More Red Llama Cap issues

[Austin73]

Paul, (or anyone else)

Just got my 330uF caps in the post oops they are very big! too big to put in the circuit (Dam Ebay! although was a job lot so can't complain about the other stuff)

Any chance they could be subbed for 220uF or 470uF?

Any help gratefully recieved

Aus

[MikeH]

I believe you're referring to the polarized cap that connects between the ground and the power supply?  It's just filtering a little noise and keeping the current steady when the battery gets low.  You could substitute either value there and it should be fine.  The CD4049UBE has a pretty high current draw, so you might want to go with the 470uf (because you'll be dealing with a lot of dying batteries), but I don't know that it will make any difference.

[Mark Hammer]

Neither 220uf nor 470uf should change the performance of the circuit audibly.

[gez]

The CD4049UBE has a pretty high current draw, so you might want to go with the 470uf (because you'll be dealing with a lot of dying batteries), but I don't know that it will make any difference.

That's true of inverters run off a 9V battery, but (as can be seen in data sheets) current consumption drops dramatically as supply voltage is lowered, especially around the 5V mark.  If I recall, the Lama has a current limiting resistor to the Vdd pin of the 4049 chip, which drops a few volts supply so that the chip operates around the 5V mark.  Apologies if this isn't the case (hazy memory)

[MikeH]

That could very well be the case; (I built one a while back, but my memory of it is hazy too).  Either way, I'd build it with a DC jack, just in case it eats through batteries like crazy.

[Austin73]

Cheers Chaps, Thought it wouldn't matter just needed to check. God I learn so much new stuff here might have to change my job! ha ha

Aus

[Mark Hammer]

I happily run my 4049-powered stuff (including a Hot Tubes clone I've had for over 25 years) off 9v batteries for hours and hours, though not hours on end.  Never had an issue.

[Austin73]

Not going to be an isuue for me as I don't run my pedals on batteries anymore, couldn't afford to! But thanks to everyone for the info, very informative.

Cheers

Aus

[markm]

For whatever it's worth, I raised the same question on here back about 6 months ago and the man himself, Mr. Huge answered my post by saying the 470uF was fine.
If you do a search you should be able to find the post here easily.

[Austin73]

Cheers Mark, I put 470uF in just waiting on pots and I'll be up and running. Is there really a Mr Huge? Wow cool name! lol Will post a review of circuit when all finished

Cheers for evreyones help

Aus

[audioguy]

At one point Mr Huge said that anything over 100uf would work in place of that often over sized 330uf. I recent built one with a 220uf and sounds great.

[MikeH]

As long as everyone who's built a WH Red Llama is chiming in; has anyone had any problems getting enough volume out of theirs?  It seems like mine is just barely above line level with the volume cranked.  I'd like to get a little more out of it.  I've already tried swapping out the pot.

[hairyandy]

As long as everyone who's built a WH Red Llama is chiming in; has anyone had any problems getting enough volume out of theirs?  It seems like mine is just barely above line level with the volume cranked.  I'd like to get a little more out of it.  I've already tried swapping out the pot.

I think something might be wrong because mine is slammin' loud.  Nice and crunchy too!

Andy

[gez]

Mike, link to the schematic and you'll get some pointers as to what might be wrong/where to look.

[markm]

As long as everyone who's built a WH Red Llama is chiming in; has anyone had any problems getting enough volume out of theirs?  It seems like mine is just barely above line level with the volume cranked.  I'd like to get a little more out of it.  I've already tried swapping out the pot.

What did you use for a layout/schem?

[MikeH]

I used the vero layout in the Dragonfly album.  Which I compared against a schematic I found somewhere on here as well.  It was the "Tube Sound Riding a Llama Schematic".  I did make one change to the design, I added some clipping diodes (suggested by Brian Wampler) between pins 2 and 3 to smooth out the clipping.  I think I used 4148s.  That probably has something to do with the drop in volume.  Maybe I'll try it without the extra diodes, or with something like germaniums that doesn't cut as much of the signal.  It sounds totally awesome, just not "extra loud".

[Seljer]

germaniums cut off more of the signal, you want to use multiple diodes in series or something like LEDs if you want to have less volume loss from clipping

[Mark Hammer]

EDIT: Post removed due to erroneous logic.

[gez]

I thought this circuit was a CMOS one, not a diode clipper?

[Mark Hammer]

And you would be correct in that assumption.  That is not to say that diodes could not be added on the output, though.  There are a number of pedals that provide slightly dirty boost and dirty it up some more with diodes: Dist+, Bosstone, Superfuzz, etc.  For me the question is whether such diodes would subvert the natural qualities of the 4049, and my sense is "yes".  It sounds great as is, and diodes are best located in another pedal of some kind.

On the other hand, with such a hefty output, that buys you the option of sticking things with passive loss on the output since you can well afford SOME loss.  A Marshall/Fender tonestack, or a variable scoop would both be interesting add-ons and not introduce excessive penalty as far as level goes.  You should still be able to push the input of your amp even with the signal bleed-off.