hammond type enclosures

[jrem]

damn, finally got a few of the knock-off hammond type enclosures . . .    it looks like someone took a hammond box, put it on a trace mill, made an aluminum die cast mold from it, and started production.  Then they probably sold the hammond box at list.

can you say "made in China"?

[audioguy]

Where did you get em and how much did they cost???

[jrem]

http://site5.apollohosting.com/pedalpartsplus.com/httpsdocs/oscommerce/product_info.php?cPath=25&products_id=33&osCsid=9d435015f2520f11093eb480fc8ee938

I figured I would give them a try, quick shipping, nice deal.  But for the $2.80 difference I might stick with the Hammond boxes from Mouser.  dunno yet.

[PenPen]

Isn't that the same as what SmallBear carries? The "Taiwanese 'B' Size"? I've used those, and they really aren't that bad. Especially after you sand and polish them.

[jrem]

inside case say's "made in China"  so unless they launched the missles at the island and I didn't hear about it, Taiwain is still Taiwan, right?

I don't know what the Taiwanese boxes state . . .     but like I said, they are exact copies.  I'll measure them for good luck, but damn if they don't look the same right down to the ridge on the lid . . .

[Burton]

Hey there. I'm new to the hobby, but I've been browsing projects, supplies, parts and these boards quite a bit, and im wondering how those enclosures and the 3pdt true bypass switch are so inexpensive.  Don't those switches run from $6 to $15 each?  How are they able to have them for only $4?

[jrem]

google "economies of scale"

[Burton]

I think I follow you.. are you saying that they buy them in bulk and sell them for cheap or something?

[jrem]

most of the small guys, like Aron, and http://www.glitchbuster.com, etc, are probably just buying in bulk to get a decent deal for themselves, then offering the stuff for sale to try and unload the excess inventory.  I think I recall the guy from pedalpartsplus asking about any opportunity to sell powder coated boxes, which is exactly what that site is doing.  So he probably bought buc-o boxes and some other stuff and is just looking to make a run at it.

look at it this way, you can buy a resistor from Mouser for $0.09, or 12 from glitchbuster for $0.60 (or so) or 200 from Mouser for two cents or something . . .    email them and tell them you want to buy 10,000 ammo pack 100 ohm 1/8th watt carbon film (or comp for you mojo folk) and see what the deal is.  It will probably be 1/4 cent per plus shipping . . .

<edit> oh and don't forget if I buy bulk and resell then I am a business and I get tax breaks . . .   

[Burton]

Yeah, the only problem is there's gotta be a demand/market big enough for the product.. or else you're stuck with 10,000 100 ohm 1/8th watt carbon film resistors 

Anyway, how are those "Made in China" boxes, compared to the Hammonds? Any noticeable differences in materials/quality? I'm interested. 

[jrem]

Yeah, the only problem is there's gotta be a demand/market big enough for the product.. or else you're stuck with 10,000 100 ohm 1/8th watt carbon film resistors 

welcome to the world of business

Anyway, how are those "Made in China" boxes, compared to the Hammonds? Any noticeable differences in materials/quality? I'm interested. 

dunno, haven't drilled and painted any yet, but I bet there just like the real deal, judging from other China rips . . .

[cab42]

Yeah, the only problem is there's gotta be a demand/market big enough for the product.. or else you're stuck with 10,000 100 ohm 1/8th watt carbon film resistors 

Hey, what's the problem with 10.000 100 ohm's? You just connect them in series and then you have a perfect replacement for a 1M resistor.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Carsten

[Mark Hammer]

Hey there. I'm new to the hobby, but I've been browsing projects, supplies, parts and these boards quite a bit, and im wondering how those enclosures and the 3pdt true bypass switch are so inexpensive.  Don't those switches run from $6 to $15 each?  How are they able to have them for only $4?

I've been buying X-wing DPDT stompswitches in Canada for $3.75 - $3.95 for 5 years now.  They likely do not have the same MTBF (mean time between failure) specs as costlier ones or hold up as well to soldering heat (there's plastic and there's bakelite), and may be manufactured to looser tolerances, but they work fine for a tinkerer like me, and quite frankly I'll never notice the difference I I live another 25 years.  The price listed is what they cost, plain and simple.  No tricks, no wizardry.  Just remember they are NOT heavy duty switches.

[Garrett]

Anyway, how are those "Made in China" boxes, compared to the Hammonds? Any noticeable differences in materials/quality? I'm interested. 

I've been using them for a while now and I see no differences in material as far as drilling/tooling/painting. The enclosure surface is just as smooth as a hammond. The sizes are little different I think.

Garrock

[robbiemcm]

Mmmm, we did that in economics this year. Economies of scale, the good old mass production equals lower average cost. Diseconomies of scale is more interesting, although we barely covered both topics, this being when a firm expands to the point when its harder to coordinate the factors of production.

[jrem]

well there are internal and external economies, right?  so "dis-economies" would really be the limit of internal economies . . .  or where the slope goes horizontal.    Economics is like reading a transistor data sheet . . .    but now we're OT . . .

[jrem]

Okay, I measured both boxes, here are my results:

http://jrem.webhop.org/stuff/hammond_vs_nsc

so much for intelectual property.

[cd]

Okay, I measured both boxes, here are my results:

http://jrem.webhop.org/stuff/hammond_vs_nsc

so much for intelectual property.

The "Taiwanese" boxes are really made in China.  See smallbear's pic, same NSC box:

http://www.smallbearelec.com/Detail.bok?no=50

LOL is it just me or is the most interesting thing the T1000SE laptop at the end   I had one of those back in the day.  Man, the hours I wasted on that thing...

[PenPen]

Okay, I measured both boxes, here are my results:

http://jrem.webhop.org/stuff/hammond_vs_nsc

so much for intelectual property.

Uhmm, intellectual property? Its a box. There's only a handful of ways to put a box together. And on your site you even show they are not the same in deminsions.

Honestly, I don't agree with your assumption that they simply 'copied' a Hammond. There are several differences that you pointed out there. Looks to me like they saw a demand for a box in that general size, and made one. Why do you assume it was 'scanned and digitized' and churned out? Because it is Chinese?

[jrem]

And on your site you even show they are not the same in deminsions.

actually, what I show is that they are the same dimensions.  When you make a mold you need to allow for shrinkage, so some tolerance variation is inevitable.  I would imaging that I could grab two Hammond boxes, and if the mold number inside is different, there will be a difference in dimensions, it's called "manufacturing tolerance" and the % variation is on a print some where, for sure.

Honestly, I don't agree with your assumption that they simply 'copied' a Hammond. There are several differences that you pointed out there.

you are allowed to believe whatever you want, but I know something about machining and toolmaking, and I'm here to tell you that those boxes are an exact rip-off.  They didn't bother trying to hide it, they are carbon-copy copies.

Looks to me like they saw a demand for a box in that general size, and made one.

not one, more like tens of thousands.

Why do you assume it was 'scanned and digitized' and churned out? Because it is Chinese?

Because that is the technology that is used to reverse engineer mechanical components.  And the Chinese start with easy stuff, then move on to more difficult processes.  I remember when Chinese cutters (end mills) were cheap and we wouldn't bother with them, then one day they were cheap and held up.  That was 1992 or so and we could see it coming.

Japan knows it's a problem, too, they are seeing the same thing.  They're copying machinery parts, machinery, anything they can get their hands on.  And they turn out more engineers that we turn out lawyers (needless to say we turn out more lawyers than engineers . . .)

Go get a book called "the world is flat" by Thomas Friedman.  I don't necessarily care for his left-wing slant, but he pretty much hits the nail on the head regarding the world economy.

Rant switch off, you may now feel free to move about the cabin.