes can be switched on off.

I presume your loud output issue stands for diodes OFF only..

[Phend]

No, either on off. Using 2n3565 with 91k, same thing, loud.
I see other older posts saying it is loud.
Currently it is sounding good.
And other posts say no 2 r the same.

Ps, using tantalum cap at C4 and bi polar elec cap at output C6.

Found, Diode is an OA79