12v instead of 9v

[anti-idiot]

if i want to use 12v instead of 9v on a Distortion+, MicroAmp, Crybaby Wah and a DOD250 (yeah, the 4 of 'em), should i need to change anything? I'm using 1/4w resistors an ceramic caps electro caps are (i think) 16v. does the transistors and op amps need to be changed or something?

[ambulancevoice]

ids check data sheets on the ic's to see if they can handle 12v
just google for example "lm308" and look for the pdf datasheet

if there all good, then there really shouldnt be a problem

i use all my pedals (usually 7 at a time, thats how many my daisy chain can power) on 12v
no problems

[anti-idiot]

ids check data sheets on the ic's to see if they can handle 12v
just google for example "lm308" and look for the pdf datasheet

if there all good, then there really shouldnt be a problem

ok, that with the D+/uA/250, so everything's ok. and what's up with the wah-wah?

[grapefruit]

It would be fine to use 12V instead of 9V in most op amp circuits. Just check that any caps are high enough voltage, and you're not using a single supply op amp that has a max voltage of 10 volts or something. LM741, LM308, LF353, TL072, 4558 will all be fine. The Dist+ *may* sound a bit different.

For the crybaby, or any transistor circuit, the bias may change enough that it won't sound right, so you may have to adjust one or two resistors.

Stew.

[anti-idiot]

For the crybaby, or any transistor circuit, the bias may change enough that it won't sound right, so you may have to adjust one or two resistors.

one or two resistors where? the 22k and the 1k? help... please

[rockgardenlove]

Wah will work fine. 

[anti-idiot]

Wah will work fine. 

are u completely sure? man, if i burn my wah-wah, im gonna... well, i can't no nothing, i live in peru and i don't have any chance of goin to oregon so i can kick your butt if i burn my wah-wah. have u ever tried this?

[rockgardenlove]

I've done it, yep.  If the voltage ratings on your caps are up to snuff, you have nothing to worry about.

[anti-idiot]

I've done it, yep.  If the voltage ratings on your caps are up to snuff, you have nothing to worry about.

and u didnt change anything? cool! also, my wah is about to gounder surgery (GGG mods, LDR and hendrix's extra caps), does your wah have any extra mod? what the difference in the sound? sorry for so much question, but i wanna know everything before i do anything. thank u

[Mark Hammer]

I've used my pedals with a 12v regulated supply for years.  Here is a list of the things you do and don't need to concern yourself with.

• Pedals designed to sound clean will often sound good and sometimes better at 12v than 9v.  Pedals designed to sound dirty will sometimes sound "better" with less than 9v, so they may disappoint with 12v.  OTOH, it is always possible to reduce the supply voltage at the pedal itself, even if the master supply is 12v.
• I can't think of a single non-digital IC that can't take a 12vdc supply.  Even when they do suffer if V+ exceeds 5v, there is inevitably some on-board regulation to bring down the battery voltage to 5v.  And if that regulator can reduce 9v down to 5, it can also reduce 12v down to 5.
• Most commercial pedals will use caps rated high enough to handle 12v comfortably, but you can check just to put your mind at ease.  Just note that there are many applications/locations within the circuit where voltage ratings less than the supply voltage value are NOT a recipe for disaster, but the manufacturer will use the same rating throughout the circuit simply to keep component inventory streamlined (i.e., why have a separate bin of 16v and 25v 10uf caps when 25v ones will do fine everywhere?)
• The Vref used for biasing and establishing a "floating ground" is set by passively dividing the V+ in half.  As such, it is happily "self-adjusted" whenever you change the supply voltage (e.g., as the battery ages).  In some cases, however, the bias voltage for specific devices within the circuit is not so automatically adjusted.  Perfect case in point is the biasing of FETs in a phase-shifter.  In those instances, the biasing is absolute rather than relative (i.e., not a proportion of the supply voltage, but a specific voltage that needs to be set).  One of the reasons why the MN32xx series of delay chips were developed was that they were intended to run off a stable 5v supply.  The regulation of the 9v battery supply down to 5v meant that the bias voltage required for the delay chip to run properly could be set and not need re-adjustment over a wide range of shifting battery voltages.  The corollary of this is that if you are using any pedals with MN30xx chips, you may need to tweak the bias voltage for the delay chip if you plan on using a 12v supply.
• If there is any on-board LED indication of signal level or something similar, that indication may be a bit off.  Typically the displays are produced by comparing the signal against a kind of Vref obtained from the supply voltage.  If that comparison voltage is a bit higher due to a 12v supply, then the indicator LED will come on at the wrong level.  In truth, this doesn't happen all that often, but it can happen.

[dano12]

I've used my pedals with a 12v regulated supply for years.  Here is a list of the things you do and don't need to concern yourself with.

• Pedals designed to sound clean will often sound good and sometimes better at 12v than 9v.  Pedals designed to sound dirty will sometimes sound "better" with less than 9v, so they may disappoint with 12v.  OTOH, it is always possible to reduce the supply voltage at the pedal itself, even if the master supply is 12v.
• I can't think of a single non-digital IC that can't take a 12vdc supply.  Even when they do suffer if V+ exceeds 5v, there is inevitably some on-board regulation to bring down the battery voltage to 5v.  And if that regulator can reduce 9v down to 5, it can also reduce 12v down to 5.
• Most commercial pedals will use caps rated high enough to handle 12v comfortably, but you can check just to put your mind at ease.  Just note that there are many applications/locations within the circuit where voltage ratings less than the supply voltage value are NOT a recipe for disaster, but the manufacturer will use the same rating throughout the circuit simply to keep component inventory streamlined (i.e., why have a separate bin of 16v and 25v 10uf caps when 25v ones will do fine everywhere?)
• The Vref used for biasing and establishing a "floating ground" is set by passively dividing the V+ in half.  As such, it is happily "self-adjusted" whenever you change the supply voltage (e.g., as the battery ages).  In some cases, however, the bias voltage for specific devices within the circuit is not so automatically adjusted.  Perfect case in point is the biasing of FETs in a phase-shifter.  In those instances, the biasing is absolute rather than relative (i.e., not a proportion of the supply voltage, but a specific voltage that needs to be set).  One of the reasons why the MN32xx series of delay chips were developed was that they were intended to run off a stable 5v supply.  The regulation of the 9v battery supply down to 5v meant that the bias voltage required for the delay chip to run properly could be set and not need re-adjustment over a wide range of shifting battery voltages.  The corollary of this is that if you are using any pedals with MN30xx chips, you may need to tweak the bias voltage for the delay chip if you plan on using a 12v supply.
• If there is any on-board LED indication of signal level or something similar, that indication may be a bit off.  Typically the displays are produced by comparing the signal against a kind of Vref obtained from the supply voltage.  If that comparison voltage is a bit higher due to a 12v supply, then the indicator LED will come on at the wrong level.  In truth, this doesn't happen all that often, but it can happen.

Dang! When are you going to write a book? 

[anti-idiot]

I've used my pedals with a 12v regulated supply for years.  Here is a list of the things you do and don't need to concern yourself with.

• Pedals designed to sound clean will often sound good and sometimes better at 12v than 9v.  Pedals designed to sound dirty will sometimes sound "better" with less than 9v, so they may disappoint with 12v.  OTOH, it is always possible to reduce the supply voltage at the pedal itself, even if the master supply is 12v.
• I can't think of a single non-digital IC that can't take a 12vdc supply.  Even when they do suffer if V+ exceeds 5v, there is inevitably some on-board regulation to bring down the battery voltage to 5v.  And if that regulator can reduce 9v down to 5, it can also reduce 12v down to 5.
• Most commercial pedals will use caps rated high enough to handle 12v comfortably, but you can check just to put your mind at ease.  Just note that there are many applications/locations within the circuit where voltage ratings less than the supply voltage value are NOT a recipe for disaster, but the manufacturer will use the same rating throughout the circuit simply to keep component inventory streamlined (i.e., why have a separate bin of 16v and 25v 10uf caps when 25v ones will do fine everywhere?)
• The Vref used for biasing and establishing a "floating ground" is set by passively dividing the V+ in half.  As such, it is happily "self-adjusted" whenever you change the supply voltage (e.g., as the battery ages).  In some cases, however, the bias voltage for specific devices within the circuit is not so automatically adjusted.  Perfect case in point is the biasing of FETs in a phase-shifter.  In those instances, the biasing is absolute rather than relative (i.e., not a proportion of the supply voltage, but a specific voltage that needs to be set).  One of the reasons why the MN32xx series of delay chips were developed was that they were intended to run off a stable 5v supply.  The regulation of the 9v battery supply down to 5v meant that the bias voltage required for the delay chip to run properly could be set and not need re-adjustment over a wide range of shifting battery voltages.  The corollary of this is that if you are using any pedals with MN30xx chips, you may need to tweak the bias voltage for the delay chip if you plan on using a 12v supply.
• If there is any on-board LED indication of signal level or something similar, that indication may be a bit off.  Typically the displays are produced by comparing the signal against a kind of Vref obtained from the supply voltage.  If that comparison voltage is a bit higher due to a 12v supply, then the indicator LED will come on at the wrong level.  In truth, this doesn't happen all that often, but it can happen.

thanks mark and thanks rockgardenlove. just one last question bout the wah... will it sound any diferent? 'cos i'll mod it with a bunch of options: Q (33k + 100k pot), saturation, honk, LDR, sweep range and Jimi Hendrix Wah extra caps.

I'm not (nor will) use any MNXXXX, 'cos i dont use delay, i only use Distortion/Overdrive/Clean and Wah (and maybe, someday, a Talk Box)

Thanx a lot

PS: Mark, you should write a book (DIY Stompboxes For Dummies). Every one of your posts is pretty helpful, and easy to understand (well, most of 'em).