High Gain Metal Pedal?

Started by SECONDandBOWERY, May 03, 2006, 07:02:14 PM

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Connoisseur of Distortion

I wanted to pitch in and say that a BSIAB is not very high gain... it has some great sounds, but it certainly doesn't have heaps of drive.

that said...

the Dr. Boogey is a great pedal, but it will take methodical layout and neat lead dress to keep the noise level acceptably low. but if you're willing to do it, don't let me get you down!

Paul Marossy

Quotethe Dr. Boogey is a great pedal, but it will take methodical layout and neat lead dress to keep the noise level acceptably low

True. The Dr. Boogey is a great sounding one as well. I love mine!  :icon_wink:

SECONDandBOWERY

Quote from: Paul Marossy on May 04, 2006, 12:20:22 PM
What about a RAT? That can make some pretty nasty tones...

I've actually considered a Rat.  Of all the Davisson pedals, what is the most palm-mute friendly, and how does it compare to the Rat?

Rock'n'Roll,
--Andy

Paul Marossy

I do know that a lot of cats have used the RAT for some heavy sounds...  :icon_cool:

SECONDandBOWERY

Quote from: Paul Marossy on May 04, 2006, 01:27:11 PM
I do know that a lot of cats have used the RAT for some heavy sounds...  :icon_cool:

Maybe I'll just build a Rat then.  http://www.tonepad.com has a nice looking layout, and I have always want to build a Rat and call it Rat Fink and put lots of Fink pictures on it.

Rock'n'Roll,
--Andy

Mark Hammer

The Rat is a decent pedal, and loud as those neighbours you swore you'd call the cops on one of these days. If it means anything, Scott Ian from Anthrax was very fond of it for a while.

Paul Marossy

QuoteIf it means anything, Scott Ian from Anthrax was very fond of it for a while.

I rest my case!  :icon_lol:

SECONDandBOWERY

Quote from: Mark Hammer on May 04, 2006, 01:55:22 PM
If it means anything, Scott Ian from Anthrax was very fond of it for a while.

I think that means something.  I love Anthrax.  Of course, a lot of the sound, as bwanasonic said, is decided by things other than the pedal, but at least the Rat will get me in neighborhood.

The Rat it is!

Rock'n'Roll,
--Andy

RDV

Build a rat, but buy the $15.00 Danelectro Fab-Metal. It's amazing. Beyond shred.

RDV

WGTP

#29
If you look at the Rat and the AMZ Pro, you will see some similarities.  I think there were some folks modifying the tone stack when the Pro came out (it shoulding be too hard to reduce fizzies), might check for mods in the archive.  Both are very cool.  Doug Hammond's Sweet 16 is like a BSIAB, but with a big mid notch and more gain.   :icon_cool:
Stomping Out Sparks & Flames

Paul Marossy

Quotebuy the $15.00 Danelectro Fab-Metal. It's amazing. Beyond shred.

I need to get one of those to try out for fun - hey, it's cheap! Anyone ever whip up a schematic for it? Just curious as to what it might look like...

RDV

PM:

Clay jones did one and sent it to me but there are no values. I can tell you though that it's a lot like a Metal Zone but instead of the gyrator sections being tied to tone controls they're preset. The tone control is a bit BMP-ish in it's funtion. I use mine toward the bass end as the treble end is super fizzy. It's quite a pedal overall though.

RDV

WGTP

Heck, 1 strategically placed cap of the correct value can help with the fizzies. I guess you could wire it from the ouptut to ground on the Jack... :icon_cool:
Stomping Out Sparks & Flames

Mark Hammer

Except that "taming the fizzies" via a jack-aded component also "dulls the cleanies". :icon_frown:

phaeton

#34
Here I was, thinking I could do some shameless plug for a pretty simple, high gain device.  It relies on the amp for treb/mid/bass shaping, though.

Oh well.

Mark-

Was Ian using the Rat on Spreading the Disease?  I thought I'd read (back in 1988 i think :o ) that by the time they got to Among The Living they were just cranking the hell out of their Boogies (the ones with the camoflauged 4x12 celestion cabs) and that was it.

Maiden, Metallica and Megadeth had more interesting guitar work IMHO, but Anthrax probably had the hugest, heaviest guitar sound out of everything i ever used to listen to.  In fact, a great deal of me even picking up a guitar in the first place was to find out "what the hell is that CHUNG CHUNG CHUNG sound coming from?" on the intro to the song Among The Living.

:icon_mrgreen:
Stark Raving Mad Scientist

PenPen

Two cranked Rats chained together will give you enough gain to put hair on your back. I'm breadboarding a clone and last night was comparing it to my stock Rat, when I turned them both on it sounded like my guitar came alive, growling at me. Build one with a BMP style tone control for a mid scoop and you have your shred metal tone right there.

Paul Marossy

QuoteI can tell you though that it's a lot like a Metal Zone but instead of the gyrator sections being tied to tone controls they're preset. The tone control is a bit BMP-ish in it's funtion. I use mine toward the bass end as the treble end is super fizzy. It's quite a pedal overall though.

I was wondering if it was something like a Metal Zone.  :icon_cool:

WGTP

Good point Mark, do these things use standard size diodes that could be found?   :icon_cool:
Stomping Out Sparks & Flames

Mark Hammer

Phaeton,

I'm not a big metal fan, and I think the last thing I read about Anthrax was something I stumbled across in Guitar Player shortly after I saw them appear on Morton Downey Jr., which is going back quite a ways.  So, I couldn't tell you anything about what they may or may not have used a Rat for.  All I know was that he spoke highly of it at the time.

I will still put in a plug for the Superfuzz midscoop filter.  Indeed, an arrangement that let you swap between that midscoop and the stock Rat filter, would provide a really broad range of voices.  Compared to a lot of pedals, the Rat keeps all or most of the bottom (likely responsible for your CHUNG-CHUNG-CHUNG comments) .  Inserting a midscoop filter (after the clipping diodes and before the output FET) would make that bottom monstrous.  Just note that the midscoop will likely bleed more signal to ground that the standard variable lowpass fitler does, so there would be a volume level change when going from the one to the other.

WGTP,
Just regular old silicon signal diodes.

PenPen,
Note that, somewhat like the TS-9, placing the gain control in the feedback loop means that as gain is increased, treble is cut back.  I'm using a 100k pot, rather than the 150k unit which is supposedly stock.  I notice the slight reduction in treble, although it's not huge.  I suspect the bandwidth restriction that comes with gain may be more a product of the compensation cap than the 100pf feedback cap, but the basic point is that one actually gets more treble (though less growl and obvious fuzz) at lower gain settings.  Running two in series (you are a sick, sick man, my friend) may work out better if one is set for only modest gain, but high output.

Note as well Jack Orman's suggestion to use a 3300pf tone cap instead of the stock 200pf if the tfilter control is not muting enough for your tastes.

WGTP

http://aronnelson.com/gallery/WGTP/BassBoostNotch?full=1

Here is a mid-notch filter I use based on Marks suggestion.  10K resistors with a .0047uf & .047uf caps get you around 13db of cut at around 1KHz.  I don't usually use that much myself.   :icon_cool:
Stomping Out Sparks & Flames