Has the rise and rise of Chinese clones changed what you build?

[JustinFun]

Just something that occurred to me today.

My DIY perfboard Klone (dating back to the halcyon days of 2009) has been replaced on my pedalboard by a Mosky Golden Horse (for space), and whilst I might solder up or breadboard a schematic for curiosity, I rarely box up a mainstream circuit these days when I can get an electronically identical pedal for £30-£40.

Similarly, if a friend asked me to build them a Tubescreamer or a Phase 90, I'd direct them to the numerous affordable smd clones on Amazon and Ebay.

If they want a Bee Baa,a Mki Tonebender, a Maestro FSH, etc., THEN I'm interested.

Back in the 2000's I did a decent (beer money) trade in Big Muff, Fuzz Face, Phase 90, etc clones, but now?

What's everyone else's experience?

[patricks]

I build for the hobby, I'm not up to selling things (yet, maybe), so my approach hasn't changed overall because that's been the focus.

I've been building with the approach that I'll build whatever I can that's not too complex - things like chorus, flange and delay have been more time- and cost-effective to buy rather than build, and I haven't dabbled in DSP yet.
I prefer to customise my pedals too, so it's easier to mod DIY circuits than the SMD cheap pedals.

The super cheap clones (Amazon, EBay, Nux, Joyo, Caline, etc, etc.) are equivalent or sometimes cheaper, even, to buy than the cost of DIY here in Aus (the Aus exchange rate and GST stops them being cheaper than DIY, usually), but for ovrdrive/distortion/fuzz, phase, tremolo, I'd probably only buy in preference to building if I was putting together a tiny pedalboard/fly rig, for reasons of time more than cost.
Even then I'm likely to consider seriously building up a fly rig using multiple circuits in one larger enclosure, tbh.

Building is too much fun

[crane]

There are pedals that are not worth DIYing and cheap Chinese clones to increase number of them.
However.... You can take almost any boss pedal and make it sound "better" (using quotes here because there is no better/worse in such a relative thing as pedal sounding good) by changing same parts to same value but better build quality (talking mainly about opamps and cheap caps here).
I have build ~4 klon copies and bought the Chinese one as well.  Trying not to be biased but the built one sounded better. Have to say that I spend an awful lot of time doing research on that particular project (the klon) and didn't take the first schematic that I found online.
So.... yeah cheap pedals to change what is worth building but it has been like that for a long time.
I have build around 50..100 pedals for closer and not so close friends, repaired and/or modded a lot as well. That's my background.
I am off building pedals and playing music for ~10 years now. I come to this site to check whats new and to remember the "better days"
However - the older I get the more I think that all the fuss is overrated and a good song is a good song. A bad song is a bad song.

[r080]

It has definitely changed why I build. I used to think of building as cheaper. You would see a pedal for $120 and figure you can build it for $40 in parts. Now, there are clones for $30, and that no longer makes sense. Now I build just for fun, and if it happens to be a design where it actually does save me money, great. I have enjoyed some of the builds where it is a design from the DIY community that has no commercial equivalent.

[Rob Strand]

It has definitely changed why I build. I used to think of building as cheaper. You would see a pedal for $120 and figure you can build it for $40 in parts. Now, there are clones for $30, and that no longer makes sense. Now I build just for fun, and if it happens to be a design where it actually does save me money, great. I have enjoyed some of the builds where it is a design from the DIY community that has no commercial equivalent.

I think I started building a lot less from scratch for the same reasons as far back as 1990.  By the time you add up the basic parts like enclosure, switch, 6.5mm sockets, DC jacks, pots and knobs there is significant chunk of base-line costs.  Then on top of that PCB's and the parts.

Even 15 years ago you could buy pedals on-sale for cheaper than the price of a BBD chip.

[Baran Ismen]

Hasn't changed what I intend to make, but some of these Chinese soldiers have already taken their places on my pedalboard. My favs are;

1- M-Wave's mini-universe, for example. It's a hilariously great reverb pedal! I guess it's a Strymon clone.
2- Donner's Echo Square; 7 delay modes in a small box.
3- Mooer X2; 14 preamps with 3 IRs in the size of a regular boss pedal almost. You can literally import GIR files -which are modeled real amp responses-
4- Mooer Mod Factory mk2; 11 effects in a box, keeping it as a backup.

I wouldn't pay for a single-type modulation pedal or any sort of distortion/od, they all can be doable.

[GibsonGM]

If it's something using more than a couple of ICs, say flange, delay...then yeah, buying the knockoff seems more sensible to me.  But anything that I want to be custom - requiring the auditioning of transistors or adjustment of caps to fit my rig - of course I'll DIY it.

Seems to be the way it is now, that fuzzes, distortions, ODs are DIY and things getting much more complex than a Phase 90 you might buy cheaply.  Tho I do prefer to buy the BOARD and assemble the thing myself, just cuz it's something I do and enjoy! 

[Frank_NH]

I suppose it's like guitar building. You can buy a very nice Asian guitar for much less than you can build it from scratch.  But if you want to use special woods and the finest construction methods, then you can either buy a boutique instrument or make it yourself.

So what's the transistor equivalent of Brazilian Rosewood? 

[Rob Strand]

Hasn't changed what I intend to make, but some of these Chinese soldiers have already taken their places on my pedalboard.

What I've often done is taken the basic circuit and modded it.   Essentially build a new pedal using the cheap pedal as a framework.

[Baran Ismen]

Hasn't changed what I intend to make, but some of these Chinese soldiers have already taken their places on my pedalboard.

What I've often done is taken the basic circuit and modded it.   Essentially build a new pedal using the cheap pedal as a framework.

Also an option, yes. But they all consist of the smallest smd parts possible, i cant even see the, let alone replace or mod 😆 once i checked a tuner i bought, seems like it has a millenium bypass with a crippled signal clipping on one side, i intended to fix it but nope, my solder tip is literally bigger than the parts themselves lol

[stallik]

Nope.

DIY affords me the ability to create anything I want. I build guitars, amps and effects. Unfortunately, in each case, I seem to make far worse design decisions that the manufacturers.

So, I've ended up with a stores worth of kit, most of which is unused. I also like all my stuff to look like a cohesive set so I tend to replicate my design errors often.

I bought a cheap little Klone - sounds exactly like my own build but it's relegated to a shelf as it doesn't visually match my other pedals.

I think I have a problem

[ElectricDruid]

So what's the transistor equivalent of Brazilian Rosewood? 

Black glass OC73 by Mullard? Something Germanium/Unobtainium, certainly, and probably equally endangered in the wild!

[marcelomd]

Yup.
I used to build because I had no access to the pedals (because money or availability here).
More or less at the same time the Chinese clones took the market I realized I didn't want to copy anyone's sound, so I started to design my own stuff. Still based on existing designs, but with added features, combinations, or different settings.

[Rob Strand]

Also an option, yes. But they all consist of the smallest smd parts possible, i cant even see the, let alone replace or mod 😆 once i checked a tuner i bought, seems like it has a millenium bypass with a crippled signal clipping on one side, i intended to fix it but nope, my solder tip is literally bigger than the parts themselves lol

Don't worry I'm in the same boat.  As time goes on I get more frustrated reworking SMD.  Some older guys I know have a whole camera and screen setup.  Looks like they are doing one of those operations on TV.

[Phend]

I started building effects as a hobby.
Satisfaction from what I build is mine that I built.
It is still a hobby, not needing them as a source of income.
Or selling them for a source of income.
Nothing complex, but have done (what i believe is) odd artistic stuff, making enclosures, laying out existing circuits (thanks GGG) on solderable breadboards.
I see the China stuff on Amazon, cheap.
This forum is about building and and help.
Both are hobbies of the members here.
Bottom line, if you need a complex effect for "work" then buy a good one, if it is a build you can handle then spend a few monies and make one you can call YOURS.
PS,  there is a lot to building even a simple one. And a lot of satisfaction when you make it work.!

[Frank_NH]

One thing I like about building my own effects is the ability to repair them.  As mentioned above, while it's possible to repair SMT boards with patience and the right equipment, it's not easy (at least for me) and having the correct parts on hand would send me down another rabbit hole.  Also, I've seen the use of SMT in modern guitar amplifiers and thought that once they break they'll be discarded rather than repaired... 

[deadastronaut]

nope, as i still love through hole....

the price of fets j201 etc , and the plethora of fake stuff have put me off certain builds now though to be honest . 

but still love it....been getting into small home friendly ss amps lately with cheap ready made amp modules. 

just built one with built in soundcard/OTG for direct recording to a tablet or phone...

[GGBB]

No. I've never built anything "stock" - where's the fun in that?

[moid]

No. I've never built anything "stock" - where's the fun in that?

I agree - that's the fun part to me - to make something that exists but adjust it / mod it / change it in some way to see what new sounds it can make. Designing a new circuit is way beyond my skills, but I do listen to other pedals and think, oh I wish it could do this, or that effect was stronger or slower etc and that gets me into all sorts of trouble brings me a lot of joy (when they work)... it would probably be easier for many of the kind souls here if I just built stock circuits!