R.G. Keen has an amp series coming out

[CS Jones]

My simple recommendation is that you take all the valuable design and objectives info which is coming out in this thread (and I'm sure there's more to come) and incorporate it into an FAQ under the "Amp" link at the VisualSound site. It would be a great opportunity to educate the potential buyers with the facts straight from the source and hopefully avoid the misunderstandings that typically happen as the message makes it's way through the chain.

Also, and I don't really know how to say this without sounding too much like the sycophant "Smithers" on "The Simpsons", but...it would also behoove Mr. Weil to write up something on just who it is he has such great fortune to be working with on this.

Clay

[ErikMiller]

....reliability features are hard to sell. How do you demonstrate longevity to a customer with a brand new amp? They have to trust you enough to pay extra for a "reliable" amp and they won't see the value for their money for years. That's a tough sell.

R.G., kudos to you and your partner for designing for reliability and serviceability.

As an amp serviceman AND a manufacturer of music equipment, I have some ideas about this.

No, it's probably not possible to demonstrate longevity, but I believe that the consumers of a product like this are smart enough to learn from specific descriptions. It may not be as tough as you think I believe in advertising material that educates.

First, people need to learn that tube amps as an investment are more like guitars or houses than they are like televisions or stereos. They WILL require servicing eventually, and the easier it is to do that, the better off they will be.

PCB's can work well in tube amps, but they need the special consideration that you have given. DON'T put the jacks on the board is rule #1. I say leave the pots and switches off, too, if possible, and be careful about putting the tube sockets on the board. I like a separate board for tube sockets.

If jacks, pots, or switches do wind up on the board, they need to be of top quality and be well-secured to the panel, to the point that if the pot or jack were destroyed, the panel would take most of the damage.

I sincerely hope that the market follows you, that ruggedness and serviceability become selling points.

Others have said it on here already, but those amps are pretty much as I myself would make them. Except I would want a head-only. :-)

Any idea when you're shipping? I'm assuming you'll make NAMM '06 at least.

[Johnny Guitar]

I agree with the majority about how great these look.

Just to chime in on the deflector asthetic; I was a bit put off at first since I thought that it did look too much like a hubcap. But rock n' roll has a long affinity with hot rods, so the look doesn't bother me too much.

Then, after reading what others have said, I started imagining a deflector that looked a tiny bit more reminiscent of the intake to a turbo fan jet engine rather than a hubcap -- that would be more my style I think.

Good luck to both of you,
John

[Hailstorm350]

Sooooooooo.....
is it class A or A/B? :roll:
I didnt seem to see anything

I have decided from my own experiences of turning my master vol boogie up so it pushes the tubes, that Pure A would be better, but everything has a purpose doesn't it?

Looks great, I enjoy the hubcap look.  Its refreshing, and reminds me of the semi-new-age look of line-6 amps.  I really liked the risks you took on the look of this amp, and I hope you will continue to pump out such brilliant stuff like this in the future.

Ken

[ahermida]

R.G.:



[/url]


Alf (I'm definitely no Picasso)

[Doug_H]

I'm basing my hole-poking safety on the UL "safety finger". This is a tapered nylon instrument about eight inches long with three pivot joints and a wire through it to a metal contact at the pointy end. The pointy end is small, like a childs finger. The idea is that if you can touch dangerous voltages with the conductor by poking it into any opening on the unit and using any combination of the hinges, it's unsafe.

R.G., are you going to get this U.L. approved? (I know that's horribly expensive.) I was curious how you were handling the safety liability issues of producing a piece of equipment that plugs in the wall and develops high voltages inside. It sounds like you are engineering it for safety and to minimize risk.  At the same time, I don't know what you do to protect yourself from liablity for the bozo who opens it up and reaches inside when it's turned on.

I've thought about producing some amps to sell myself, but this this an area that has always concerned me.

Doug

[R.G.]

We're getting it safety approved. Probably UL, CSA and TUV. There really isn't any other good choice.

While there are no laws preventing you from selling equipment that isn't safety approved in the USA, there are such laws in other countries. And inside the USA, there are some places with local laws forbidding sale of non-approved electrical stuff, typically city and county laws. The bigger cities are usually where this happens.

Even safety spproval is not a protection. That just indicates that you tried to do due dilligence, and may weigh in your favor in court. Sadly, there is no real protection from bozo lawsuits.

As the man said "Of course the game is rigged. But don't let that stop you from betting - if you don't bet you CAN'T win."

[Hailstorm350]

That looks pretty cool, but I think that the problem is that the hubcap things stick way out, and makes it near impossible to put that grille cloth over it, if im wrong RG please correct me, but as I see in the pictures the hubcap thingies protrude out a ways.  nonetheless, it would look cool if it was possible.
Thanks for that insight alf

[ahermida]

yeah, there's a possibility that the "hubcap" extends too far.  One thing that I wanted to do (but I'm not that great with Photoshop) was to make it black.  I think people look at that part and since its silver it brings the spinner hubcaps to mind.  Maybe if the part is black, it will tone it down in a way that it will look as part of the speaker setup itself.  Maybe RG can tell them to try that in the 3D program they used to generate those images...Pro/E? SolidWorks?  :-).

I'm looking forward to this product since the only amp I use to develop my pedals is a Boogie SOB and they are tough to setup clean.  You need to play them at extremely low volumes.

Alf

That looks pretty cool, but I think that the problem is that the hubcap things stick way out, and makes it near impossible to put that grille cloth over it, if im wrong RG please correct me, but as I see in the pictures the hubcap thingies protrude out a ways.  nonetheless, it would look cool if it was possible.
Thanks for that insight alf

[Regan]

Cool amp, R.G.!
I think the amp looks pretty cool, but I'm wondering if while people are saying the hubcaps are too visible, might it not be that there is a little bit of an off balance thing going between the real conservative black and woodgrain of the rest of the amp and the aluminum.
Maybe adding a little bling to the rest of the amp would help?
I'm not sure if the woodgrain plate works IMHO, I kinda think maybe it would look better with a blue anodized aluminum panel there that matches the centers or something. On the other hand, I'm worried that this may somewhat cheapen the looks of the amp.
Also, why does everybody make the amps with the tweed style top mount controls, I find front mounted controls much more convenient.
All in all, I want to hear one!!
Regan

[barret77]

Congratulations RG! Your name in an amp design is the best possible guarantee of quality.

The silver hubcab could be a little less bling, though. Like black covered by a vox style grille cloth. Anyway, great amp!

[electrictabs]

cool job R.G.
i'm gonna buy a pony for sure
pleaz inform us when it hits the market

[smallbearelec]

Congratulations! Must be nice to be able to go to work doing something you love and for which you are appreciated instead of having to report to a pointy-haired "mis-" management.

SD

[Doug_H]

We're getting it safety approved. Probably UL, CSA and TUV. There really isn't any other good choice.

I figured as much... You guys are doing it right.

It would be nice if there was a way for small-time builders to band together and get this kind of testing done.  I believe it is unaffordable for me right now, and I would be nervous about releasing an amp without it.

Even safety spproval is not a protection. That just indicates that you tried to do due dilligence, and may weigh in your favor in court. Sadly, there is no real protection from bozo lawsuits.

As the man said "Of course the game is rigged. But don't let that stop you from betting - if you don't bet you CAN'T win."

Of course.

Doug

[WGTP]

R.G. my sympathy for being worked over by such a tuff crowd.  I'm sure you are aware that we are not the general guitar amp buying public.  The controversy generated by the hubcap should do a lot to seperate the amps from the pack and generate publicity.  "Better to get trashed, than not mentioned at all."  If you will now do the talk show circuit discussing some medical malidy that you have been afflicted with and overcome, that is all the press you will need.  Chance to sell some books too.

This will probably start a new trend.  PV amps will have hubcaps in the next few years.

Another design suggestion (sorry, we are all living vicariously here).
For more of a retro/tekno look, do away with the conventional grill all together.  Just put a hole in the front baffle for the speaker (which would be rear mounted) and put the hubcap/diffuser directly to the front of the baffle.  The baffle would be covered with hot pink snake skin like the rest of the cabinet (just joking).  I will try to stop now.  

[Mark Hammer]

I have no opinion one way or the other regarding the "hubcap", except to note that cab properties have undergone some interesting experiments in recent years.  The SMF amps took their idea from the old Pignose amps and implemented a variable open back.  The Feiten cabs, which won over the reviewers at GP a few years back, incorporated a front loaded and rear-loaded speaker to enhance sonic image.  And we have a nice emerging array of interesting driver combos out there.  I'm pleased to see some attention paid to guitar amps as speaker cabinets.  If it's good enough for audiophiles, it ought to be good enough for us too, right?

[Paul Marossy]

Hmm, I would have thought that if you are going to sell a tube guitar amp to the general public in the U.S. it would be mandatory to have it UL listed. Very interesting. In any case, I suppose the UL listing would possibly help cut down on any litigation regarding the safety of the product.

[casey]

who cares how it looks, i want to hear how it SOUNDS!

[Paul Marossy]

who cares how it looks, i want to hear how it SOUNDS!

But that's just the point - how it looks has to do with how it sounds, literally.  :wink:

[cjlectronics]

RG stated:

We're getting it safety approved. Probably UL, CSA and TUV. There
really isn't any other good choice.

I agree, most of your competition is UL and CSA approved plus it just makes good sense.

Beware though, I've taken a medical device for UL approval.  Spent a week in Northbrook with the UL engineers.  I'm glad we followed and personally worked with them at the plant.  There were a few mistakes made by technicians during the testing that woukld have cost us lots of money in redesign trying to pass their testing.  Once we tackled the problems together UL realized it was their misunderstanding.  Also, we found technicians weren't performing the testing correctly that would have otherwise failed our device for approval.  

Food for thought...

Good luck!
CJ Landry