3 knob fuzz or 8?

[trendyironicname]

What would you rather have, a pedal that can only do a couple of things well (but doesn't really have a bad setting) or a pedal that can be tweaked like no-one's business(but has the capacity for just as much garbage as greatness, depending on how you set it)?


I guess, a one trick pony or a 12 trick pony (but you gotta teach the 12 trick pony everything it knows.)

[ACS]

Off the shelf: give me the 12 trick pony - cos then I can play with things until it sounds perfect.  Then superglue everything in place and never touch them again.  Well, not quite, but you get the picture...

Build it myself: less is more because I can do all the same stuff as above on the breadboard, figure out the values I need, then finalise it in hard-wired components and not have to worry about things getting accidentally changed.

In practise, with the exception of delays, once I've found a sound I like on a pedal, I very seldom alter it again.  I just know that if I want hard grind, I hit *that* one, for nice OD I hit *that* one, etc etc.

Maybe I'm just wierd?!

[Timebutt]

I also use the 'use that pedal for that sound, and that pedal for that sound' way of doing things: once I found the sound I like the most out of a pedal, I usually don't change this anymore because I know the sound will be 'available' to me then. Therefor: rather a pedal with only one sound but great sound than a lot of different sounds of 'mediocre' quality, but I guess it depends on preferences etc. so
Also: I don't like the idea of using one pedal to get different sounds, what if you are gigging and need to switch fast between songs and you just can't seem to 'nail' the sound but only get an approximation? Doesn't seem that practical to me but hey

[foxfire]

i would put the 8 knob fuzz into a temporary enclosure and play/practice with it for a bit to see which knobs will actually get used. then get rid of the rest and box it up. rylan

[Mark Hammer]

Depends on what the knobs do.

You can have pedals that metamorphosize to other identities/characters in remarkable ways with only 3 knobs, and you can have pedals where several knobs have to be rotated fully in the other direction just to make it seem like it sounds different.  I'm reminded of the scene in "Ernest Goes to Jail" where the late Jim Varney (as Ernest) goes to his huge walk-in closet with the dry-cleaner-style motorized rack that rotates his "wardrobe" and ponders what to wear that day.  Of course, everything on the rack is a t-shirt, denim vest, and jeans.  In principle, a huge wardrobe, but not a heckuva lot of change from day to day....OR week to week for that matter.

So, it's not how many knob a pedal has, but rather how much they offer the opportunity to:

a) create predictable (and sometimes unpredictable) personality changes in the pedal's sound, and
b) the degree of control they offer in sculpting those alternate personalities into something useful and inspiring.

Sometimes, as EHX found, you can do a lot with one knob and a switch.

[frank_p]

12 knobs * 3 wires  * 2 ends = 72 solders  (+ all the spaghetti)  Ouch.

[dano12]

I'm a big believer in lots of knobs and switches.

1. I get tired of sounds. I want to tweak
2. If I design something for others, I can't assume I know what "sound" they want.
3. I'm a control freak
4. Trimmers are evil--make it a knob.

If I buy commercial stuff, knob count doesn't really matter to me. But when I design something, big knobbage is a requirement.

[frank_p]

But when I design something, big knobbage is a requirement.

Yes, Yes... Dan.  I was just thingking of your beast when I wrote my comment. 

[dano12]

But when I design something, big knobbage is a requirement.

Yes, Yes... Dan.  I was just thingking of your beast when I wrote my comment. 

I'm working on Son of FuzzLab now, the Armageddon Processor:

[Mark Hammer]

Not to take anything away from your rather striking achievements, but folks should be aware that the red monstrosity with 4 meters is, in fact (and correct me here if I am way off), four separate circuits with individual parametric controls, and not one single distortion with all those knobs and switches to alter parameters of a single circuit.  It is a "workstation" or multi-effect, not a single pedal.  The "in-progress" knob matrix would also appear to be a multi-effect unit with a bunch of patchable "modules".  Me likey, but again, it's not to be confused with a single circuit that has somehow taken Zachary Vex's idea of the 5-knob fuzz to near-psychotic levels.

[frank_p]

Me likey, but again, it's not to be confused with a single circuit that has somehow taken Zachary Vex's idea of the 5-knob fuzz to near-psychotic levels.

Mark, you have bad influence ! Dan is already on a maniac phase.  If you lay down tracks for expansion in his illness, I'm sure he'll hit an irreversible schizophrenia stage.      (Hope he is not already there.  )

[dano12]

Not to take anything away from your rather striking achievements, but folks should be aware that the red monstrosity with 4 meters is, in fact (and correct me here if I am way off), four separate circuits with individual parametric controls, and not one single distortion with all those knobs and switches to alter parameters of a single circuit.  It is a "workstation" or multi-effect, not a single pedal.  The "in-progress" knob matrix would also appear to be a multi-effect unit with a bunch of patchable "modules".  Me likey, but again, it's not to be confused with a single circuit that has somehow taken Zachary Vex's idea of the 5-knob fuzz to near-psychotic levels.

No offense taken, and as usual, spot on.

The fuzzLab was the first real DIY thing I built. After a few BYOC kits and some simple mods I was hooked. The next logical step was to build the fuzzLab....well, logical to me anyway. It is essentially five different effects in one box. In fact, on the back are distinct in/out jacks for each effect, my poor man's attempt at user-configurable effect order. I look back on that now as child's play, but when I was building it, it was very very hard. Just the implementation of five "stompboxes" sharing a single power supply were like particle physics to me. I remember one of my first posts here was about a voltage 'sag' control, and the responses along with overall incredible wealth of knowledge here really helped in getting me over the hump.

Similarly, the Armageddon Processor is distinct effects. But the challenge on this one was to design, as much as possible, my own modules. The input buffer and distribution amp, several of the fuzzes, the 555 and 567-based modulators, the opto/wah-tremolo, and the mixer at the end are all things I tried to build from scratch, with often heavy borrowing of others ideas and contributions. Like the fuzzLab two years ago, the Armageddon Processor is an exercise in challenging myself to do something great/stupid because that's how I learn best. (You should see the big cardboard box of failures that have ocurred during prototyping this beast...

At the same time, I'm learning one of the lessons that I think you mentioned--making a single circuit with lots of usuable controls is not an easy task. I'm working on fuzzLab Jr. now, with a goal of making a single fuzz circuit that is as controllable as possible. It is fun and enlightening to approach different problems in different ways.

Anyway, I'm rambling now, but thanks for the feedback and ideas. I hope to always be thought of as 'that insane guy'...

<edit: here's a pix of the proto fuzzLab Jr. A fuzz factory only has five knobs. Mine has 10 knobs and two switches. >

[puretube]

I love PolyKnobby... 

[culturejam]

What would you rather have, a pedal that can only do a couple of things well (but doesn't really have a bad setting) or a pedal that can be tweaked like no-one's business(but has the capacity for just as much garbage as greatness, depending on how you set it)?

Sounds like you're asking if I'd rather have a Fuzz Face or a Fuzz Factory. 

I like them both, but if I could have just one, I'd probably go with the more simple option...at least in the long run. I like to have something for *right now* that's a test pad, but ultimately I'm not going to need 8 knobs.

But thank the Maker we don't have to choose one or the other.  I've got a 5-knob Rat on the bench right now! 

[trendyironicname]

holy heck.  those are freaking awesome.  i'm playing around in my head about a couple of things and I have so many trimpots on my breadboards because I'm trying to actually learn what every little thing is doing as far as to the sound and playing around with a whole lot of tonestacks and those, "what if i do this?" shots in the dark. You know, no real knowledge on how this will affect anything but lets try it here, here and here.  Came up with some things I like and a WHOLE heck of alot of uselessness but I was trying to decide if I wanted to take all the things I like, hardwire it per pedal or if I should build a more generic but more moldable circuit, make a few of those and set them differently as the need comes.  On asthetic, I love, love, love knobs, switches, blinky lights. I guess it makes me feel smarter to make these. On a giging side, I absolutely hate knobs of any kind.  But then again, if i get a new amp, I don't want to have to throw out a good pedal because it's rendered useless. 

[frank_p]

I'm trying to actually learn what every little thing is doing as far as to the sound and playing around with a whole lot of tonestacks and those, "what if i do this?" shots in the dark. You know, no real knowledge on how this will affect anything but lets try it here, here and here.  Came up with some things I like and a WHOLE heck of alot of uselessness but I was trying to decide if I wanted to take all the things I like, hardwire it per pedal or if I should build a more generic but more moldable circuit, make a few of those and set them differently as the need comes.

Experiment, listen and try to grab some useful knowledge about electronics.  Putting out a good souding device with experimentation is a good thing. But relating all that stuff as to understanding more about electronics is a REAL reward.     

[Dragonfly]

[frank_p]

Is that science or Zen masterpiece ? 

[petemoore]

  Does the guitar volume count ?

[trendyironicname]

If it weren't for the fact that it's the only way I can get a decent tone for my neck pickup.  Guess I could do the same thing with a cap between it and the switch but eh.