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Behringer pedals out...

Started by brad, August 24, 2005, 03:08:56 AM

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brad

August 24, 2005, 03:08:56 AM
Has anyone picked one up yet?  Any gut shots?

Davide

#1
August 24, 2005, 08:42:39 AM
Just bought a V-Amp 2 ... not bad.. not bad...

brad

#2
August 24, 2005, 09:24:35 AM
http://www.behringer.com/TO800/index.cfm?lang=ENG

I'm certainly gonna get the new ...er... "Vintage Tube Overdrive"  to mod.

JimRayden

#3
August 24, 2005, 11:13:35 AM
LOFL!!!!!! Now THAT's original!  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

-----------
Jimbo

JimRayden

#4
August 24, 2005, 11:18:50 AM

petemoore

.
#5
August 24, 2005, 11:22:39 AM
http://images.misupply.com/products/original/Boss/21767.jpg
 ...Buuilt like a tank.
 http://www.behringer.com/BO100/BO100_medium.jpg
 ...after a little normal' use it might crank
Convention creates following, following creates convention.

stankyfish

#6
August 24, 2005, 01:34:46 PM
Quote from: JimRaydenhttp://images.misupply.com/products/original/Boss/21767.jpg

http://www.behringer.com/BO100/BO100_medium.jpg

I mean... COME ON!!!! This is so damn rediculous!!!!

Last I heard they were being sued over that.

stumper1

#7
August 24, 2005, 01:35:22 PM
They are all surface mount. Pots are long shafted trimmers mounted directly to the board.  Fairly cheesey plastic case.  I opened one up as soon as they came in at work.  Haven't taken any pictures but could...
Deric®

brad

#8
August 24, 2005, 06:44:59 PM
Quote from: stumper1They are all surface mount. Pots are long shafted trimmers mounted directly to the board.  Fairly cheesey plastic case.  I opened one up as soon as they came in at work.  Haven't taken any pictures but could...

So I'm going to have to get out my magnifying glass then?   Doh!  If I recall, Line6 stomps are SMD, and Jeorge managed to do some mods on the modulation effects to improve their sound quality for the Tsunami Auction.

It will be interesting to see how close these clones are to the originals.

travissk

#9
August 24, 2005, 10:27:54 PM
SMD soldering isn't too bad, though personally if I was going to put a lot of work into a pedal, I'd probably spring the extra $20-30 for a real (used) Boss pedal over the behringer plastic one. I also don't have an assortment of surface-mount resistors, caps, etc, so it's a convenience issue. The price difference does look more attractive as you start moving into the modulation areas, TS-808/9 clones, etc, but quite a few of them aren't worth modding... IMO.

That said, I picked up a used V-Amp 2 my freshman year for practicing and recording, and was pretty satisfied with it. For $20, some of these pedals might be worth the price as-is; I'm interested in a few of them such as the reverb, because I'm betting it's not a Boss clone (Behringer already has reverb algorithms in their other products). I was pretty surprised by the verb quality on the V-Amp and virtualizer rackmount unit.... though the Line6 ToneCore reverb pedal is coming down the line, and I've heard nothing but good things about the DigiVerb... :)

SeanCostello

#10
August 25, 2005, 12:33:54 AM
I want to check out the reverb pedal as well. My guess is that Behringer "borrowed" the reverb from one source or another, but for some reason, that bugs me less than copying the guts of a Tube Screamer or DS-1, simply because it is so much harder to reverse engineer a reverb.

My (informed) guess is more than one company has based their reverbs on the Lexicon 224. This was a TTL design, so the algorithms were essentially hardwired in the architecture, and could be reverse engineered by tracing out the schematic and applying a lot of brainpower.

Hmm...looking at the Behringer reverb box, it does look IDENTICAL to the Boss RV-5. Maybe they did copy the algorithms. If so, they would at least have to reprogram the algorithms - if they just copied the code, that is a copyright violation, and they will get majorly busted. On the other hand, if the Roland algorithms aren't patented, and Behringer reverse engineers the algorithms, Roland can't do much to stop them. Most reverb algorithms aren't patented, with the exception of those at Yamaha and Creative Labs, as they are generally considered industry secrets.

My favorite Behringer story (from someone in the audio industry)*: At the AES show where they introduced their Mackie copy mixers, someone came up to the Behringer booth, looked at their mixer, and said "That is a Mackie mixer." The Behringer rep replied "Well, our mixers do have much of the same functionality as the Mackie mixers." The reply was "No. That is a MACKIE mixer. I can still see the word MACKIE under the paint!"  Apparently Behringer had not completed their "prototype" for the show, and had simply spray painted a Mackie mixer white!!!!!

Now, of course, Behringer's corporate headquarters are located 3 miles down the road from Mackie's headquarters in Washington State. It makes me wonder if Behringer has dug a tunnel under Mackie...

Sean Costello

* I think this is a true story, but it might be along the lines of "and the killer's hook was still attached to the car door!"

brad

#11
August 25, 2005, 01:21:51 AM
I don't really mind about the whole "Behringer Steals Ideas" thing, because it's only natural for a market to seek the most efficient means of production and copy proven ideas.

Berhinger may be cheap, but they're also plastic.
Boss may cost a bit more, but they're also reliable.

Freedom of choice is a wonderful thing.

StephenGiles

#12
August 25, 2005, 08:05:39 AM
Indeed - I'll be in Prague this weekend, so I'll be on the lookout!!
Stephen
"I want my meat burned, like St Joan. Bring me pickles and vicious mustards to pierce the tongue like Cardigan's Lancers.".

-Jk-

#13
August 25, 2005, 08:06:10 AM
I only wonder how good the bypass signal is.

amz-fx

#14
August 25, 2005, 08:22:34 AM
QuoteOn the other hand, if the Roland algorithms aren't patented, and Behringer reverse engineers the algorithms, Roland can't do much to stop them.
Actually, in the USA in the 21st century, that is probably illegal too, under the DMCA.  Reverse-engineering computer code can quickly land them in court...

http://www.chillingeffects.org/reverse/

Let's say I program my reverb code into an Atmel microprocessor and then set the copy-protection bit to prevent anyone from reading the code in the chip.  The copy protection can clearly be circumvented by a technique called "glitching" and the code read from the microprocessor...  once the code has been read, it can be disassembled and analyzed... this would clearly be a violation of the DMCA.  

regards, Jack

jimbob

#15
August 25, 2005, 12:16:16 PM
I bet it wont last very long.
"I think somebody should come up with a way to breed a very large shrimp. That way, you could ride him, then after you camped at night, you could eat him. How about it, science?"

StephenGiles

#16
August 25, 2005, 01:16:53 PM
All very negative...............
Stephen
"I want my meat burned, like St Joan. Bring me pickles and vicious mustards to pierce the tongue like Cardigan's Lancers.".

aaronkessman

#17
August 25, 2005, 03:13:48 PM
i'm not :) i'm happy :)

gotdabluz

#18
August 25, 2005, 10:17:48 PM
Cool! Yugo-Stomps!!!

puretube

#19
September 01, 2005, 06:22:36 AM
I ordered 2 "vintage" Bore*ng*r pedals from one of germany`s largest music stores for educational purposes 2 days ago,
and got this reply yesterday:


[translation]:
"... the B* pedals are not yet deliverable at the moment.
B* currently can`t yet foresee a date of delivery..."

:?:
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