Russian Small Stone bypassing changes sound - true bypass?

[Mann]

I just tested my russian version of small stone and noticed that bypassed sound was different compared to the sound straight to the amp.
I don't know how old the effect is (2-4 years) but is it not true bypassed? I didn't open the thing so I'm asking here...

[Mark Hammer]

Plug a 20ft cable to your pedal.  Plug another 20ft cable to your amp.  Listen to the effect.  Now "true bypass".  Now take that first 20ft cable and plug it directly into your amp.

There is a very good chance you will be able to hear a difference between the "true bypass" and plugging in directly.  Why?  because 40ft of cable, if not buffered in any way, will roll off more highs than 20ft of cable.

This is what a lot of old farts here, and other old farts like Pete Cornish, have been trying to get across to people.  Yes, true bypass provides the least coloration of a signal when the effect is disengaged, but there is this other "effect" called a cable that one always needs to compensate for.  If there is an appropriate buffer stage somewhere early in the signal path, that always remains in circuit, then cable will be less of an issue, and true bypass of things after that buffer will be equivalent to plugging in directly.  If there is no buffering anywhere, then true bypass simply turns all those patch cables into one long hunk of cable capacitance, which WILL sound different.

I strongly recommend to people to plug their guitar into the amp via the shortest patch cable they have (e.g., one of those cheap 8" things with the molded right-angle plugs), and then plug in to the amp via the longest combination of cables they are likely to use (e.g., a pair of 25ft cables linked by a TB pedal).  The sonic diference between those two sounds, is what you lose by not buffering.

[PenPen]

I've been trying to tell people this after reading Cornish's article on it, and no one wants to really believe it. When I see the phrase "true bypass" anymore it just makes me cringe. People just don't want to believe that it ISN'T the greatest thing ever.

[Mann]

I found the topics about true bypass. I tested the effect with madamp 15w tube amp and the cords were 1,5 and 2 meters long. It all started when I wanted to compare an old Schaller Rotorsound and Small Stone and ofcourse I did something else than comparing.
I have to record some sounds with the effect bypassed and without it. I still haven't opened the effect.

[Mark Hammer]

Possible, then, that the unit uses an "old-fashioned" switching arrangement, whereby only the output is switched, not the input as well.  This would result in some loading of the input in bypass mode.  I'm not saying that is what necessarily is taking place in your case, but that it was a regular feature of many "vintage" pedals (including E-H's) and may well have been part of one or more Russian issues.  But I'm just guessing here.  Is there a status LED on it?  If so, that needs an extra set of contacts (hence the emergence of 3PDT switches.  If there is only a DPDT in there, then maybe is uses one set of contacts for an LED and the other for switching only the output.

[Mann]

I just opened the effect and there is a normal dpdt switch and it has a led indicator.

[Mark Hammer]

So, it would seem your choice is either to forego the LED and re-assign the second set of contacts to bypassing the input (likely to yield a volume difference, though), or to replace the DPDT with a 3PDT, or to install a retrofit input buffer to reduce loading when using the output-only switching style bypass.  Info about this can be found at GEOFEX in the article on how to stop tone-sucking in wahs (where SPDT switches were also used for output-only switching).

[cd]

So, it would seem your choice is either to forego the LED and re-assign the second set of contacts to bypassing the input (likely to yield a volume difference, though), or to replace the DPDT with a 3PDT, or to install a retrofit input buffer to reduce loading when using the output-only switching style bypass.  Info about this can be found at GEOFEX in the article on how to stop tone-sucking in wahs (where SPDT switches were also used for output-only switching).

AHEM or of course, install a Millenium Bypass with the stock DPDT, info on which can also be found on GEOFEX