Working on my first ever vero layout.... *sigh*

[Xavier]

Argh........ not easy at all. As soon as I have 7-8 components things begin to look ugly and I start mixing traces. Any old thread about vero 101? Is there any software other than the MS paint I can use? any advice or rule of thumb to follow?

BTW my first contribution *is expected to be* the MXR noise gate, as you guys build a lot of distortion pedals but nobody seems to care about the background noise

2x LM741 opamps, 3 trannies, not many parts really, but I get lost soon...

[troubledtom]

go to search and type in...........    vero how to    ...........
http://www.diystompboxes.com/smfforum/index.php?topic=34726.0
that mey help too
    peace,
        - tom

[MartyMart]

Here's what I do :
Schem in front of you, try to "see" all the connections/nodes and picture the
opamps, leave room for all the connections around them.
I keep 9v rail at top of board, ground at bottom, so decide how many "strips"
you need .... for the mxr I'd say 12-14 strips high and about 22 -26 "holes" wide.
A drawing ( rough ) before you cut the board helps, dont worry if it's a bit big
too small is a bummer !!
Some parts can share traces easily, like all the "grounded" parts, place things into
the board and make/mark any "cuts" as you go, then you wont get lost !
Use a sharpie and also mark in/out/9v/ground/Vref on the top of the board, so when
you come back a week later, you can "see" where everything goes ...

MM.

[lowstar]

i use a proggy, for instance "lochmaster" (this is german)
i start with 9v and ground up/down respectively (and op-amp voltages if there are any) further apart than they have to be, then when i get closer to the end, i try to shrink everything and turn the direction to the left sometimes, cause usually i end up with much space in the middle/left top area of the vero.
the shrinking is so much easier when you use layout software, and the "testing features" help to spot the first mistakes. (i always make some!)
cheers,
lowstar

[Toney]

My approach is to try to think in blocks around each active component.
Break it down into the basic blocks and than think about where the connections are between them.
Orientate the blocks on the vero in the best order, try all your options till you've got the best combo and you can start filling in the gaps.
So you've got two op amps and three trannies....  get a sheet of paper and and shuffle them around for the best order keeping in mind the interconnctions between them.
Like a lot of things, just getting on and doing it is the best learning curve.....
Good luck

[TheBigMan]

I don't bother about keeping ground and 9V traces miles apart, in fact I prefer them close together because many circuits have filtering caps and polarity protection diodes and circuits with opamps require a voltage divider mostly.  I start with the schem and draw it onto a stripboard template on paper working from left to right.  I would also suggest trying a few less complex circuits, perhaps some that have already been done by other people, and then comparing differences and seeing what you've done better and what the other guy has done better.  In circuits with an opamp or similar I usually start with the chip and work my way outwards rather than going input to output, especially if it's a dual opamp.

One thing to watch is capacitor lead spacing.  I tend to put mid valued caps in at the size of a box film cap, because many people use them and a ceramic or mylar etc can easily fit in whereas films often have very short leads.  Pot connections are generally at the edge of a board but this is not a "must". 

[MartyMart]

I don't bother about keeping ground and 9V traces miles apart, in fact I prefer them close together because many circuits have filtering caps and polarity protection diodes and circuits with opamps require a voltage divider mostly.   

I run a nice thick lead ( from say a big mica cap or 1N4001 ) from PSU filter cap etc down to ground.
I just seem to get zero "noise" problems with 9v/ground quite separated  .. ?
Also, some of my vero has quite "tiny" separation spaces between strips !
MM

[seanm]

I run a nice thick lead ( from say a big mica cap or 1N4001 ) from PSU filter cap etc down to ground.
I just seem to get zero "noise" problems with 9v/ground quite separated  .. ?
Also, some of my vero has quite "tiny" separation spaces between strips !
MM

I also have no noise problems with 9V/ground separated. I think what TheBigMan meant was that he likes them close so he can easily run components between vcc and ground. I tend to have to put at least one jumper to get a component to straddle vcc and ground.

With transistors, having vcc and ground separated really helps. Run one resistor each way from base to vcc and ground. Then the resistors from collector and emitter can tuck right up each way. The tranny and four resistors only take 3 lines!

[d95err]

2x LM741 opamps, 3 trannies, not many parts really, but I get lost soon...

2 opamps and 3 transistors is bigger than almost any other vero layout you'll find around here. Bigger than e.g. most of Torchy's layouts, bigger than most Runoffgroove projects...

My first own vero layout (that worked) was a millennium bypass. Thats about 4 parts alltogether. Better to do something really simple that works than something big that doesn't. I would recommend starting with a one-transistor booster, then perhaps a one-opamp overdrive.

[MartyMart]

Yes, I guess that for the first few, smaller is better
The largest build I've done ( that works ) is the Boss AC-2 clone, 4X dual op amps
and about 100 components  !!

MM.

[seanm]

Just a thought. I found for opamp based circuits rather than get a veroboard, you can get boards that look like a breadboard. Then you just breadboard the circuit, get it working and solder to the breadboard look-alike. There are usually limitations, like only one vcc or ground line per edge rather than two. But still an easy way to build a circuit.

I built the first B.Blender that way.

[Xavier]

I said I was going to draw it and that's what I'm doing .It's going to work, I know, I know, rraaaaaaahhh !! ggetting on my nerves.......



Actually I've drawn approx 1/3 of the circuit. Using photoshop, I've placed the opamps first as you adviced, and work around them. The layout is going to look kind of weird, but I expect to finish it in a short time.

Thanks for all the advice

[finkfloyd]

Hi,

I recently found a nice piece of software called Stripboard Magic which is abondonware, the company went bust years ago.
You can add your own custom components, it will autosize to the vero layout, ensuring maximum spacesaving.

Just draw out your schematic, and see it processed as a veroboard layout.

Download it from here :

http://web.onetel.net.uk/~stuorguk/StripboardMagic.zip

[TheBigMan]

I run a nice thick lead ( from say a big mica cap or 1N4001 ) from PSU filter cap etc down to ground.
I just seem to get zero "noise" problems with 9v/ground quite separated  .. ?
Also, some of my vero has quite "tiny" separation spaces between strips !
MM

I also have no noise problems with 9V/ground separated. I think what TheBigMan meant was that he likes them close so he can easily run components between vcc and ground. I tend to have to put at least one jumper to get a component to straddle vcc and ground.

With transistors, having vcc and ground separated really helps. Run one resistor each way from base to vcc and ground. Then the resistors from collector and emitter can tuck right up each way. The tranny and four resistors only take 3 lines!

Yeah, that was what I meant but you put it better.