I must resort for help: My circuit doesn't work

Started by Herr Masel, October 08, 2005, 08:17:49 PM

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Herr Masel

It's the ea tremolo from ggg. I triple checked every stage of the way before soldering the smallest part, so I am pretty sure that is not the problem. Two things though: my soldering (or solder spool) might not be top quality, this is only my second effect but I believe I do it decently, even though the board is a mess to look at,, and some wires disconnected, but I think that is the solder, which also melts in a funny way - usually not smooth, sometimes it leaves white or black spots in it... for the most part it is ok and what wasn't I fixed.

First time I plugged it in (with millenium 2) there was no sound at all when the effect was on, but when I turned it off I got the regular guitar signal. I thought it was most likely a problem with the millenium circuit since I was unsure about some stuff - I followed the shcem that put a resistor AFTER the LED which seemed strange, and I used a MOSFET transistor which was really expensive, I don't know if that was a good move. I removed the millenium circuit and used just the switch and board, here there is a lot of repairing done. Basically what I get now is a signal (I can't tell if it is the effect or bypassed) which is very very low volume, when I push the switch there is no signal at all. There is also a grounding problem but I am not sure where it is coming from, all the pots and parts on the board that should be grounded are. Where could it be coming from?

Sorry this was very long, I just measured the voltages where the battery clip is connected to the board, they read fine (around 8.7). What should I do?

KORGULL

1) Double check that you have the transistors oriented correctly. Pinout problems are pretty common with this pedal.

2) You might be making some bad solder joints.

3) Check out the "what to do when it doesn't work" sticky thread. If you post all the necessary voltages, it will be easier to track down the problem.

Herr Masel

My connection is working normally again so here's the schem http://photobucket.com/albums/b134/HerrMasel/?action=view&current=eatrem2_sccopy.gif One thing I noticed when measuring the transistors is that the pinout for Q2 may be wrong. I put what I thought the legs are on the schem (the datasheet didn't have a schematic symbol for the transistor), but now I realize that connecting the drain to the negative side of the capacitor would block current! Am I right? Should I pull out the transistor and connect the gate to the cap, drain to ground and source to the depth pot? I was going to post my reading but when I found this I stopped doing them. If you guys think the transistor is wired correctly I'll post the voltage readings.

Herr Masel

Any thoughts about the Q2? I didn't use a socket so I don't want to be too quick to try a different pinout, this is pretty confusing. Here are the readings for the transistors, connected to the whole circuit (sorry no sockets so I couldn't test them individually). How do you know what voltages you need? I couldn't find it in the datasheets, only combinations of emmiter+base etc.

Q1 - 2n3904:
E - 0.78
C - 6.05
B - 1.32

Q3 - 2n5089 in the schematic this is a 2n5088 but I couldn't get one
E - 0  dead
C - 2.53
B - 0.6

Q2 - 2n5457
G - 0
S - 0
D - 0

Q4 - 2n5457
G - 2.95
S - 5.31
D - 8.74

Well I guess the Q2 and Q3 need replacing, but I posted all the voltages because maybe some of the other ones are bad too? Like I said I don't exactly understand where in the datasheet this is specified. So I guess those loud pops were my transistors, screaming in agony. I will use sockets from now on.

KORGULL

I checked my notes - Q2 is the problem pinout in a lot of cases.
Connect the drain to the cap, source to ground, and gate to depth pot.
The pinout on the ones I have are like the ones in this document: www.muzique.com/lab/trans.gif

Connoisseur of Distortion

Q3 doesn't look like an obvious problem, but i am not sure if the collector should be so low... remember if the pin is directly connected to the ground, it had better show 0 volts with reference to ground  ;)

Q2 looks strange to me. i don't think that it will see much voltage at all in operation (purely my guess) but that it should see a little swing on its gate. Its source is on ground, so don't expect anything... and its drain is blocked off by a capacitor.

Herr Masel

Quote from: KORGULL on October 09, 2005, 02:37:28 PM
Connect the drain to the cap, source to ground, and gate to depth pot.

Damn that's how I connected them, this means that my problem is elsewhere.

Quote from: Connoisseur of Distortion on October 09, 2005, 02:44:28 PM
remember if the pin is directly connected to the ground, it had better show 0 volts with reference to ground  ;)
Q2 looks strange to me. i don't think that it will see much voltage at all in operation (purely my guess) but that it should see a little swing on its gate. Its source is on ground, so don't expect anything... and its drain is blocked off by a capacitor.

Oops good point about the ground. I'd love to be able to jump to those conclusions you made about Q2, I mean to better understand how phsycally and theoretically the components interact and how the circuit operates.

Anyway so assuming for now the problem isn't bad soldering what else could it be? I checked every part before soldering  so many times I'm sure I followed the schematic right. The only difference is that I didn't use the LED and resistor and I used a DPDT.

Herr Masel

#7
Ha! Screw all of that and screw those shakey connections. I resoldered one of the wires on the ouput jack, plugged it in, a little clicking and shorting out (probably more loose wires) but the thing works! Eeexcelent... I hate to be like the dancer that dances poorly and blames the floor for being crooked but this new spool of solder I got really sucks, I've mentioned it before. I think this is the cause of bad connections. Or maybe I need a new tip for the solder, how do I find that out?
So thanks for the help guys, maybe I'll try to add the LED but I don't think worth risking, it's not like this effect is too subtle.

Edit: Sorry question again, searched for it but found nothing. The effect makes a muffled sound when I am not playing, in synch with the throb. It sounds kind of like a heartbeat. There is a fair amount of noise from my pickups but this is caused from the effect. Could it be a ground problem?

Herr Masel

Ok I fixed everything - don't even know how, and now it's time to add a pulsating LED, in sync with the rate.  I was sure I saw something about this before. Where did I see it I ask?