Why people hates Line & and POD????????

[Bluesgeetar]

So you see here Prive?  Ditch the Idea of getting the PODXT and get you a THD Hot plate if volume is a problem for you.  This is the way of a professional guitarist.  Price difference between the Hotplate and the POD isn't that much so do yourself a favor.  

If you do this you can bet your arse that in due time you'll be putting your PODXT on ebay with all the rest.   :wink:

[william]

I think the biggest problem is the term "amp modeller".  People get it expecting it to replace their amps.  I usually encourage people to think of it as another tool rather than a replacement.  A Pod is great for practicing, or if your re-amping a track, for adding another flavor to the track.  During the recording for machine head's most recent album, they mic'd a 5150 for the body of their guitar sound, and a Line6 Spider to augment the low end a bit.  As for programming a Pod, The original pod was a nightmare.  I had to use my computer to program it.  The podxt was much easier, and worth every penny.  I take it with me everytime I travel.  Its easier to lug a small metal pod up a flight of stairs than an 80lb 5150 combo.  It also doesn't get me kicked out of hotels.  The fact that I can quickly record an idea or song with it is great.  If I need a tone similar to a fender, I can dial it in within a few seconds.  Again, and as an employee of Guitar Center, I tell people not to think of it as an amp replacment, because your just setting yourself up for dissapointment.  But as another tool to improve your skill, find a tone, and quickly record idea's, its nearly unmatched.

[ryanscissorhands]

I want a magical anything amp.

I have a suggestion for just that--if you do any acoustic stuff. Get a 2x12 or 2x10 amp, and in the 'butt groove' of the two speakers install a tweeter with either a switch on the back or a foot switch. Acoustic amp to regular amp with the touch of a switch--almost. As close as you'll get for $25 USD of equipment. Just watch out to make sure it's off before driving it hard with a preamp or whatever, or you'll blow the tweeter.

[ryanscissorhands]

I have a POD 2.0, and liked it for a long time, but feel that it is lacking. PODS ARE SOLD AS STAND-ALONE UNITS, BUT CAN'T STAND ALONE. Remember this. For recording, it's a jewel. I've recorded tracks while my laundry is on in the next room and someone came in to talk to me--I politely nodded and smiled while finishing the track. Beautiful.

But I decided to go with stompboxes because i need more flexibility in effects chains, and there is no out/through looping stuff with my POD. It's impossible to get a sound that nobody has heard because THE POD SERIES IS BASED ON MIMICKING THINGS WE'VE HEARD BEFORE. Someone said great for covers. I totally agree. Not good for original sound, because it's a modeller. You can't teach a new POD new tricks.

But I will still probably use it as a preamp, and as a distortion modeller. It will still be a part of my effects series, but will not BE the effects series as it is "supposed to."

[GM Arts]

First off, thanks for the extra positive feedback guys, it IS appreciated  :wink:

I think this thread's turning into a modeller vs real amp debate, and I'd agree with just about every comment.  Modellers are still not good enough to replace real amps, and no amp can be as flexible (or cheap) as a modeller.

The "thin and fizzy" criticism is directed entirely at the Line6 PODxt, when it's used at moderate to high overdrive levels.  And my theory, which I wrote in more detail in my last mesaage, is that it models a mike'd amp very well, which is thinner and fizzier than the sound we hear from our favourite amps.

The previous POD model (version 2.2 or 2.3 favoured by different users) had evolved into a very sophisticated guitar effects unit IMHO.  Arguably one of the best for live use, but the PODxt has gone back to its roots as a recording preamp first, and live effects unit second.

I'd suggest we don't be too hasty to claim modellers will never replace real amps.  To my ears, the clean sounds, and "on-the-edge-of-clipping" sounds on the PODxt are closer to real amps than I would have believed is possible.  Which is why I bought it.  This is the first modeller I happily use for my home recordings, and I'd consider myself pretty picky when it comes to guitar tone.

I'd agree the older POD models are responsible for the cliched, boring, generic, characterless guitar overdrives that meany of us are tired of hearing on recordings over about the last 10 years.  OK, maybe it's only me, but you get my point.  

My biggest lament with modellers is that the sound's in the software.  Like many on this forum, I expect, I love to tinker, and while I'm a programmer as well, hacking into DSP chips is beyond me.

At the end of the day, it's only a sound tool just like my other effects and music gear, and I use it for what does well, and don't worry too much about what it lacks.

GM Arts

[petemoore]

Well if a PODxt is 'better' than a POD, what's the next phase?
 What's next will be 'better' than a POD xt?..when'll that be released?
  No Matter, I'll be having tubes drive my speakers anyway...by the time you get something that does one facet of what a tube can [without all the WIDENESS/dynamic range/unpredictability] you could probably have just HAD the tubes/speaker setup anyway.
  I find these modellers do part of what a tube can do very well in some cases.
 What I can't figure out is: If these things are known to come close to tubes after all this trying...why don't they concentrate on getting them to do like super wild stuff like I'm sure they can, that has very little to do with tube emulations.
 LIKE: wierd sustains that morph from one tone to another depending on input voltage...Hard attacks that switch to something ;else'
 High resolution digital tube emulations have a tuff time emulating all the nuances and wierd stuff a tube and speaker do. Why use transistors to do that except for low level use...[tubes just don't do their trix at relly low volumes].
 I mean why try for something that 'might be percieved as passable, when instead the 'thing could be made to go where no digijobber has gone before?
 The mere fact they're trying to emulate tubes says something..
 I'ts interesting how people prefer a stamped out copy of the original...makes perfect sense in circumstances where the tube can't do that...like low volume.
 Actually buying a tube amp has always been somewhat expensive and scary..and worth it IMO.
 Besides...I've seen these DIGI units/SS amps, [Line 6 amp /or pod in a big honker amp/speaker array]...live they sound cool I guess, I think it sounds like mush personally...
 Besides...after trying numerous AD/DA [units from 100$ through 1500$], I found out how much I really like hearing the note WHEN the note is played..not a batch of milliseconds later...Yes I definitively notice a difference...Ok you get used to it...lol...! [fer live use, Jes don' werk right fer me]. Edit..could work ok...I simply prefer the wideness/flexability of a distorted tube amp sound.
 Actually for say Fender tone...I heard a Line 6 amp that sounded precisely like a Fender amp/but not a Fender amp with it's inputs boosted or Fuzzed...sorta close...no cigar.
 Kind of like playing a video game...the novelty factor wears off after you've been through all the levels..but can still be fun when you can't have anything 'real' to do.
 I like the ability to find new tones by combining effects. Sorting through parameters and attempting to dial in great live tones, and 'out the digitalness...I found this to be somewhat fruitless and fatigueing, of course I was trying to do this through a Tube Amp that works just great with analog circuits..so all of the above [neg/digi] statements could  be nulled by this fact.

[Hal]

I personally haven't played with an xt yet.  I've played the old spiders, and i wasn't impressed.  Not only doesn't sound _amazing,_ but its also too complecated for me.  guitar-stompboxes-amp is all i need :-D.  I dunno, im a purist, and i dont like change.  I started playing a couple years before the digital revolution.  I think i know how my parents feal (Whats a DVD)?

[Doug H]

Behringer V-Amp Pro is more like it.  Got mine for $140 on ebay ($199 new)  Rack mount, everything a pod has at one-third the price (compared to the rack pod).  Haven't had a chance to compare it face to face with a pod, but it sounds pretty good to me for what it is.

JD

I've been kind of curious about the Vox Tone Lab myself. More expensive than the POD stuff but the clips I've heard of it are very impressive. Seems to have a lot of nice features and is put together well.  ...And it has the "real tube" so I'm sure it is automatically much better sounding than any of this SS stuff....(BWAHAHAHA!!! sorry... Just kidding.... :lol:  :lol:  :lol: )

Doug

[cd]

I liked the PODXT as a quiet or quick and dirty recording tool.  If all I ever used it for was practicing quietly, I'd ditch it since in that application it's too expensive.  Another thing I didn't like about it when recording is that an element of the guitar/amp combination is missing.  Example: with my Twin and JCM800, at a moderate volume (say around "5", which is still pretty clean with the Twin, and crunchy with the JCM800) in the middle of my Strat's neck, I can get a note to sustain and feedback forever just by varying my pick attack.  With the PODXT, that is simply not possible with headphones (I had to use a really gained out patch, which I dislike); through monitors at the same volume, the feedback didn't work either.  

Anyone know anything abou the Yamaha Magicstomp?

[Johan]

are we only talking about the pod here, or is it the amps too?.
it seems the pods are made for the studio..I had one a few years ago and didnt like it at all..all the models had the same overcompressed treble and didnt respond like I wanted them too...
...but their new line of amps, like flextone-3, I think sound really good when you turn them up a little....ok, If I could only choose one sound to play with forever, i would always go for my -72 50watt Marshall. but for those who needs more than just a few sounds, I really think these amps has a lot to offer...it might not be spot on, but the "highway-100" does sound like a hiwatt and the "british blues" like a jtm-45...the main drawback, and its a big one for everyone at THIS forum, is that they dont respond to stompboxes like the originals do...MY main conserne is..how comfortable are you, playing live through a computer?....keyboardists have been doing it for well over 20 years, but it makes me a little uneasy...

Johan

[gorohon]

I've had a PodXT for a year.  It's fine if you know what its limitations are.  I would never suggest it as a replacement for a real tube amp.  It does come in handy for direct recording, coming up with ideas late at night, and praticing.  There are a variety of combintations to tweak on the thing.  It's just another tool that I use, along with my tube amp and various stompboxes.  I won't get rid of it.  To get the best from these things, you have to spend alot of time tweaking.  I've heard most of their presets, and they're awful.  I spent some time coming up with my own and it does sound decent now.  But, alas, NEVER as good as my tube amp!

[Prive]

Ok, thanks for comments and ideas, i'm not asking before buying, just curious.
Sorry for the comparation, i hope all of you understand, english isn't my original idiom.
I have a toaster, and it makes great, really great toast.
But it doesn't sound like my Plexy.
Why everybody think PODxt have to amplify???
PODxt is not an amplifier, is a complete enviroment simulation, since stompboxes, amp, cab, mic, preamp, effects to studio processor.
This is a complete chain.
With a Plexy you have some sounds, but no Jazz Chorus sound.
With a Twin you play blues but not nu metal.
With a Jazz chorus don't think in Malmsteen.
With a 5150 The edge have a nightmare.

Any amp in the world of vintage amps can be so close to any other amp tone.

Of course, if you don't want to fight with programming ok, but it's another problem, if you can't make it sound or if you don't want to make it sound like you need.
If you let the controls of any pedal at "0" i don't think you like the sound.

I see lots of build reports about Sansamp GT2 here and everybody like it a lot.
I have it and use it but it's 10% or less good sounding and versatile, the dist is so treble, the tone control is full of noise and you have any headroom, but everybody loves it.

Why this hate about POD??? It makes recording and more, HOME recording easier.

Saludos, Marcelo.

[cd]

Aha, you bring up a good point Prive.  Does a Plexi player really need a JC sound?  Would The Edge ever use a 5150?  As a Twin user I rarely venture into nu-metal (but I've got a Metal Zone to cover me for that) but I can play jazz, country, blues, classic rock.  I'm not a session guitarist or anything so I don't need a lot of tones.  I don't think the average guitarist does either, provided they're lucky enough to have found their sound that suits their style of playing.  

BTW for a while I was into the Yngwie thing, and had my Twin modded with its stock clean channel and a very heavy Yngwie-ish lead tone

[petemoore]

I'ts a good thing. Anything that makes you happy is good.
 A bicycle is good, a Harley is good...when they work and fulfill the need they were produced for.
 I haven't looked closely at PODxt's, but offboard connections made through jacks soldered into a PCBoard???...uh, I've had enough of that to last a lifetime...
 When I see PCB prypoints like that I just categorize it as "Certain Future Garbage"...will not stand up to 'normal' use, and is all but impossible to repair neatly, also, it's impossible to improve to achieve acceptable levels of durability.
 I thought about running wires off the PCB, tying a knot to keep them from being pulled out the hole, then add jacks [RP 100]...but the twisting is just as bad as the pulling...
 I just can't work with, or rely on 'PCB/crackjack' technologies...designed obsolescence  IMO/ Garbage.

[tcobretti]

I have a Flextone II; it's a 60 watt amp with a single 12" speaker.  I have used it for live performances as well as pretty extensive recording.  Before owning it I had a fender bandmaster, a marshall 50w plexi, and a yamaha t100c (designed by soldano).  None of these amps could compare to the Line 6.  Plug any guitar in, dial in the vox and rock.   The fender sounds are very much like my bandmaster (I've also played a lot through fender twins), the plexi sounds at least as good as the real thing, and the line 6's soldanos sound just like my t100c (which sounded like crap).  I've never played thru a vox AC30, but the Line 6 version of it is incredible.  The Matchless is similarly amazing.  Probly the only sounds I don't like are the metal amps, which I have no use for.

It's great if you have a battery of guitars.  I have a 78 Les Paul Custom, a 90s SG, a homemade Brian May Red Special, a strat copy, and an Ibanez AF85.  One amp is not enough for these different guitars; the strat sounds lame thru a marshall (I don't know how hendrix did it, but my fuzzface definitely helps), The LPC sounds good thru a fender/vox but wicked thru the plexi, the Red Special sounds awesome thru the vox (no surprise there) and fender, and not so great thru the plexi.  You get the point.  The only amp that sounds good with everything is the Matchless, and if you actually buy one they cost $9,000,000 (not really).

I can see how the POD might be weird if you ran it into an amp.  That said, My friend who went on the road with Weezer said they used PODs to generate all their tones on the tour for their green album.

I'll never go back to a non-modeling guitar amp.  Never.

[Bluesgeetar]

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It's getting a little deep in here.  Better get my boat out.

[JohnM]

For me, the real question is "How will they sound with stomboxes attached?"     I don't know that all the cool stompboxes you've built will do their "tricks" when connected to one of these things.  Can anyone share their experiences?  -John

[will]

Hi,

I have a Flextone II; it's a 60 watt amp with a single 12" speaker.  I have used it for live performances as well as pretty extensive recording.  Before owning it I had a fender bandmaster, a marshall 50w plexi, and a yamaha t100c (designed by soldano).  None of these amps could compare to the Line 6.  Plug any guitar in, dial in the vox and rock.   The fender sounds are very much like my bandmaster (I've also played a lot through fender twins), the plexi sounds at least as good as the real thing, and the line 6's soldanos sound just like my t100c (which sounded like crap).  I've never played thru a vox AC30, but the Line 6 version of it is incredible.  The Matchless is similarly amazing.  Probly the only sounds I don't like are the metal amps, which I have no use for.

Stuff deleted...


I'll never go back to a non-modeling guitar amp.  Never.

I had quite a different experience with renting a Flextone Plus amp. Through the headphones the amp was great, lots of variety of sounds. However during live cranked jamming. The amp really wimped out. Every guitarist with a tube amp had way better sound. This turned me and a few others off the Line 6 stuff.

I pluged it into a marshall 800 lead cab and also into the Peavy Mace  black widdow 2-12 speakers. Huge improvement.  I bought the Mace and started building stomboxes to add character to the sound, but the amp never wimps out. It could be the speaker in the unit I rented was junk.

Regards,
Will

[aron]

And thanks for the compliment, csj. The site's pretty old now. It's just as well us guitarsits love our vintage gear, so hopefully the info's still relevant.

I love your site as well. I learned a lot from it. GREAT to have you here! BTW: Your pedal is good too!

Thanks!

[aron]

To me the POD is a great recording tool. I think the feel issue is that there's some latency in mine so it doesn't feel "immediate". However I have found it sounds and reacts totally different whether I am using single coils or humbuckers etc...

Personally I love mine. Time=money for the things I do with it and it's been great and quick to dial up useful sounds.

I do agree that on mine (original POD) the (lack of) treble is not right.

Still a very useful tool for me.