looking for ultra simple leslie-effect type circuit

[guitarleeman]

Im looking for a super simple circuit that produces leslie type effects that uses transistors or 1 or 2 op-amps. I am aware of the 1970 Simonton project and Ive tried to download the Rolls rotary effect schematic. I think thats on Hammer's site but I cant get it to download. I would like to see a simple circuit to build with few parts.

[Mark Hammer]

1) Fast or slow or both?
2) Athentic sounding or just somewhere in the neighbourhood?

Note that the Uni-vibe was originally the Shin-Ei Resly-Tone, which a great many of us here sincerely believe to have been named (mispronunciation intact) as a Leslie-Simulator.  That points you to any Uni-Vibe workalike as your quickest path.  Note that none of these have a ramp-up/ramp-down LFO.

[Doug_H]

I would suspect "simple" and "worth building" are mutually exclusive in this particular case.

[Mark Hammer]

Yes and no.  Which is why I asked about speed and authenticity.  Satisfying bubbly "fast Leslie" sounds are much easier to achieve than slow throb-type sounds.  If that's what a person wants, then maybe a simple circuit like the Phozer does what the person wants.  If they want the slow chime that you and I can get on our Roto-Machines in analog form, well there's gonna be some serious shopping and perfing involved, and a whole lot of patience.  Again, the range of what people mentally lump under the global heading of "Leslie effects" (for better or for worse) is quite large and diverse.

[Meanderthal]

 I get the impression that a lot of the older modulation effects had this goal in mind.(The Resly thing cracked me up! Never thought of that!) I have yet to hear anything accurately recreate the whole leslie thing, however.

This is one of those things that bug me to the point of frustration, and I can't really think of a way to get there without going in the direction of dolby 5.1 or quadraphonic, maybe tri-phonic... Naaa... nevermind, that's just nuts and best left to software designers. You'd need pink floyd's pa setup. And that's just the 3d(spatial) part.

And then there's the whole doppler thing... ? Vibrato? Sort of.

And to recreate the transition between slow and fast... well, there's the rotovibe... sort of. Or maybe just transfer the speed pot on a modulation effect to a wah shell.

The tone... another thing entirely. Probably the easiest thing to emulate- a good parametric eq can come close, with patient tweaking.

Now to combine all these things in a single pedal... would take a much smarter and more patient man than me!

  Damn, this is a hard one! I'd like one of THOSE  pedals myself! It seems to me that actually building a Leslie from scratch would be easier. Or not selling the one you had to begin with(SOMEBODY SMACK ME!)

The simplest err... Leslie type effect would be a tremolo capable of triangle waves... The Univibe(a cool phaser) is closer...but more complex.

  Ugh. I'll shut up now...

[trevize]

i had very good results with my phase 45 with vibrato mod + univibe cap ratio.

[KMS]

If you want an easy to build ...there is an old schematic...over on GGG.  I can't remember the name.  But it works with grain of wheat light bulbs and LDRs using one LFO to vary the speed of both tremolo and treble/bass simultaneously.

That's all the schematic does.....I would bet it sounds pretty good, but will not give a chorus sound, or a vibrato sound, or the slightly distorted and ever-changing re verb (some call the Doppler sound).

The GGG link
http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=130&Itemid=148


Another idea I have wanted to try;
Just get a small amp combo (say 15 watts) that has a +/- 15V supply to the power rails in the circuit and hook it up to two 12V batteries (you can do a little search on GEO for bipolar PS and figure out how to wire the +/- to the circuit rails in the amp).  +/-12V will be enough to keep the +/-15V amp going.  Then a battery operated Wireless Receiver to the input of the amp.  Then mount the entire rig including batteries to a rotating table with a variable speed motor/pulley that you could build.  Then play with your wireless transmitter to the completely wireless rig.

Not a simulator....it is the real thing and each section is individually  easy to build, however, the entire project would be a lot of work (not complicated just time consuming and cost much more than any fake simulator which will never replace the original sound).

I have also heard of a 8 mics set around a speaker in a 360 circle and them some circuit that rotates the mic selection.

[puretube]

nice discussion here... 

[Meanderthal]

 Hey, I do have an old Wurlitzer sitting in the garage. It.s in really good shape and everything works fine, but it just sounds boring(tone generators I guess. It ain't a hammond!) I opened the back and there are things that spin in there. It never had anything like the grind and honk of a leslie, but it throws the sound around pretty good.
Has anyone rehoused the wierd mess inside one of these? I didn't spend much time trying to figure out how- it's all vertical and horizontal and angles and looked like an engineering challenge, but it would be maybe fun to try and if it works out might make a nice leslie-ish cab...
?
 

[Meanderthal]

 Oh jeeze - been reading that HC thread... chaos! But this one really cracked me up-

"(1) Turn Lesie No.1 ON and turn the rotors ON.

(2) Turn Leslie No. 2 ON and turn the rotors ON.

(3) NOW lift Leslie 2 over your shoulders and run in circles around Leslie Number 1. Set 4 Omni-patterned microphones around the whole area to catch the resulting sound."

[Dave_B]

Has anyone rehoused the wierd mess inside one of these? I didn't spend much time trying to figure out how- it's all vertical and horizontal and angles and looked like an engineering challenge, but it would be maybe fun to try and if it works out might make a nice leslie-ish cab...

That's a pretty common thing to do.  Check out the "DIY Links" on our Wiki.  http://www.diystompboxes.com/wiki/index.php?title=Leslie

You can look for "Leslie Speaker" on ebay and usually find at least a few of these that have been pulled.

[B Tremblay]

If that's what a person wants, then maybe a simple circuit like the Phozer does what the person wants.

Just to clarify, the simple Phozer to which Mark refers is the older version.  The recently released updated version can't really be described as simple anymore.

[petemoore]

It seems to me that actually building a Leslie from scratch would be easier.
 Setting it up and moving it in addition to a guitar amp isn't though...I made leslies, that had the super slow, 33.3 rpm, and 78 rpm settings...kind of a fun days woodworking and Phonograph modding project, sounded superb W/Greenbacks in them / as a less versatile leslie...no quick speed ramps or braking...but the 'dual' leslie team...pretty cool...
 "(1) Turn Lesie No.1 ON and turn the rotors ON.

(2) Turn Leslie No. 2 ON and turn the rotors ON.

(3) NOW lift Leslie 2 over your shoulders and run in circles around Leslie Number 1. Set 4 Omni-patterned microphones around the whole area to catch the resulting sound."  
 This cracks me up, and reminds me of my first 'leslie'...I tied the speakers wire to it's frame, hung the speaker from the ceiling...and spun it...sounds 'daffy' eh?...ez nuff and works.
 I also made a 'contact' leslie, the speaker connections made through the 'center pin' of a phonograph: a 1/4'' phono plug w/automotive points gripping the sleeve, and a contact sprung to the tip...BION [I didn't think it'd work] it worked just fine...high frequencies only from two horns mounted on the phono platter using two upright plywood squares.
 Someone's selling a 5'' speaker leslie, has a mic...a miniature scale leslie w/mic. ..probably doesn't do sounds like a leslie in a room.
 

[Meanderthal]

 Thanks for the link Dave_B! Some cool stuff there.

I guess I wasn't specific enough with my question though. Dyslexia can be a bitch that way- translating concepts into words is harder for me than most people. It's gotten me in a lot of trouble over the years. This is also a problem for me the other way around- words to concepts. I'm just glad that you folks don't jump all over anyone who has trouble communicating...

I'm aware that organ guts have been hehoused, especially hammonds and thomases, I was more  wondering if anyone 'round here had done that with the bizarre looking stuff inside a wurly... no biggie, though, I'll never have the time to actually do all the stuff I ask stupid questions about anyway.

Interesting idea with the turntables, pete!

[Ge_Whiz]

Cheap flanger + EQ.

[Mark Hammer]

If that's what a person wants, then maybe a simple circuit like the Phozer does what the person wants.

Just to clarify, the simple Phozer to which Mark refers is the older version.  The recently released updated version can't really be described as simple anymore.

Boy, I'll say!  I hadn't noticed that it had been upgraded.  Sounds great!

Like the Bass Balls and the Bi-Filter Follower, varying the balance between filter sections can produce some interesting sounds quite easily.  replace the pair of 27k resistors just before the output with a pair of 15k resistors and a 25k linear pot (side lugs to 15 coming from filters, wiper to 100nf output cap), and away you go.

[puretube]

hey, Pete: click this...

[petemoore]

  That's the other way....lol...just spinning it had it's limitations...ie you had to use both hands to push in a symmetric way to get a nice spin on it, or one hand more slowly accellerating it against it's own hanging weight.
  I read enough to get the idea of orbiting, swinging and rotating...lol...stand back everyone...the speaker is now a ghosts punching bag !! ...and doppler etc. effect...pretty dern wakki-cool !
  looks like he put a neat trick in the wire and rotation/orbit system, I wonder how much diddling it'd take on each unit [or perfection to attain good movement every time on production #'s].
  The speaker connections for such a device is where I'd be concerned, a leslies horn uses a rotator contact system IIRC..as soon as a wire is connected to a moving item, it'd better be the right kind of wire, and still is a source for long term continuity concerns [I would think].
  The spinning cabinet has it's advantages, but I woudln't want to operate it near small children or pets without a big cage on it.

[puretube]

hah! - how about spinning the audience?  (around fixed speakerz)
[just jokin`...]

[Mark Hammer]

I attended a concert of a percussion piece by Iannis Xennakis in 1973 or 74 in which 6 percussionists with full kits were stationed around the audience (everyone had to move downstairs from the balcony) at 60-degree arcs.  Percussionists situated diagonally from each other generally played the same content on the same percussion instruments.  The music was written so that at some points the six percussionists produced a virtual "propeller" that went around and around, as pairs of percussionists traded riffs and passed off to each other in rapid succession.  At other times, the percussionists would take turns so that the music moved around the perimeter of the room.

If I may be so pedantic, it was, in a word or two, pretty nifty stuff.  I guess eventhe serious composers were listening to Pink Floyd in those days!