worst commercial stompbox design

[ayayay!]

No one for the Ibanez Tube King?  "Let's reverse the jacks!  That'll frustrate 'em!"



Ten years later:  

Mr. Ibanez:  "Did you fix that boys?"  

Nugs:  "Sure did boss!  We just made 30,000 of them, and turned 45 degrees cause we thought...."

Mr. Ibanez:  "WHAT!!?!?!?!?!?"



(And I know, there is no Mr. Ibanez)

[knealebrown]

What is good, bad?

honestly guys, can we stop being so pedantic for once? i understand the words good and bad are merely subjective when applied to a 'what is the best 'x' pedal' type of question. But i was just asking 'are there any pedals out there that have something that could have been easily changed at the design stage that gets you shouting WHY???'

heres another of my 'pedal gripes', no blend control on the small clone. At minimum thats A LOT of chorus 

[knealebrown]

I don't disagree with you, but I think the point of this thread is less "what is bad/good design" and more "what bugs you about specific commercial pedals."

We all need to realize why pedals out there suck, but I really dislike how marketing has taken place over good design.

Jacob

yeah thats exactly what i was getting at, like why dont Roland just put the blues driver mods in as standard now? if it makes the pedal so much 'better' then it is worth it for the few .01cents it would cost them to up the specs.....what? like the need the extra profit now? pfffft! they pretty much have a captive audience.......and im one of them. 

[MattXIV]

I don't own one, but Morley wah pedals. They are GIGANTIC!

And their volume pedals - and it has a gigantic board too (especially considering it's a pretty simple circuit), which I'm guessing is used to facilitate the use of jacks connected on the board, which in turn tend to be prone to breaking either the jack or board.

My favorite feature that looks cool until you think about it is the indicator LEDs on the snarling dogs wahs being placed right in the middle of the place where you put your foot.  So pretty to look at but so very useless.

[knealebrown]

My favorite feature that looks cool until you think about it is the indicator LEDs on the snarling dogs wahs being placed right in the middle of the place where you put your foot.  So pretty to look at but so very useless.

urgh and the erogenous moan reverse tape simulator pedal........what a waste of time, it doesnt even work

[tiges_ tendres]

On the boss super feedbacker/Distortion, using the dual purpose switch is really clumbersome. I once watched a guy almost fall over because it was so difficult to balance on one foot whilst trying to gently activate the feedback function, and keep it depressed to get the effect.  Once activated, you have to gingerly leave your foot in the exact position, otherwise the feedback will either drop out, or the pedal will shut off.

Contrasting that, the Line 6 Tone Core pedals were much more rugged.  There is very little chance to accidentally switch off the pedal whilst using the tap function.

[R.G.]

So have we all figured out yet that "What's the best/worst/most/least/....?" questions produce at least one opinion per person, several arguments, and very little of real substance? 

[rosscocean]

I got a double muff a couple of months ago and I can't imagine my pedal board without it now but why didn't they put a stomp for the double / single funtion?! An what is the power supply???!
All stompboxes should be 9v neg tip! ;-)

[jkokura]

So have we all figured out yet that "What's the best/worst/most/least/....?" questions produce at least one opinion per person, several arguments, and very little of real substance? 

Oh yes. But what I appreciate and like participating in when doing these threads is to point people towards bad design ideas that we should avoid when building our own pedals, and also towards good ideas. For instance, the fellow who gravitated to the random idea of putting jacks anywhere other than the sides (bottom or top really). That guy appreciates this thread, and it's given me some laughs (like the Ibanez post).

Jacob

[Taylor]

Yeah, it's true that everybody's opinion is different, but that doesn't mean nobody's opinion matters. I think these threads are interesting anyway. I think maybe if it was called "what are some design ideas that you don't like?" it could perhaps have fewer detractors.

In most design "flaws", there's a compromise in there. For example, Jacob, most of my pedals have side jacks. I think most people will agree that top jacks are better than side jacks in the same box, but the real problem is that most of the time using top jacks requires going up to a bigger box. So the question becomes, do I want a 125b with side jacks, or a 1590bb with top jacks? I've opted for the former, just under the assumption that most people would rather a smaller box, even if it means side jacks (and even though it can mean precisely the same horizontal space used on a board, once the jacks are taken into account). The 125b is available in a polished box, which I use without a finish. The 1590bb is not available polished, which means it needs paint. So in this case the choice of where to put the jacks isn't an isolated decision, but actually impacts not only the box size but also the finish.

That's the beauty of DIY, you can do whatever you want, down to the smallest detail. The problems arise when you try to build something for other people and you have to try to balance all these different perspectives, and all these people using your stuff in different situations and with different things plugging into it. There's always going to be something that displeases everyone, which I think is where RG is coming from. Especially since he's a part of a large company (relative to most of us) I'm sure he's heard tons of complaints like these, and they can be very informative, but also you just can't fix each person's concern without creating a new one for somebody else.

[sean k]

I just bought a Marshall reverberator for less than half price on our version of ebay, which I've yet to recieve, but I tried one at the shop before I bought and found the reviews had a point where the signal out cannot be totally wet. It should be easy enough to remedy, well I hope it is, but it would have been easy enough to put in a pot that allowed mix, mix, mix (as we turn) and full wet right at the end. It's almost as if they wanted an amp model without realising pedals can be different from amps...

And I wish my DD-7 had the options of tails or no tails. At the moment it's tails so I have to cut the feedback right back even when I bypass it but I'd like the option to be able to go to no tails and just hit it and have all the squeely feedback disappear.

[philbinator1]

good points there, Taylor.  Yeah, my last project was side jacks, but i'm gonna try top jacks just cos i've never done it that way before.  also i think if your dc jack is on top, then it's good to have the other jacks next to it - give it some protection once the leads are plugged in.  i've had at least 3 pedals die because of the adaptor plug getting smashed to the side by some drunk patron or other.   

[DougH]

So have we all figured out yet that "What's the best/worst/most/least/....?" questions produce at least one opinion per person, several arguments, and very little of real substance? 

This beats the typical "What's the best overdrive?" thread by a mile. 

[Ronsonic]

What is good, bad?

honestly guys, can we stop being so pedantic for once?

heres another of my 'pedal gripes', no blend control on the small clone. At minimum thats A LOT of chorus 

Thanks for the reminder, let's have some fun.

Worst? It's a tie between all the muddy, buzzy, blurry useless piles of crap that are called "Metal" pedals. They're all useless. Except for the ones that are misnamed because the Mfr thought "metal" was a cool word and might sell more mild overdrives.

[Paul Marossy]

So have we all figured out yet that "What's the best/worst/most/least/....?" questions produce at least one opinion per person, several arguments, and very little of real substance? 

I think you can make a valid argument for keeping the physical size of your product reasonable. I would never ever buy some things just because they are so freaking huge. I'm not going to buy something that would take up 25% of my pedal board, or require me to double the size of my pedal board just so I could have it on there.

Some Morley and EH products are great examples of this. They could be made much more compact than they are. I think EH is catching on to this, thank goodness.

[MikeH]

So have we all figured out yet that "What's the best/worst/most/least/....?" questions produce at least one opinion per person, several arguments, and very little of real substance? 

This beats the typical "What's the best overdrive?" thread by a mile. 

It rings true; Opinions are like... well, you know- everybody has one.

Not to derail- but what is the best OD? 

[dschwartz]

Well, is not a stompbox design, but i think the 4 TDA7293 power section of the marshall mode four is poorly designed. those poor chips work at the limit of their capacity (maybe even beyond) and if one blows, it blows the other 3 ...yikes!

On pedals, i wouldn´t say that the boss metalizer is really bad, but is pretty lousy for the amount of parts it has.

I also don´t like danelectro pedals designs..they look too cheap, almost like those fake chinese made spiderman action figures you can buy for a buck., even behringer plastic pedals look refined beside them.

[jkokura]

Some Morley and EH products are great examples of this. They could be made much more compact than they are. I think EH is catching on to this, thank goodness.

I'm quite impressed with EH's XO series pedals. They seem about the same size as a 1790NS, which is great. I think the largest is no bigger than a 1590DD, which is even better.

I agree about the real estate usage of pedals. There's little point to me in giving a lot of space to just one effect. For instance, the HOG from EH. I haven't played with one, but I've been told that they're best used with the extension pedal, meaning that for one effect you need to give pedal board space for the HOG (at least the size of a 1590DD) and the extension (1790NSish) - that's a LOT of space for one effect. If you really rely on it for your sound, and don't need much else, you can get away with it, but I can only imagine the weight of that pedal board.

Personally, I'm trying to go more and more minimal in my setups. I used to exclusively use large boards with all my effects on it. I'd have up to 12 or 13 pedals on my board all the time. I recently got a pedaltrain Jr, and along with my tuner, DI and Volume Pedal it leaves me space for only 3 to 5 pedals depending on the size. I'm thinking about getting a Mini so as to force myself to minimize even farther!

I'll keep the PP2 for when I'm jonesing for a lot of effect stacking, but I'd rather have the stable of 20 or so reliable pedals to choose from when setting up for a gig and only taking 4 or 5 of them.

To me, good design is - utilizing a enclosure that suits the contents (not too big, not too small), ensuring the orientation and accessibility of the enclosure works (jacks on top, horizontal or parallel orientation), and making sure it plays nicely with others (true bypass, no grounding issues, etc.). If a pedal has good design, people will want to use it. I have little desire to use a pedal that takes up more room and makes my wiring more difficult when I can use another pedal that leaves me more space and 'plays' better with others.

Oh, and the best OD has to be the Tubescreamer. I've tried so many and I keep coming back. I've ordered a bunch of others to try and building and have some hope - I'd like to try a zendrive, and an eternity (burst values), and I'll buy a Timmy or Tim one of these days. But I've been told they're (apart from the timmy) all derivatives of the TS anyway. That could be wrong, but I'd really love to see an overdrive that I like more than the Tubescreamer that isn't based on the tubescreamer in some way! I haven't yet.

Jacob

[Paul Marossy]

Personally, I'm trying to go more and more minimal in my setups. I used to exclusively use large boards with all my effects on it. I'd have up to 12 or 13 pedals on my board all the time. I recently got a pedaltrain Jr, and along with my tuner, DI and Volume Pedal it leaves me space for only 3 to 5 pedals depending on the size. I'm thinking about getting a Mini so as to force myself to minimize even farther!

I'm at the exact same place. I find that I only use a few pedals consistently, so there's really no use for me to carry around a large pedal board for that. I still have my older, larger pedalboard but it rarely gets used anymore.

I guess my point is that some pedals out there are too large for me to consider practical as far as using them outside of my four walls. That doesn't necessarily make it a bad design, but it is bad if no one buys your product because the first thing they think of it that they can't make that work with their pedal board. That's great if it does amazing things, is reliable, looks cool, is well designed electronically, etc., but if it won't fit on my pedal board without making huge sacrifices, it's not even up for consideration for me.

[DougH]

I agree about the real estate usage of pedals. There's little point to me in giving a lot of space to just one effect. For instance, the HOG from EH. I haven't played with one, but I've been told that they're best used with the extension pedal, meaning that for one effect you need to give pedal board space for the HOG (at least the size of a 1590DD) and the extension (1790NSish) - that's a LOT of space for one effect. If you really rely on it for your sound, and don't need much else, you can get away with it, but I can only imagine the weight of that pedal board.

I put my HOG on a separate pedal board I built into an instrument case. When I was gigging, if I needed it I brought it, otherwise I left it at home. That case is pretty small by itself, and since I didn't always need it, it saved pedalboard space and weight to keep it separate.